During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Goku Black
Kinda curious do we hAve any cm versions of Burke and hare ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Haman and Metalbeak.
@ACW One more edit actually (changing Grand Vizier of Agrabah to Grand Vizier and changing Sultan to Sultan of Agrabah). Edited in the post on 7931 and then sent to the drafts.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
to Ingvarr, Haman, and Metalbeak. Cut Whiterose and Irving
Edited by G-Editor on Jan 11th 2020 at 11:31:54 PM
to Gui, Darien, Yngvarr, Haman and Metalbeak.
I thought sharks were my friends.
Yay to Metalbeak.
RIP KissAnime.
to Gui, Darien, Yngvarr and Haman. Abstain on Metalbeak.
How many incarnations does this make for Haman?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Does he have any others besides the original incarnation?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I know the version of him from Superbook (2011) qualifies.
Well, he has the incarnation from Esther and the King; I think this would make 3 incarnations for Haman.
Nevermind, 4 incarnations.
Edited by falcontalons on Jan 12th 2020 at 2:44:55 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Other issues:
- Strife needs condensing. Like, massively.
- What's the consensus for Mr. Robot? I think the current 2 entries are cuts, but Vera's all over the place.
- The Transformers game examples are also all over the place.
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
I say wait for more Info on Irving, but Whiterose is a definite cut.
Things are really about to get Fun around here
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
So, time for another Science Adventure EP. Big spoilers, as always.
What's the work?
Chaos;Child is the sequel to Chaos;Head. Taking place in Shibuya some time after the earthquake that Norose Genichi caused, it follows Takuru Miyashiro and his friends at the Hehiko newspaper club as they solve the mystery of the New New Gen murders, strange killings that resemble the original New Gen murders.
So, eventually it turns out that Serika Onoe, the main heroine, is one of the culprits. She is not my candidate, however. She genuinely loves Takuru and is doing everything she does out of a misguided desire to make him a hero.
Her bosses, on the other hand...
Who are Dr. Wataru Sakuma and Mr. Shuichi Wakui? What do they do?
Sakuma and Wakui are Takuru's adoptive father and teacher, respectively. They are secretly two members of the Committee of 300 who, in the past, committed horrifying experiments on Gigalomanaics; such things included assaulting them with horrifying images, keeping them locked in a basement where slowly lost their sanity, etc. They have been assigned to clean up the rise of Chaos Child Syndrome, a disease which turned a while bunch of people in Shibuya into psychic Gigalomaniacs. As revealed in the True End, everyone is trapped in a mass delusion. The two decide to run a little experiment of their own, however.
Sakuma enlists Serika in helping him commit the murders. They put up a bunch of Sumo Stickers around town; the stickers are a Brown Note to those who are Gigalomaniacs, essentially telling Sakuma and Wakui who to target. Sakuma, who has the power of Mind Control, visits the home of an Internet celebrity with the power to see the future, and tricks him into cutting up his own arm as if it were a block of cheese, killing him. He and Serika then visit a famed vocalist who gives street concerts, then mind control her into cutting up her stomach and putting in a radio, then have her die in front of her fans in her next street concert. For the third murder, they sneak into a love hotel and have a guy tie his neck up to a contraption that slowly twists his neck around until he dies.
In the meantime, the trio brainwash Shinji Itou, best friend of Takuru, into being their spy and accomplice by giving him fake memories of Takuru killing Senri. Shinji never Met Senri In real life, but he becomes convicned he did and helps them to get revenge. They then lead Takuru to the third murder scene, traumatizing him. When Watabe, a reporter, goes to interviews Takuru and the club, they use their powers to stuff his stomach full of Sumo Stickers, having him vomit them out and die in front of the whole auditorium. They then lead Takuru and Arimura to a confrontation with a pyrokinetic, nearly getting them killed, before making the pyro girl their next victim by mind controlling her into burning herself.
Here is where the depravity of Sakuma truly shines. He decides to make his next targets his two adopted daughters. He has the Brainwashed and Crazy Itou kidnap Yui and cut her into pieces, then stuff each of them inside a box. Then he sics Serika on Nono, his other daughter; while she actually survives, it is indicated to be because Serika held back. Finally, he frames Takuru as the killer, challenges him to come face him, then sadistically beats and taunts him before trapping him in a delusion that forces him to relive Nono's 'death' over and over again, before eventually deciding to just deprive Takuru of his senses and let him go insane. Long story short, he is defeated and killed.
As for Wakui. When he is first revealed as evil in the Hana route, he uses a bomb (or something) to deafen Takuru and Hana, intending to drive them nuts. Serika saves them, so instead he kidnaps Nono and blackmails Takuru and Hana into surrendering themselves to be killed. When they arrive, he sends a delusion to Takuru of Hana biting off her tongue, with blood, and then one where he cuts off and reattaches Nono's Head, again and again, while she pleads for help. He then straight up tries to kill Takuru before being beaten. In the True End, it is revealed that Hehiko Academy was a facility for Chaos Child Syndrome patients, and he was basically there to study them. It is indicated that he tortured Serika when she worked under him. So he ambushes Takuru and tries to kill him, being very sadistic about it, explaining his philosophy about how to rule the lower classes, then gives an amnesiac Serika her memories back just so she will be tormented with the truth that she was one of the killers. Eventually, Takuru reaches a deal with him- Takuru will cure CCS and turn himself in, Taking the Heat, in exchange for his loved ones being left alone- Wakui happily accepts (since curing CCS would get rid of Gigalomaniacs, essentially what he was trying to do).
In what is perhaps one of the most disappointing endings I have ever come across, the selfless Takuru goes to jail and is presumably executed or locked up for life, and the girls are separated from him forever, while Wakui gets what he wanted and gets away with everything. (Seriously, I was gonna watch the anime adap first, but the true end pretty much killed any interest I have in revisiting the story. Well, at least there's the Nono/Senri ending, which is much more satisfying and ends well for Takuru and almost everyone else, but even then Wakui's fate is unknown).
Heinousness?
They are up against Norose, the first game's Big Bad who orchestrated a bunch of murders and caused the earthquake, and Leskinen and Reyes from Steins;Gate 0, who caused World War III. But between the gruesome murders, the targeting of the children they look after, the whole experiment thing, their psychological torture of the heroes, their lower resources (they are members of the Committee but said to be much lower-ranked than Norose), and the fact that their involvement in the New New Gen murders is more direct than Norose who hired other people to do the original New Gen killings for him, I would say they are unique enough to stand out.
Mitigating Qualities?
Any feelings they show for the children in their care is proven to be fake in the end, so no.
Verdict?
I say sure. Now excuse me while I look at the Senri ending again to heal the hurt that the True End left me.
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
The Draftsman of Doom
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
Wow, I did not notice their initials were the reverse of each other.
Just call them Sakuma and Wakui if you like.
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'll read the EP tomorrow, but just to clarify, this is the Visual Novel only?
Also, ~Bootlebat, the Strife entry needs to be trimmed, MASSIVELY.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
"The Juice is Loose."
Yes to Sakuma and Wakui.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
for Dr. Wataru Sakuma and Mr. Shuichi Wakui. They seem to fit the quality over quantity bill here.
As for all the Transformers stuff...all right, I've narrowed it down a bit. Only a couple people down-voted Starscream, the Fallen, and Megatron from the PS2/Wii/PS3/360 versions of Revenge of the Fallen game. Only three people voted down Megatron from Transformers: The Game. So it seems like they're going up.
Lotta people are iffy on DOTM!Megatron because of all the continuity bullshit. Myself included.
The DS versions seem almost evenly split. I counted about 7 and 4 ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
, and there's a bunch of people who abstained or switched from a yes to an abstain.
Once again, link to all the EPs is right here if anyone wants to redo their votes.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
So the first 4 are a solid go, the second 4 not yet.
Should we take another look at this DS Megatron?
Edited by ACW on Jan 12th 2020 at 7:33:20 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
to Wauki and Sakuma.
Ravok wasn't contesting that DS Megatron, so I don't think we need to take another look at him.
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
Same. For now that version of Megatron stays. It's just the other three we're still looking at.
I prefer if we don't talk about anything else Transformers related until we resolve this.
Edited by Tyk5919 on Jan 12th 2020 at 7:39:35 AM
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Fair enough.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
@ACW Just changed Grand Vizier Jafar to Jafar, the Grand Vizier of Agrabah,. May be a little more wordy, but just trying to personalize it a bit more.