Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?
This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.
Are they bad enough?
A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:
- Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
- The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
- The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)
Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:42:49 AM
Ninja Gamer Writer
Who you gonna call?
It took a bit longer than I had hoped to get this out, but it is here now. I have also agreed to let Bullman do the write up for this character afterward. Prolly better that way as I might not find the time to get that done myself.
What's The Work?
Ghostbusters: Frozen Empire is a sequel to Ghostbusters: Afterlife and the fourth entry in the original continuity that focuses on the new generation team trying to get settled into their role as ghostbusters while having to deal with a dangerous evil alongside the original group.
Who is Garraka? What Does He Do?
Long ago, Garraka was summoned by a greedy king who wished to rule over a land. With Garraka's help, the king was able to succeed in taking control. However, Garraka's actions made the king realize it would only be a matter of time before Garraka's power would be used against him, so he ripped Garraka's horns off in an attempt to depower the beast. Angered by this betrayal, Garraka swore to freeze all of humanity to death and he showed to still be very powerful even without his horns as he laid waste to a lot of the land he helped conquer. This eventually led to him being sealed away where he was safely locked away by the flame masters.
In the current day, the last of the Flame Masters (who doesn't even know of his heritage), finds the orb that Garraka is imprisoned in and decides to sell it for some quick money. This proves to be a big mistake as thanks to the orb no longer being in the tomb, Garraka's power begins to leak out and cause mayhem. Garraka even frees the Possessor who starts causing chaos and even attempts to get a tape to free Garraka. When that fails, Garraka manipulates a ghost girl named Melody, claiming he can help her pass on and reunite with her family in the afterlife (he actually can't as later pointed out, thus he is lying).
With this, he gets Melody to trick Phoebe into separating her spirit from her body, allowing him to possess her and force her to say the incantation, freeing him from his prison. Afterward, he immediately hunts down the last flame master. He ends up getting the wrong guy, but he still kills the poor fella in a very gruesome manner. After that, he heads toward the ghostbusters base to free all of the ghosts they had imprisoned in order to form an army to wipe out all of humanity.
While Melody continues to help him as she believes he will help her, Phoebe convinces her that she has to help herself and not rely on Garraka. Not that it matters, as Garraka manages to break the container and freeze the entire ghostbusters crew... even if only temporary. Taking Phoebe's words to heart, Melody manages to light a match which she uses to help Nadeem use his fire powers to turn the tables on Garraka, even saving the ghostbusters from freezing to death. Of course, with a monster as powerful as Garraka, they needed a prison that was equally powerful to hold him. Fortunately, Garraka ended up providing up due to his freeing of the ghost, making the old ghost chamber vacant enough to hold him.
And thus, Garraka is imprisoned once more. Hopefully for good.
Heinous Standards
You know what is necessary. We can't say right away that Garraka truly stands out without comparing him to, who else, Gozer. In terms of resources and intentions, the two are pretty similar. Both are powerful godlike supernatural evil beings, both had full intention on wiping out all of humanity, and both possess people in order to break free of their prisons. So it seems like Garraka is just like Gozer in resources and actions, right (with potential argument of Garraka having a little more resources)? Well, the key difference between them is methods. Gozer had to rely on their underlings Zuul and Vinz to possess two mortal beings to free them. Garraka had to manipulate a ghost into befriending a human and tricking said human into separating their soul from their body so that he could possess them into chanting the incantation to release him.
Not just that, but while both intended to kill all of humanity, Gozer opted to have humanity decide how they would die (which ended up being Stay Puft Marshmallow man thanks to Ray) and made intent of just quickly killing them in Afterlife. Garraka, on the other hand, had full intent on freezing all of humanity to death and is even actually shown killing people (even if Gozer is an Omnicidal Maniac, I don't recall any onscreen deaths caused by Gozer directly aside from Egon and Ivo Shandor in Afterlife, and even then that is two deaths compared to the much higher number that Garraka is shown onscreen to do).
We even get an onscreen backstory for Garraka. It's in a book presented to the heroes, but said backstory is in murals that give a good detail on his actions in the past. As such, Garraka very much stands out in my opinion.
Mitigating Factors
Does Garraka display any redeeming qualities? Nope! The dude lies to Melody that he would help her reunite with her family (which as Phoebe rightfully points out, he can't and that Melody has to do that herself). He also clearly doesn't care for any other ghosts as it is made clear through how he controls Phoebe's spirit that ghosts aren't obeying him willingly, he is forcing them to bend to his whims. Alright, You guys might be thinking "But he was betrayed, wasn't he? That means he has a freudian excuse." Here's the thing. The king's reason for betraying him didn't stem from no longer needing him, but actually fearing his power showing that even the king realized he was playing with fire. Not just that, but Garraka had initially helped said king in conquering lands which definitely lead to death due to his powers. In other words, Garraka was already evil before this betrayal. Also his desire to kill all humans is due to one human betraying him for somewhat understandable reasons (I say somewhat because the dude should have realized beforehand that summoning a powerful and dangerous entity was a bad idea).
Is Garraka too comedic? Nope! I'll be honest here. None of Garraka's appearances are played for laughs in any way. Him mistaking a drug store owner for the Flame Master is also played for horror as he is quick to kill the poor fella before moving on. Nothing funny about this guy. Actions are completely serious.
Is Garraka Made of Evil? Honestly, nothing that I saw indicated Garraka to genuinely being incapable of doing anything but evil (one hero calling him an embodiment of evil isn't enough to say he is made of evil as said character was clearly stating it because of how horrible Garraka is). His backstory doesn't say he is made of evil either.
So no redeeming qualities, no moral agency issues, and all humor is dropped whenever he is present to show how serious he is.
Verdict
Gonna go ![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Garraka.
Edited by Zerukin on Apr 13th 2024 at 4:39:10 AM
Not the Eye
A coupla mammals makin' gravy
Yeah, I've seen the movie, and I think I'm okay saying yes to Garraka. I guess the only thing you can say in his defense is that he was betrayed first, but then his revenge is beyond disproportionate.
Now we're cookin'! While nobody's lookin'! We're family! Culinarily!
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Sure to Garrakka
REALITY IS AN ILLUSION, THE UNIVERSE IS A HOLOGRAM, BUY GOLD BYEEEE! | She/Her
for Garraka.
Garraka.
Insert title here
Ultimate Moral Compass
Garraka
A Girl, Just One of Many Kinds
yes yes yes to Garraka!
Keep Fighting. Keep Loving.
Just a starting content creator
Very easy yes to Garraka. (Sorry, been busy.)
Check out my YouTube channel! I make audiobooks and whatever else I feel like!
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Garraka's betrayal nags at me; was he EVIL beforehand, or was the king just an idiot? Disproportionate Retribution does not necessarily always a CM make.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
A Child from the Stars
Just a starting content creator
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
He was specifically helping the king takeover territories by killing the competition. So, yes, he was already evil. Zerukin specifically mentioned this in the effortpost.
Edited by AmateurStorytime on Apr 13th 2024 at 5:16:40 AM
Check out my YouTube channel! I make audiobooks and whatever else I feel like!
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If that's the case, I'll lean yes.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
King of the Koopas
I read through the first volume of spider man chronicles and there is no evidence that states Doctor Octopus’s moral compass was compromised or have no idea what he was doing is wrong.
The Ultimate Incarnation of Evil
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
Garra
A coupla mammals makin' gravy
I have a Cthulhu Mythos keeper for us! From 2011's Downward into Darkness by Brian McNaughton...
What has Mordred Glendower done?
- The distant ancestor of the main character, a 15-year-old dweeb named Patrick Laughlin, Mordred is an evil sorcerer whose name has mostly faded into legend. But the evil tale of Mordred is no ghost story. Mordred is very real, and he's found himself a horrible form of prolonging his own life.
- Taking a page out of the handbook of Croesus Verlac, Mordred has corrupted his entire bloodline into incest to ensure they stay under his control. Mordred's modus operandi is to bodyjack his male descendants, use their bodies to rape his female descendants, then bodyjack the resultant baby so he can repeat the process on the succeeding generation.
- Oh, and as a cherry on top of the incest sundae, the dark ritual needed to transfer his spirit requires that he cannibalize a living infant. So whenever Mordred needs to perform the ritual, babies disappear from their cribs, only for their half-eaten corpses to be discovered some time later…
- Mordred has lived this way—bodyjacking grandsons, impregnating granddaughters, eating babies—for no less than four centuries by the time his spirit begins to reincarnate in the body of his latest descendant: Patrick Laughlin. Patrick soon begins exhibiting odd behavior, which includes suddenly developing unwanted lustful feelings toward his own mother, Rose…who, as a previous victim of Mordred's incest chain, disturbingly begins to reciprocate his desires…
- By the time Patrick's father Frank starts to piece together what's going on, Mordred has almost fully taken over Patrick's body, sequestering Patrick's conscious mind into a tiny, helpless corner of his brain where he can do nothing but watch as Mordred starts torturing and raping innocents.
- Mordred begins by unearthing the deformed, burnt body of his daughter from generations before, named Mirdath. Mirdath is in constant agony and hunger from the second she's brought back to life, begging her father to let her return to the grave. Mordred instead takes a baseball bat and starts beating Mirdath into a bloody pulp with it. See, Mirdath is an even more learned sorceress than Mordred. While Mordred knows the first Word in the Ten that comprise the Litany of Hastur—dark incantations, the least of which are capable of driving people into madness-induced comas—Mirdath knows the other nine Words, which Mordred wants to learn no matter what. And even though she's capable of destroying her evil father on the spot with this kind of power, she doesn't resist him even as Mordred beats her over and over again with the bat, out of filial devotion to him.
- Mordred begins by raping Patrick's high-school crush, Shana Jennings, before feeding her to be horrifically consumed by Mirdath, who is too weak to resist her Horror Hunger. Mordred next feeds the Laughlins' family friend Rupert to Mirdath, then decides next on feeding Frank Laughlin to her. This causes Patrick to start Fighting from the Inside, so much so that Mordred decides to opt against it. Nah…he just forces Patrick to lure over another highschool friend of hers, Amy, as well as Amy's mother, intending to feed the latter to Mirdath and rape the former (musing as well that he'll likely turn Amy over to Mirdath when he tires of violating her).
- Finally, though, Mirdath chafes beneath his abuse. And when he tries to subdue her with the first Word of Hastur, and overpowers him with the even nastier second Word…and she devours him, Patrick and all.
- "In his four hundred years of life, whatever good qualities he might have possessed had atrophied, leaving nothing but a vacuum of selfishness that demanded instant gratification."
- That's about the size of it.
- Mordred is as pure a keep as you can get in a Mythos tale. Infant cannibalism, driving his entire family line to incestuous rape for four centuries, serial rape and murder of God-knows how many innocent people?
Edited by Starkrafty on Apr 13th 2024 at 7:15:01 AM
Now we're cookin'! While nobody's lookin'! We're family! Culinarily!
The Draftsman of Doom
Yes to Mordred.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Ultimate Moral Compass
More Dread
Mordred
Mordred.
Yeah, I think I'm going to play it safe and just say no to fic!Ock.
Now we're cookin'! While nobody's lookin'! We're family! Culinarily!