(This is the first thread I've made in TRS. Am I doing it right?)

Ambiguous name and missing trope leading to misuse: Evil Is Stylish.

This trope is being misused to mean a character who is evil with stylish clothes, evil but looks cool, or something else in the Villainous Fashion Sense index (indeed, a name for the trope it's used as could be Villainous Fashion Sense). This could be because Evil Is Sexy is about evil looking sexy rather than having sexy plans, etc., and the names have the same form. It could also be because the laconic is unclear about if it's plotting and such or appearance, since it's just a restatement of the title, and some people might only bother to read that and not the main page. Even some of the quotes on the /Quotes/ tab are about clothing.

Wick check

Note that most Zero Context Examples are likely to be misuse as saying a character is evil and stylish is easy whist saying how they fit Evil Is Stylish normally requires elaboration. Most wicks from character pages are also likely to be misused as fashion sense usually applies to a particular character. Zero Context Examples are the main reason I tag something as "unclear", so keep that in mind when looking at the percentages.

First 50 wicks of 156, skipping an Unpublished Work, two Headscratchers pages, and a Fanfic Rec: -> When I say something has no context, I mean it is just listed as a trope with no explanation.

• Characters.Ace Attorney Defense Attorneys And Assistants: Misused — mentioned with Evil Is Sexy and the character is fashionable, but nothing indicates that he does exquisite traps/whatever.
• Always Chaotic Evil: Probably correct — potholed, and context could be about looking cool but seems likelier to be about this trope.
• Draco in Leather Pants.Anime: Misused — context implies cool clothing.
• Characters.Arc Rise Fantasia: Misused — zero context, but other tropes and character image show it's used for stylish clothing.
• Arson, Murder, and Admiration: Correcy.
• Bait-and-Switch Comment: Misused — about fashion and clothing color.
• Main.Batman: Misused — about his Rogues Gallery, and context shows it can't be plans and such.
• Film.Batman: Misused twice — about cool/fashionable clothing both times.
• Batman Forever: Unclear — likely to be misused, but I can't tell.
• Characters.Batman Rogues Gallery: Misused once, unclear twice more — the first is about a suit, the second and third are zero context and likely misuse, but I can't tell.
• WesternAnimation.Batman The Animated Series: Misused — same as other Batman wicks.
• Characters.Black Butler: Probably misused — no context, but image and other tropes suggest it's about style as in fashion and appearance.
• Blankman: Unclear — no context.
• Characters.Blaz Blue Continuum Shift: Possibly misused — lumped in with other Evil Is X tropes, and character image implies looking cool.
• Characters.Bleach Anime: Misused — cool outfits.
• Quotes.Buffy The Vampire Slayer: Correct.
• Characters.Buffy The Vampire Slayer Antagonists: Probably misused — no context, but it's mentioned that he's a Badass in a Nice Suit, and nothing indicates presence of Evil Is Stylish.
• Characters.Buffy The Vampire Slayer Regulars: Correct and misused in one wick — is this trope but also says "not only his clothes".
• Recap.Buffy The Vampire Slayer S 2 E 14 Innocence: Nearly correct — provides the wrong context or slightly misses what the trope is, but doesn't mistake it for something else and it seems the trope is in there.
• Recap.Buffy The Vampire Slayer S 2 E 16 Bewitched Bothered And Bewildered: Correct.
• Recap.Buffy The Vampire Slayer S 6 E 7 Once More With Feeling: Misused — about suits and tap-dancing.
• TVTropesTheTVShow.Character Holding Bin: Correct.
• Characters.Choujin Sentai Jetman: Correct.
• Clock King: Unclear — pothole could be about actions or fashion.
• Cobra Woman: Misused — no context, but other tropes on the page show it's about looks and costume.
• Creator.Confucius: Misused — about an "insinuating appearance".
• Contractual Genre Blindness: Correct.
• Characters.Daring Do: Misused — something tells me Katherine Hepburn will be about style rather than actions and plotting.
• Dark Shadows: Unclear — says the villains fit the trope, but it's unclear whether it means the actual trope or the misuse about appearance.
• Deadly Decadent Court: Probably misused — describing an evil court as charming in how it throws balls and feasts.
• Deadly Games: Unclear — about a particular character, but nothing on the page to indicate correct or incorrect use.
• Disco Inferno: Misuse — about the devil and his fashion expert.
• Characters.Disney Villains: Probably correct — no context, but other tropes mention evil schemes as noodle incidents and such.
• Doctor Mortis: Unclear — it's a page with almost no description and few tropes with any expansion.
• Bollywood.Don The Chase Begins Again: Misused — about "interesting" clothes.
• Characters.Elemental Doom: Probably misused — a lair is described as stylish.
• Roleplay.Elemental Doom: Misused — hell if I know what that person is talking about, but it isn't this trope.
• Eternal Law: Unclear — no context and page is a stub.
• Even Evil Has Standards: Correct.
• Evil Gloating: Correct.
• Evil Has a Bad Sense of Humor: Misused — the pothole is about Satan being well-dressed.
• Evil Is Cool: Misused — the pothole is about the Nazis having good uniforms.
• Evil Is Sexy: Misused — the phrase "fashion sense" is potholed to this trope.
• Evil Laugh: Correct.
• Evil Makeover: Misused — about costume and style in that sense.
• Fantasy Axis of Evil: Unclear — could be correct or misused.
• Characters.Fate Stay Night Servants: Correct.
• Faux Affably Evil: Correct twice.
• Fear Island: Unclear — no context.
• Fighting For Survival: Correct.

Misused: 27 (50%) Correct: 16 (30%) Unclear: 11 (20%)

As far as I can tell, most of the misuse stems from the name being ambiguous about the meaning of "style" (not helped by it seeming to be a clear name that one wouldn't have to carefully read the trope page for). I think it would therefore make sense to rename the trope and clear up the current wicks, since the misuse is unlikely to happen again with a different name.

I also think that there's a missing trope here, along the lines of Evil Is Sharply Dressed, Evil Wears Cool Clothes, Evil Looks Good, etc.. That could be another reason it was being misused — the trope that the person wanted to put just didn't exist. Nothing in the Villainous Fashion Sense index is for generally dressing stylishly. I'm unsure whether, if a new trope is needed, it should be an expansion of that index with examples being listed on that page, or a new page altogether merely indexed there. Naturally, it would be a YMMV trope.

The missing trope could be related to Fashion-Victim Villain, but that's about, ah, eccentric clothing becoming narmy. This trope would be about the cool clothes that actually come off as cool.

So, any thoughts on what can be done, what the missing trope is and if it exists, if the current Evil Is Stylish needs a rename, etc.?

edited 27th Apr '12 1:33:48 AM by Telcontar

I agree; I always mistake this for a looks trope.

There should be a trope like Evil Is Sharply Dressed.

This is a name that calls for large amounts of misuse and I'm not surprised. Do we not have a trope about cool looking villains?

It might be covered in Man of Wealth and Taste — a villain wears a nice suit.

What is the definition? I have trouble telling from the page.

Evil characters make complicated and elaborate plans and death traps, sometimes incorporating a signature motif in the crimes they commit, in order to appear cool and "stylish", rather than taking options which are simple, reliable, and boring.

The laconic version of this page may well be contributing to misuse, since the "style" in it seems like "fashion" or "coolness".

Up until now, I thought this trope was about clothing. The title is highly misleading and the definition on the page itself is somewhat confusing to someone who thinks the same way I did. Definite change needed, in my opinion.

Would Evil Is Elaborate or Evil Thinks Big be better?

There are several Evil Is X tropes already, if I remember right*

But that's stuff for an alternative titles crowner. I think. At this point, what do people feel should be done with this trope?

(Please tell me if I'm going against standard stuff or doing something wrong or stuff. This is the first time I've participated in TRS.)

Well, I think a better name for the trope it's supposed to be would be in order, to better get across what it actually meant. Something like Evil Has Finesse, or Evil Does It With Style, or maybe something hinting towards how villains like this will go with stylish plans even when it's detrimental to them. Stylish But Impractical Evil Plans? That sounds a bit long.

For the most part, just try to make general suggestions on what you think would fix the page into being something you think our readers might like while not descending into a mess of unclear examples that make no sense and are used to gush about somebodies favorite character. Suggesting alternate names certainly doesn't hurt though. Generally the first step is to try and hammer out a core definition which can be dropped in the Laconic if the current one is bad. Then, we can work the description if need be. IF we still think a rename would help prevent further misuse, we'll do that too since we're already elbow deep in trope guts and we might as well scoop out some tumors while we're in there. Then we can sweep the examples and wicks.

Evil Has Finesse sounds good, not sure on others.

So, hammering out a core definition. I think that the definition of this trope is "Flaw where villains use cool, complicated plans when simple ones would be better." Does that fit the main page? I prefer it to the current laconic, since that's ambiguous about "style", but it's a tad lengthy.

edited 31st May '12 3:15:09 AM by Telcontar

I was going to clock this, but with this level of misuse this really needs a fix, not shelved.

edited 15th Jul '12 9:35:18 AM by ccoa

The misuse might actually be worse than it appears. When people attempt a cleanup, they usually start from the top, and often give up partway through. This means that a wick check starting at the top is likely to severely underestimate the misuse. (Which also means that it's a bad way to do a wick check in general, but in this case, it's probably adequate.)

Sounds like the name is a big part of the problem. Should we go straight to a crowner, or does anyone have related tropes to mention first (in case merge is an option, or something)?

My only question is if we have or need a trope about evil looking stylish. Though I wouldn't shed a tear if we don't bother with a transplant.

I think the point of a literal Evil Is Stylish trope would be for Sensible Heroes, Skimpy Villains. Also because you'd expect a villain not to care about stylishness.

Um, skimpy and stylish don't exactly seem like synonyms to me. Often the exact opposite, in fact. :)

eta: I think I get what you're suggesting, but the example doesn't seem to work too well.

edited 15th Jul '12 1:43:20 PM by Xtifr

I really don't see how "stylish" equals "skimpy" either.

I do think Evil Is Literally Stylish (not by that name) would be a good trope; the existing Man of Wealth and Taste is slightly broader.

Why does this keep dying? >.< I've made and hooked a crowner.

I'm under the impression we already have the "villains prefer elaborate schemes" trope, but hell if I can find it. How does it relate to Why Don't You Just Shoot Him??

No-Nonsense Nemesis (which covers the villains who do Just Shoot Him) specifically lists this as a "contrast" trope.

Ah, found it. The real definition of this page looks too close to Complexity Addiction to me. Maybe it's redundant?

Judging by histories and YKTTW archives, Complexity Addiction was launched near the end of 2009, while Evil Is Stylish has no YKTTW archive.

edited 23rd Jul '12 12:14:56 AM by lu127

I agree that it's redundant, and that Complexity Addiction is better in description and name. Can "merge into Complexity Addiction" be a crowner option (which wouldn't exclude transplanting Evil Is Stylish).

Sure, add it. I'll upvote.

Bump for votes. Merging is currently at 9:2, and transplanting the misuse to a new trope is at 7:4; both other options are in the red. If making the new trope passes, what c/would that be called?

Bump. Merging is the only thing with consensus so far.