You might have a point there, but the problem I see is that this page combines wiki policy guideline and misuse bait in one. Cleaning up misuse isn't really useful if more misuse comes in.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
To reiterate:
- Since YMMV is not a trope but a guideline page (and an index) it should go under Administrivia.YMMV or YMMV.Home Page, but not under /Main/.
- Having bluelinked pages YMMV and Your Mileage May Vary only leads to misuse, as the wick check shows. On the other hand, it has enough inbounds and actual usefulness that it should be kept as a disambiguation/disclaimer page like This Troper, rather than cut or redirected.
- While some of the misuse is due to the lack of cleanup after the redefinition of Your Mileage May Vary, other misuse is ongoing one and can't be addressed by a cleanup alone, but only by redlinking.
What's wrong with having indexes in Main/? Most indexes are in Main/.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
YMMV is an index. Indexs go in the main. Thus YMMV goes in the main. Simple.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Because they attract misuse as tropes.
EDIT To Add: And because YMMV isn't a trope. Many indexes are supertropes or genre lists. This one is not.
Anyway, the main point is to make YMMV harder to wick to since it only makes trouble.
edited 10th Feb '12 7:13:40 AM by SeptimusHeap
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
OK, so can we at least move this to some other page soa s to stop the misuse, or should a clean-up suffice?
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Bumping. I'd like to see an idea about this:
- TearJerker.Black Butler. Sinkhole
- TheScrappy.Comic Books. Sinkhole and Examples Are Not Arguable
- Examples Are Not Arguable. Correct
- Gratuitous Japanese. Incorrect. Justifying Edit
- Music.Hollywood Undead. Sinkhole
- TearJerker.Kuroshitsuji. Sinkhole
- Phineas and Ferb. Incorrect
- Characters.Super Bowl. Incorrect. Examples Are Not Arguable
- Music.Yoko Kanno. Incorrect
- WMG.Yume Nikki. Unclear
- AwesomeMusic.Anime. Incorrect. If anything, Love It or Hate It
- Woolseyism.Anime. Unclear
- Bonnie Scotland. Sinkhole
- Theatre.Brooklyn. None
- Bryan Danielson. Unclear, Parabombing
- But What About the Astronauts?. Incorrect
- VideoGame.Castlevania Symphony Of The Night. Absent
- Cinematech. Word Cruft
- Heartwarming.Code Geass Lelouch Of The Rebellion. Incorrect
- Discontinuity.Comic Books. Incorrect
- YMMV.Command And Conquer. Incorrect
- Music.Creed. Incorrect
- Damaged Soul. Unclear
- FanFic.Delta Invasion. Unclear
- Evil Is Hammy. Incorrect
- Game Face. Sinkhole
- General Failure. Sinkhole
- YMMV.Godspell. verbal tic
- Tearjerker.Harry Potter And The Methods Of Rationality. Sinkhole
- Headscratchers.Hellboy. Verbal tci
- Hotel Rwanda. Verbal tic
- I Have This Friend. Verbal tic
- Indecisive Parody. Incorrect
- Ivanhoe. Misuse. Justifying Edit
- Jimmy Carter. Sinkhole
- YMMV.Kamen Rider Agito. Redundant
- Awesome Music.Kirby. Redundant
- Film.Kung Fu Panda 2. Sinkhole
- Characters.Law And Order: Natter
- YMMV.Legally Blonde. Verbal tic
- Lethal Chef. Unclear
- BLAM.Literature. Incorrect. Examples Are Not Arguable
- Medievil. Sinkhole
- Meet Cute. Sinkhole
- YMMV.Megaman. verbal tic
- SugarWiki.Moment Of Awesome. Correct
- Musical World Hypotheses. Incorrect. Examples Are Not Arguable
- No Ending. Unclear
- Non Lethal KO. Unclear
- Orangina. Sinkhole
- Our Lawyers Advised This Trope. Sinkhole
- Padding. Sinkhole
- Characters.Peanuts. Verbal tic
- YMMV.Peanuts. Sinkhole
- Heartwarming.Peanuts. Incorrect. Examples Are Not Arguable
- Player Punch. Sinkhole
- Prehistoric Monster. Sinkhole
- Professional Killer. Unclear
- Protectors Of The Plot Continuum. Sinkhole
- Awesome.Rogue Warrior. Sinkhole
- Characters.Saint Seiya The Lost Canvas. Unclear
- Secret Test of Character. Natter. Incorrect
- Shaped Like Itself. Sinkhole
- Shiny Objects Videos. Incorrect
- Shut Up, Hannibal!. Unclear
- Anime.Soukou No Strain. Sinkhole
- Music.Spocks Beard. Incorrect
- Star Trek Specter. Incorrect
- Straight Man. Incorrect. Examples Are Not Arguable
- WMG.Super Robot Wars. Sinkhole
- Western Animation.Sym-Bionic Titan. Incorrect
- WMG.Tales Of MU. Verbal tic
- YMMV.The Day The Earth Stood Still. Incorrect
- YMMV.The Dreamer. Incorrect
- The New Rock & Roll. Sinkhole
- The Ugly Barnacle. Verbal tic
- Throne Of Blood. Natter
- Tiny Guy, Huge Girl. Incorrect
- Awesome.Web Original. Incorrect
- DownerEnding.Western Animation. Unclear
- TearJerker.Western Animation. Sinkholes
(and note that "Unclear" means "incorrect, but not specified")
This gives 2 "ghost wicks" and 2 correct uses among 76 incorrect ones - a 95% misuse rate.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
My goodness, this just keeps dying.
So there are several options on the table: Mine on the previous page, the cleanup-only one at the top of this one and doing nothing. Do we need a crowner at this stage.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Dragon Writer
Crowner time?
IMHO, I have never liked the "YMMV" label. Yes, I know it's an abbreviation and a synonym for "Subjective Trope" (or "subjective example"), but as samples show people are linking it like a Stock Phrase. Seriously, 7000 wikilinks and a high proportion of sinkholes is a level that otherwise only "If You Know What I Mean" could reach.
An Ear Worm is like a Rickroll: It is never going to give you up.
Yeah, that page invites misuse like you invite a vampire in. It has enough meaning that it should stay, but not enough that we can afford leaving it a bluelink -especially since the misuse seems to be partly leftover and partly ongoing.
Of course, a fake redlink will need the current index to be moved somewhere else, since you can't edit fake-redlinks without blueshifting them.
I will take another opinion before going to a crowner.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Dragon Writer
If no cleanup was ever performed, maybe take it to Special Efforts?
An Ear Worm is like a Rickroll: It is never going to give you up.
There is ongoing misuse and a rule against it - Examples Are Not Arguable (to which Examples Are Not YMMV is a redirect). I seriously doubt that a cleanup alone will suffice under these circumstances.
OK, so I've made a Page Action crowner
to decide on the course to take, since the problem is acknowledged but there are different solution proposals.
Bumping for more votes so that it can be resolved.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Hopefully the last bump, as for now the options in green:
- Cleanup is at 11/1
- Split the index/administrative guideline off is at 12/2
- Redlink the redirects is at 9/1
Do nothing is at 1/7 red.
A few more votes for the top options and this one can proceed.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Ravenous Sophovore
Looks like votes are still coming in. Let's give it another day.
Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.
Ravenous Sophovore
Calling the crowner. None of the top three options are mutually exclusive, please implement them all.
Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.
Before we can implement the split, we'll need the name of the page we are splitting the guideline into - I've made an alt-titles crowner here.
About the fake redlinking, Your Mileage May Vary has too many inbounds to be cut and several past requests for Your Milage May Vary were declined, so I will ask Eddie to redlink both pages.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Thanks.
edited 14th Mar '12 8:02:25 AM by SeptimusHeap
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
Thread renamed and Crowners swapped.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Also, I've created Sandbox.YMMV for the proposed disambiguation/disclaimer to put in where YMMV now is.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
I have to downvote anything without "YMMV" in the name as we are still calling the namespace /YMMV/. And we renamed Subjective Tropes for being a misnomer.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Home Page is not already the ymmv page? EDIT:I guess none of the names with "tropes" is a good idea. YMMV are not tropes.
edited 14th Mar '12 9:59:07 AM by MagBas
No, it's a redirect to YMMV. About, Complete Monster is a trope but still YMMV. Not all YMMV's are Audience Reactions.
edited 14th Mar '12 10:16:38 AM by SeptimusHeap
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Bumping, vote tally so far:
- YMMV.Home Page: 6 yeas to 1 nays
- YMMV Tropes: 3 yes to 2 nays
Everything else in red, and no fake-redlinking of the redirects has occurred yet.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Crown Description:
Currently, YMMV and its redirects Your Mileage May Vary and Your Milage May Vary suffer from these problems:- The names are Stock Phrases and are used as tropes whereas the page is an index and administrative guideline that is explicitly not to be used as a trope or Stock Phrase.
- The pages suffer from massive misuse in wicks
, both old misuse resulting from the redirecting of Your Mileage May Vary and new misuse despite the existence of a specific guideline against it.
I think it should be clear this isn't a repair shop issue, YMMV isn't broken it only has a lot of excessive wicks due to the change in how the term is used in the wiki. This is a Special Efforts thread. I can't say I'll comb through the wiki looking specifically for the term but I will zap it when I find it.