South Park Cleanup

I found Heidi's plot rather disappointing. Just when it got really interesting, they pushed the reset button on her. But yeah, haven't seen much divisiveness on her.

Optimism is a duty.

Generally agree with your points, Mewtron. I also don't think Heidi gets hated on much, even by shippers.

I deleted the Heidi and Goth examples.

Anyone want to take a look at the Never Live It Down examples on YMMV.South Park?

Sure.

• Wendy shooting Ms. Ellen into the sun: Wendy is a contentious character and some of her haters do hold this against her, though I've also seen a few who preferred this characterization of her. I don't read much fic that depicts Wendy as this insane, but I'm sure it exists.
  • Kissing Cartman: Given that this is the entire basis of the fairly popular Cartman/Wendy ship, despite the episode making it clear that they're not really a long term thing and never depicting them in a shippy light again, I think this can count.
• Sheila in the movie: I'd call into question the idea that Sheila has entirely mellowed out as she was still depicted as a terror in Season 20, and most fanworks I see depict her as angry but not as sadistic as she was in the movie. I don't see a lot of fan content of Sheila, though, so maybe there have been fans that exaggerate her to be constantly as cruel as she was in the movie.
• Kenny dying: Kenny's deaths have phased out but they still occur every now and then. Is the show really still known best for this? I think nowadays it's more known for its political satire than anything and the Kenny thing is a Stock Parody Joke at worst. I think most parodies focused on the Kenny thing when it still was a constant Running Gag.
• Cartman's Ho Yay: If it's "every time Cartman has Ho Yay" then it's probably not enough to be a single moment that gets exaggerated. Cartman has a sizable amount of gay jokes going for him.
  • Cartman's attracted to girls: This one's even dumber. Cartman had an entire relationship plotline with a girl that the entry brushes off as if it was nothing. It became incredibly unhealthy but it's present enough that claiming Cartman likes girls isn't something exaggerated by fans.
• Cartman's treatment of Heidi: I tried to fix this entry by pointing out how fans make Cartman the sole problem, which kinda goes against the message at the end of the season, but I still don't think it's an exaggerated enough perception. Cartman is very obviously abusive to the point he leaves Heidi for dead because she took too long to get dressed. Even if Heidi mimicking his behavior was shitty, Cartman's still the main problem and he's never atoned for his treatment of Heidi (in fact he still vaguely badmouths her in Season 23).
• Kyle nuking Canada: I'd probably keep this. Kyle gets made out by some fans as genocidal towards Canada when he didn't want Canada to be nuked. I don't know if fans make Kyle's entire personality revolve around this, but it's definitely a reason people claim he's as bad as Cartman.
• Kyle laughing at Cartman: Keep. People clung to this as a means to just totally vilify Kyle in the episode, acting as if Kyle laughing about Cartman's HIV after all the shit Cartman's done to Kyle is enough to justify Cartman willingly infecting Cartman with HIV. Yes, Kyle's kind of a hypocrite in the episode, but in the context of South Park especially, it's not on the level of Cartman's actions as some people may claim. I think Kyle in general just gets subjected to Ron the Death Eater and maybe that would better cover some of these moments.
• Kyle kicking Ike: I'd say this can stay, as a lot of fanart still depicts Kyle as kicking Ike around like in the first few seasons, despite the canon skewing towards Kyle having a Big Brother Instinct. I don't know how many fans subscribe to the idea that Kyle hates his brother or doesn't consider him his brother at all, though.
• Bullying Butters: IDK, I see more fan content where all the boys are friends with Butters. I think they're still more rude to him in canon than they are in fanon.
• Stan's alcoholism: I actually added this entry and I think it counts. Stan is depicted as The Alcoholic (or at least with a beer in hand) in a lot of angsty fanfics and fanart because of this one episode, but no other episode has really followed up on it. He has addictive tendencies but his video game addiction is not used for drama in fanfics the same way his alcoholism is. Some works make him more alcoholic than Randy, whose personality is heavily influenced by alcoholism.

Edited by mightymewtron on May 17th 2021 at 9:24:55 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

There's plenty of natter and complaining in the Western Animation folder of Filibuster Freefall:

• South Park's creators Trey Parker and Matt Stone have always been known as fairly staunch libertarians politically and philosophically, but sometime in the '10s, political commentary began to take over the show. The tipping point for many viewers was season 19, which was built around a season-long Story Arc about Political Correctness Gone Mad (personified by the school's new principal) taking over the town, and which split the fanbase right down the middle. On top of the debates over whether or not the switch to a story arc (versus previous seasons' Negative Continuity and gag-a-day humor) was a good or a bad thing, some fans declared that Stone and Parker, after years of being the countercultural voice of Generation X, had finally 'gotten old' and were doing little more than ranting at the politics of the millennial generation, while other fans loved season 19 for precisely that reason. Season 20 got hit even worse, as in that case, they had to hastily rewrite the arc they'd spent a whole season building up when real life wrote the plot.^note The story they had planned hinged on Hillary Rodham Clinton winning the 2016 election, as most people predicted she'd do. When Donald Trump won instead, all of that was thrown up in the air. Parker and Stone themselves would eventually conclude that the greater focus on political humor had sent the show astray, with season 21 notably containing far less on it.

Kirby is awesome.

I don't see the natter at all, just bloat. Complaining, maybe, but it fits within the context of the trope. My main problem is that it implies the series didn't get exceedingly political or full of social commentary until season 19, which is... so blatantly untrue given their social and political commentary was infamous for years, "Cartoon Wars" being one notable Author Filibuster. They also haven't really had Negative Continuity since around season 6 as the one real element of Negative Continuity (Kenny's death) was eventually given a reason that fits most continuity. I also don't know if the "gag-a-day" description is accurate — they're looking for the word "episodic."

We could definitely de-bloat it to be less focused on these specific seasons and maybe more clear about the "filibuster" part.

Edited by mightymewtron on May 17th 2021 at 10:35:07 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Yeah, that's not Natter, that's Word Cruft.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

• Wendy shooting Ms. Ellen into the sun: Keep.
  • Wendy kissing Cartman: Keep.
• Shelia in the movie: I haven't watched Season 20 in a long time because of how bad it was, but wasn't the worst thing she did in that season get really angry at Ike and Kyle for running out of their house? Also, I'm pretty sure the entry is referring to how she "mellowed out" in the sense that she's no longer a Well-Intentioned Extremist who goes on moral crusades. Did she ever go on such a crusade after the movie? If not, I think we should keep it; if so, cut it. By the way, she has a Took a Level in Kindness entry on Characters.South Park Family Members.
• Kenny's Deaths: Never Live It Down only applies to characters, not the works themselves. "The show is best known for Kenny's deaths" can't qualify by the trope's definition. The example seems to refer to multiple moments anyway, so I'm inclined to cut since NLID is about one moment.
• Cartman's Ho Yay: Cut for being about multiple moments instead of being about a single one.
  • Cartman's attracted to girls: Cut.
• Cartman's treatment of Heidi: I don't think it's exaggerated either. Cut.
• Kyle nuking Canada: Keep.
• Kyle laughing at Cartman: Keep.
• Kyle kicking Ike: Kyle kicked Ike in several episodes, but Never Live It Down is about a single moment. This would be eligible if Kyle only kicked Ike once, but since he didn't, cut.
• Bullying Butters: Cut.
• Stan's alcoholism: Keep.

In the movie, Sheila goes on a crusade against crude television, centring on Terrence and Philip, starting a war against Canada, and personally executes Terrence and Philip, causing the rise of Satan. Uh, and Saddam Hussein, because that was a thing back then.

She does seem to have mellowed out considerably from that, at least.

Edited by Redmess on May 19th 2021 at 10:43:15 AM

Optimism is a duty.

But Kyle really loves his brother and regard him as true family

This section shouldn’t be cut.

The point is that it's not a single moment and thus isn't exaggerated in the way the item requires. If Kyle is generally exaggerated to be worse in fanon, that better fits the item Ron the Death Eater.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Oh, so can we add a Ron the Death Eater section to the YMMV page?

I'll try to write an entry up.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

I was reading HilariousInHindsight.South Park and found this. I've bolded the stuff that's important.

Did Matt and Trey actually say this? If they didn't, we should cut it.

All I could find was stuff about them disliking Force Awakens and even that seems to skew more towards So Okay, It's Average. There might be other commentary stuff I missed though.

Edited by mightymewtron on May 23rd 2021 at 8:14:00 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Can we PM the troper who added that?

Optimism is a duty.

This entry for UnbuiltTrope.Western Animation feels gushy in a misleading way:

• South Park is almost single-handedly responsible for creating the extremely vulgar, audacious and line-crossing brand of humor that's become almost synonymous with Animated Shock Comedy. But unlike many of its imitators, the show's humor relies heavily on satire; while sexual and scatological humor is frequently featured, it's not the sole type of comedy in the show, or even the primary one.

I disagree that Vulgar Humor is not the primary source of comedy for the show. I can think of several episodes that were vulgar but not strongly satirical ("Woodland Critters Christmas" comes to mind — it's a parody of Christmas stories but not really satire), and even if you broaden it to include any instance of "kids being edgy and Americans being idiots" as social satire, not only does most of the satire still involve vulgar humor (because they're far from mutually exclusive), but couldn't you argue that many of its imitators are also social satire, as they have trends like that too?

If SP did anything that qualifies for Unbuilt Trope, it's exploring the issues with Moral Guardians trying to censor Animated Shock Comedy.

Edited by mightymewtron on Aug 5th 2021 at 6:30:28 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Maybe a rewrite is in order then.

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall

South Park: Post Covid:

• Take That!: Jimmy complaining about what jokes he can and can't tell is an obvious potshot at comedians who think they can't say anything and only want to resort to cheap stereotype jokes because they don't know much else and then complain about "cancel culture".

~H Barnill, as much as I do like this interpretation, I don't think that's what they're going for. Jimmy's complaining gets maybe ten seconds of screen time and isn't called out in the narrative as incorrect, especially with the show's history of "anti-censorship" and anti-Executive Meddling takes. The joke seems to lean more towards Political Correctness Gone Mad, or at least mocking late night comedians.

Edited by mightymewtron on Nov 25th 2021 at 1:50:42 PM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Also on the above page, What Happened to the Mouse? is listed for characters who didn't appear in the future yet, namely Ike, Timmy, and Towelie. I can see an argument for Towelie as he was a prominent character in Randy's arc, but Ike and Timmy, while recurring characters like the several others we saw aged up, aren't really involved in any plots, so is their lack of appearance worth noting right now? Plus they might appear in the next special for all we know.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

~Edgar 81539 removed some entries from YMMV.South Park because "The show mocks everyone for the purpose of satire, so everyone would be part of the Misaimed Fandom if "takes the joke in stride" was a pre-requisite. Now, taking the satire seriously actually fits into what Misaimed Fandom entails."

However, I disagree with some of their removals, namely the Trump and "kick a ginger day" ones, because these were describing cases in which the show was still clearly mocking a certain group, but the group ignored the satirical angle and took it at face value, which does fit the criteria for the trope.

Edited by mightymewtron on Dec 27th 2021 at 6:08:12 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.

Anvilicious.South Park has a lot of examples that just state the moral without implying it's heavy-handed. Do they all fit, or should some be removed?

I think a lot of those entries used to be listed under Some Anvils Need to Be Dropped, but were moved when that trope was merged with Anvilicious.