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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Mediawatcher Since: Dec, 2015
#300776: Feb 8th 2022 at 4:59:37 PM

[tup] Jagin, Pollicut, Prometheus and Benoit

therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#300777: Feb 8th 2022 at 5:39:35 PM

[tup] Benoit

"No running in the halls!"
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#300779: Feb 8th 2022 at 7:11:52 PM

[tup]Benoit.

Got a proposal of my own.

What's the Work?

Vamps, or Ghouls, is a 2017 Russian vampire movie. In the 18th century, government secretary Andrey is sent to a remote village to seek out a banished monk, Father Lavr. Upon arriving, he finds that the village is under threat by vampires, particularly a young woman named Milena, who is being sought after by vampire lord Vitold Bishteffi.

Who Is He? What Does He Do?

The newly-resurrected vampire lord, Vitold Bishteffi, or Strigev, seeks to return vampires to the dominant species on Earth over mankind. In the past, Bishteffi bit Milena's pregnant mother, causing Milena to be born a Moroy, part-human, part-vampire. In the present, Bishteffi seeks to use Milena's blood on a specific constellation that occurs once every 150 years, making him and his brood immune to daylight and allowing them to engulf the Earth. While awaiting the day of the constellation, Bishteffi preys on the nearby villagers and attempts to abduct Milena. Milena is taken to a monastery while her family, including her young brother, fall prey to Bishteffi and are killed by the villagers as a result.

With the constellation drawing near, Bishteffi awakens the "ancient vampires" and unleashes his brood onto the village, then uses his now-larger undead army to assault the monastery and take Milena, leaving the monastery protectors alive so they can watch their world be overrun by vampires. On the day of the constellation, Bishteffi feeds Milena a serum containing the blood of the six ancient vampire families to turn her, planning to use her blood to make him immune to daylight. Andrey, his servant Paramon, and Lavr launch a last-ditch attack on his castle. While Lavr sacrifices himself to destroy Bishteffi's brood, Andrey engages the vampire lord in a sword duel, defeating and killing him with Paramon's help, while also saving Milena from the serum using his own blood.

Mitigating factors?

No redeeming traits. The movie basically uses the logic of all the lesser vampires essentially just being mindless beasts subservient to their Master, while Bishteffi possesses intelligence and control.

Final Verdict?

I'd say Keep. Interesting to have proposal from a medieval vampire movie, when next week I'll have a proposal from a medieval werewolf movie.

Why so serious?
WetFlannels Classy, Refined, Unstable from Nearby, on a cosmological scale. Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
#300780: Feb 8th 2022 at 7:19:46 PM

[tup] Vitold

Yes, yes, old boy, we'd like nothing more than to stay and be a part of your primitive, barbaric society, but duty calls, duty calls...
Misry6 Imperfect Disgrace from the Eternal Nothingness Since: Nov, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Imperfect Disgrace
#300781: Feb 8th 2022 at 7:20:08 PM

[tup] Bishteffi.

Just an empty void…
therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#300782: Feb 8th 2022 at 7:27:44 PM

Ah, yet another obscure movie I've heard of. [tup] Vitold, nicely done.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Feb 8th 2022 at 7:27:56 AM

"No running in the halls!"
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#300784: Feb 8th 2022 at 8:13:08 PM

[tup] Jagin, Prometheus, Pollicut, Benoit and Bishteffi

DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#300785: Feb 8th 2022 at 9:17:31 PM

[tup] to Bing Partridge, Samael, the CEO rewrite, Jagin, Prometheus, Henry Pollicut, Benoit Depardieu, and Vitold Bishteffi/Strigev.

[tdown] to the Anjuro Kataguri quote and the William "Wild Bill" Wharton quote (on it's own, it doesn't reveal the full depravity of his crime).

VeryVileVillian (Apprentice)
#300786: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:07:32 PM

Yes to Benoit Depardieu and Vitold Bishteffi

Vile I watched the playthrough of the video you sent, which is the character you want to propose?

Protagonist's mother

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#300787: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:30:51 PM

Alright, finally posting this. Thanks to Vile for giving me this candidate.

What's the work?

Like Veins Beneath The Town is a short RPG Maker horror game and the sequel to They Watch From The Walls, which was previously covered. This game stars Dr. Jesse Thornheart, an investigator known as a Chastiser who hunts down the demons of the Forest where the games take place. In this game, he is hired by Mr. Maigata of Ishinakku Village to investigate the disappearances of 21 women, including his wife Laura. The culprit is my candidate.

Walkthrough here:

And here is the video with the boss battle and game over:

Who is the Suturer? What does he do?

The Suturer is, or was, a human Serial Killer who worships the demons of the Forest and wants to become one of them, so he made himself a hideout in the abandoned railway project underneath the village and grabs women from within the mines, dragging them into the grates, and brutally murders them by smashing them against rocks. He then puts their corpses in weird upside-down trees in the caverns that tear apart the corpses and turn them into a part of the Forest itself, the tree roots sucking the corpses blood to feed to the forest, while also ripping a body part from each women to replace his own skin, believing it will turn him into a being beyond humanity. He also uses a body part from each victim to construct a “doll”, a bizarre amalgamation of their bodies that is somehow alive, and he is indicated to have several.

Jesse witnesses him dragging some poor woman into the mines, and is unable to stop him. He then witnesses the twisted dolls he has turned his victims into. When meeting him, the Suturer claims that he is an artist who has made brilliant works of art. Disgusted, Jesse fights the patchwork man. If the player loses the fight, the Suturer will punch his arm through Jesse and taunt him as he dies, preparing to turn him into another tree; but if the player wins, Jesse chops his head off.

Heinousness?

His main competition is Mr. Pumpkin, a child-trafficker, and as horrible as that is, I feel the Suturer has a unique and twisted niche to make it himself (22 women gruesomely murdered and turned into tree dolls, and potentially Jesse himself too). The only other character is the nameless protagonist of The Well Speaks To Me, who is a Serial Killer who murdered her family and some other people, but there is a heavy implication that she was driven insane by the Forest so she doesn’t count.

Mitigating Qualities?

He’s clearly insane, but not in an agency-impairing way. In other words, like The Joker- he knows what he is doing is bad and does not care. He talks about how the Forest spirits and the dolls talk to him, but and this seems like crazy talk, but it is very likely that he is being truthful since the Forest is demon-infested and shows some signs of sentience, as do the dolls (one of them moves when you exit the room it is in). He gives Jesse a more “merciful” death only because the Forest wants his body “unspoiled”, ie not mutilated.

Verdict?

Quick keep.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
VeryVileVillian (Apprentice)
#300788: Feb 8th 2022 at 10:37:33 PM

Yes to the Suturer, i truly don't think he is insane to the mitigating levels, since the game itself treat him as malevolent and capable of recognizing what is evil and that what he's doing is wrong.

Powermaster201 The Emperor of Evil! Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
The Emperor of Evil!
#300789: Feb 8th 2022 at 11:08:22 PM

[tup] to Suturer and Vitold

Edited by Powermaster201 on Feb 8th 2022 at 2:08:47 PM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#300790: Feb 8th 2022 at 11:24:19 PM

Yes there. Also with thanks to ACW for slinging this guy to met: from the Matthew Reilly Scarecrow series, I give you from Area 7, Gunther Botha.

Who is Gunther Botha?

A South African scientist working with the white supremacist organization Die Organisasie for years and with the South African Reconnaissance Commandos...through this, Botha specialized in diseases and plague. Namely designing one. Namely designing one to wipe out all black people in the world. Okay, can I stop the effortpost here? No? Okay.

So, Apartheid fell and Botha was one of the few people bummed about it because all his stuff was in there. But hey, the US government had need for a depraved sociopath with absolutely no morals and a racism that'd make Matthew Hale blush,. The Sinovirus had been developed , a bioweapon that could wipe out anyone of non-Asian descent and Botha was studying a cure....this entailed some test subjects who died horribly. Eventually, they created a boy genetically named Kevin who was the key to the Sinovirus...

See, Botha had a racially coded weapon in his hands. What was he gonna do with it? With the coup by villain Ceasar Russell, Botha gets out and kidnaps Kevin with intent to give his brand new virus to his old buddies at Di Organisasie to wipe out all black people on the planet, effectively also betraying a number of Marines to be slaughtered.

Schofield tracks him down and in the ensuing chase? a blast hits Botha, blowing him up but sparing Kevin.

Mitigating issues?

He tries.

To make a virus.

To kill every black person on the planet.

What do you expect me to say? "He's a very deep villain and obvious complex." Fuck no, Botha hits the heinous standard beyond a doubt and he experiments with a horrible virus on prisoners and plans to wipe out every black person on the planet.

Conclusion?

What do we think?

Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#300792: Feb 8th 2022 at 11:29:59 PM

[tup] Suturer and Botha

"No running in the halls!"
Ravok Caesar Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Caesar
#300793: Feb 9th 2022 at 12:04:03 AM

Yes to Vitold and the Suturer, as well as...as...oh my God. This is it. This is it. Don't fuck this up Ravok, you have waited too long for this kind of opportunity! Ok, ok, I got it:

Very easy Yes to Botha, who needs to contract a case of Ligma as soon as possible at the hands of Candace riding a Dragon!

...I feel like I forgot the punchline I was gonna go for. Oh well, ladies and gentlemen, we got him, or something!

Edited by Ravok on Feb 9th 2022 at 12:08:31 PM

WHAT A WONDERFUL DAY!
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#300794: Feb 9th 2022 at 1:24:35 AM

cookieman, FYI, it goes here AND Drafts.

Yes to Botha (and for those asking, yes Caesar still keeps. Lighty agrees). I've said it before and I'll say it again: Matthew Reilly does NOT do subtle [lol]

Yes to Strigev and Suturer.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#300795: Feb 9th 2022 at 1:51:48 AM

[tup]Strigev, Sutterer, Botha

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Kookosbanaani Since: May, 2015
#300796: Feb 9th 2022 at 3:20:11 AM

Old entry:

  • The Great Silence: Loco is a psychopathic Bounty Hunter who spends the film hunting down a group of Mormons, with every intention of murdering them. When he practically takes a town hostage, Loco murders the sheriff to prevent his interference and when faced against the hero, Silence, Loco has an ambush set to cripple Silence before gunning him down and then shooting his love interest dead. He and his men proceed to murder every one of the Mormons, with Loco smugly adding they'll collect the bounties nice and legally. His actions, in the end narration, are noted to have absolutely horrified society and precipitated the end of bounty hunting.

I think this entry is lacking some crucial info, like Loco's Establishing Character Moment and the sheer treachery and sadism of his actions, and the fact that the townspeople are never actually referred to as "mormons" during the film, rather than people forced to steal for a living. And it doesn't really matter in this context, considering how the Big Bad Duumvirate operates on a scale to legally murder decent townspeople for profit.

New entry, as well as Pollicut's write-up:

  • The Great Silence:
    • Loco/Tigrero is a vicious, bloodthirsty bounty hunter dedicated to killing his bounties in cold-blood to maximize profits. Introduced casually murdering a man in front of his mother who had provided him shelter, Loco tortures a man to reveal the location of his next bounty and kills him after promising to spare him. Taking the wife of said bounty hostage, Loco shoots the husband after he surrenders. Teaming up with Pollicut, the corrupt banker of the settlement, Loco plans to collect bounties of the townspeople and proceeds to murder the righteous sheriff to prevent him from interfering. Gloating at the sheriff's lover of said murder, Loco murders her as well while pursuing Silence. Taking the entire settlement hostage, Loco challenges Silence to a duel but rather than facing him directly, Loco sets an ambush on him, crippling Silence so that he can gun down both him and his lover. Massacring the townspeople and smugly adding they'll collect the bounties legally, Loco's actions are said to have horrified the society and precipitated the end of bounty hunting.
    • Henry Pollicut is the corrupt, greedy banker and "judge of peace" of the settlement. Letting bounty hunters run rampant and personally putting bounties on the townspeople forced to steal for a living, Pollicut lusts after the young Pauline and plans to make her his mistress. Putting a price on his husband's head, Pollicut ensures Pauline becoming a widow before trying to force himself on her. Formerly a bounty hunter who murdered Silence's parents and let one of his associates slit his vocal cords in order to prevent him from talking, Pollicut was later crippled by Silence in payback for what he did. Rather than trying to live with the misdeeds he committed, Pollicut tries to get his revenge on Silence by attempting to rape Pauline in front of him while one of his men tortures Silence by burning his hand in the fireplace, gloating how he doesn't need a thumb to do so.

Edited by Kookosbanaani on Feb 9th 2022 at 3:20:58 AM

CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#300797: Feb 9th 2022 at 3:21:24 AM

[tup] Bishteffi, the Suturer and Botha.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
TotemGenitor Bye Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Bye
#300800: Feb 9th 2022 at 4:18:47 AM

[tup] Bing, Samael, Jagin, Pollicut, Prometheus, Benoit, Bishteffi, Suturer, Botha


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