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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#281001: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:19:51 PM

And a happy yea to the Sheriff

Mediawatcher Since: Dec, 2015
#281002: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:28:45 PM

[tup] Clem, Cooper, doc, both of the demons, Stargher, and the Sheriff

Edited by Mediawatcher on Sep 27th 2021 at 1:30:30 AM

CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#281003: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:29:30 PM

[tup] to Izual, Clem, Stanley, Doc, the demon, the pastor demon, Stargher and the Sheriff.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#281004: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:30:57 PM

[tup]Doc, The Demon, The other Demon, Stragher, & Kent's sheriff.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#281005: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:38:29 PM

[tup] Creature.

[tup] Baphomet

[tup]Desskari.

[tup] Beryl.

[tup] Izual.

[tup]Hootkins.

[tup] Stanley Cooper.

[tup] Doc Williams.

[tup] Demon 1.

[tup] Demon 2.

[tup] Stragher.

[tup] Sheriff.

Edited by Beast on Sep 27th 2021 at 1:38:57 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
G-Editor Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#281006: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:42:57 PM

[tup] to Izual, Clem, Stanley, Doc, the demon, the pastor demon, Stargher and the Sheriff.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#281007: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:48:21 PM

  • Jerusalem's Lot: James Boon was the "magnetic" first citizen of the eponymous town, a Puritan who founded a splinter group in his faith to pursue his own eldritch worship. James influenced Jerusalem's Lot into becoming a Wretched Hive of incest, sacrifice, and both mental and physical degradation of each subsequent generation. Finally, Boon had the subject of his worship—an elder god called the Worm—absorb all of his followers into eternal, mindless, undead obedience, continuing to enact his dark rituals beneath the remains of Jerusalem's Lot even a century-and-a-half beyond when he should have died.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#281008: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:49:52 PM

Yes to the Sheriff..."stiff standard of the New 52's run"...wouldn't that be Post-Crisis?

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
#281009: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:50:58 PM

Yes to the pastor demon, Stargher, and the Sheriff.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
VeryVileVillian (Apprentice)
#281011: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:53:06 PM

Yes to the racist Sheriff

Since he was approved, to not drag it out, here is the demon's writeup:

What Lies in the Fog: The nameless demon is the servant of The Fog, who leads it to feed on innocent people. Taking the form of a pastor and having The Fog surround the town he was in, which led to the brutal death of at least two people, the demon orders the protagonist to find and gather all remaining people of the town in his church, one of whom is a little girl, so he could trap them and offer them to The Fog as food. Succeding in one of the endings, the demon gleefully feeds them to his master, before burning down the church.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#281012: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:54:52 PM

  • "Jerusalem's Lot": James Boon was the "magnetic" first citizen of the eponymous town, a Puritan who founded a splinter group in his faith to pursue his own eldritch worship. James influenced Jerusalem's Lot into becoming a Wretched Hive of incest, sacrifice, and both mental and physical degradation of each subsequent generation. Finally, Boon had the subject of his worship—an elder god called the Worm—absorb all of his followers into eternal, mindless, undead obedience, continuing to enact his dark rituals beneath the remains of Jerusalem's Lot even a century-and-a-half beyond when he should have died.

Also, Scraggle, you said you had one more Lupin upcoming, correct? If so, I won't Cut List the Sandbox yet.

Edited by ACW on Sep 27th 2021 at 4:56:39 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#281013: Sep 27th 2021 at 1:58:03 PM

Yep! I got a Paul Naschy and then the Lupin guy is next.

Ordeaux26 Professor Gigachad from Canada Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Professor Gigachad
#281014: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:06:42 PM

So I have a quick expansion to an existing keeper that appeared in an episode after the EP was made. He does still count but he also gets some new crimes I think should be added. The character in question is James Gillies from Murdoch Mysteries.

  • Murdoch Mysteries: James Gillies is Detective William Murdoch's Arch-Enemy and one of the most dangerous men he's ever met. Initially coming into conflict with Murdoch after he murdered his professor as part of a way to test a theory of Applied Physics. After escaping the noose by bribing a dying man into taking his place, Gillies murders Robert by sawing his head off while he's still alive. He then initiates a twisted mind game with Murdoch that culminates in him burying Julia alive, with Murdoch only narrowly getting there in time to save her. Unfortunately, Gillies escapes and one year later frames Julia for the murder of her husband, all as part of a plan to lure Murdoch into a Sadistic Choice of either saving his own life or that of Julia. Fortunately, Murdoch alerts his fellow officers, who arrive in time to save him before the poisonous gas floods the room. Finally, he arranged for several criminals to break onto the train transporting him into prison, causing chaos which he used to try to escape, all the while taunting both Murdoch and Julia that they "owe him" for killing Julia's husband and allowing them to be together. Years after his supposed death, he wants to die, so he implants a microphone in a man to drive him insane into killing two people and then killing himself. He does this to draw Murdoch out so he can force Murdoch to kill him and if he does not he will kill Roland.

Yeah, it is a bit long but this guy does do quite a lot, and I did get rid of some necessary stuff.

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#281015: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:21:45 PM

Yes to Hootkins, Stanley, Doc, the demon, the Pastor demon, Stargher and the sheriff. Anyone else watch Murdoch? Doubt buddy needs to be 250 words and the sentences could use a retool.

Ordeaux26 Professor Gigachad from Canada Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Professor Gigachad
#281016: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:23:00 PM

The series isn't very well know outside of Canada so I doubt it, this guy is also in quite a bit of episode with a lot of crimes so I could see it being this long. I could give trimming it a bit more a try.

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
Ordeaux26 Professor Gigachad from Canada Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Professor Gigachad
#281017: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:25:31 PM

How about this.

  • Murdoch Mysteries: James Gillies is Detective William Murdoch's Arch-Enemy and one of the most dangerous men he's ever met. Coming into conflict with Murdoch after he murdered his professor as part of a way to test a theory of Applied Physics. After escaping the noose, Gillies murders Robert by sawing his head off while he's still alive. He then initiates a twisted mind game with Murdoch that culminates in him burying Julia alive, with Murdoch only narrowly getting there in time to save her. Unfortunately, Gillies escapes and one year later frames Julia for the murder of her husband, all as part of a plan to lure Murdoch into a Sadistic Choice of either saving his own life or that of Julia. While being transported, he arranged for several criminals to break onto the train transporting him into prison, causing chaos which he used to try to escape. Years after his supposed death, he wants to die, so he implants a microphone in a man to drive him insane into killing two people and then killing himself. He does this to draw Murdoch out so he can force Murdoch to kill him, and if he does not, he will kill Roland.

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
#281018: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:26:01 PM

Doc, the demon, the pastor demon, Stargher and the Sheriff.

Libraryseraph Showtime! from Canada (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
Showtime!
#281019: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:26:28 PM

[tup] to Stargher, the sheriff, and both demons

Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#281020: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:28:39 PM

[up][up][up] Good.

Actually you aren't the only Canadian here, Scraggle and I both are and actually as per his suggestion here's my truncated version:

  • James Gillies is Detective William Murdoch's Arch-Enemy. Murdering a professor before escaping execution by switching places with another man, Gillies savagely saws a man's head off while he's still alive. Burying Murdoch's lover Julia alive with her only being narrowly rescued by Murdoch, Gillies returns to frame her for the murder of her husband as part of a ploy to force Murdoch to choose between his own life and Julia's. Arranging for the escape of a group of violent criminals aboard a train, Gillies uses the free murderers as a diversion for his own escape. Years after his supposed death, Gillies, now seeking to end his own life, drives a man to insanity, resulting in the man killing two innocents as well as himself, all just to draw out Murdoch and force his nemesis to kill him.

Edited by 43110 on Sep 27th 2021 at 5:31:03 AM

caio202 The Brazillian Dog! from Brazil Since: Nov, 2019
The Brazillian Dog!
#281021: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:32:14 PM

New proposal from Brazillian TV:

What's the work?

"Os Mutantes" is a brazillian soap opera from Rede Record TV, actualy a trilogy, composed by three seasons: Caminhos do Coração; Os Mutantes; and Promessas de Amor. Its a fantasy and sci-fi themed soap opera in which mutated humans were created by an alien race called "repitilians" in order to use them as weapon to dominate the world.

Who is Julia and what she did?

Julia Zaccarias is the creator of the aforementioned mutants and a significant member of the reptilians, an extrerrestrial conquerer race that invaded Earth after having destroyed Mars and many planets, including their native planet, earlier. Under the identity of a doctor she had killed and stole her identity earlier, Julia arrived in the Earth along with her partner, Sócrates, and settled down in the coast of the brazillian state of São Paulo, where they founded a medical company named Progenesis. Eventually, she started to create transgenic humans and a mutant human race (including children), who she mantains captive in a island, by vicious human experiments, claimming to want increase humanhold, but actually, she wants to use such mutated humans as weapons to dominate the world and wipe out humanity.

Among these mutants were the twins Maria and Samira, with the first being abandoned by Julia, and the second, being worked and trained by Julia to become a powerful mutant assassin. Isolated from her family and from society by Julia, and being submeted to too much torture, Samira was raised by her to be a ravenous weapon, becoming one of the main antagonists in the plot and one of the most dangerous and murderous mutant, capable to destroy and kill anything or anyone in her path, including children and elderly, a true killing machine created by Julia, after being captive for 30 years until being released to become her assassin, and along the plot, she commits several atrocities under Julia's command. Maria, in turn, who was adopted by a circense family after being abandoned, is incriminated by Julia for killing the aforementioned Sócrates, who Julia Zaccarias killed after he discovered her scheme to create mutants and opposed her. She incriminated her so that she couldn’t spoil her plan and experiences. Julia Zaccarias also killed ou tried to kill all the people who discovers or suspects her schemes, including Sócrates’ brother, Platão (who had been killed) and the wife of her henchman, who survived.

After escaping the island, the dangerous mutant experiments spread in São Paulo, threatening the population and making the city more dangerous, also, making all the mutants, including the good ones, to be chased and an eventually anti-mutant law being released. Eventually, in order to escape the jail, Julia takes an elixir to rejuvenate 20 years old and assumes the identity of Juli di Trevi, her supposed assistant, using her new identity to release Samira, who still does not trust her and attacks her, being sedated by the doctor. Then, Julia/Juli implants a obedience chip, that causes pain on Samira, in order to control and dominate her, using her as weapon. Then she sends Samira to take off two babies of their mothers, the called "babies of prophecy", that are a threat for the repitilians' domination plan. In the struggle to take the babies, Samira initially fails, passes out and Julia used a gas that made both mothers pass out, allowing her and Samira to take the babies. Meanwhile, Maria creates the League of Good, along with others good mutants, to save and protect these two kids. Juli/Julia turns Samira into the archenemesis of her sister and sends her to destroy Maria. With Juli’s command, Samira, Gór and other evil mutants create the “bandit league” to fight the league of good and take the aforementioned babies. But eventually, the elixir’s effect ends up and “Juli” reveals to be Julia.

At a point, Julia was about to shoot a pregnant Maria in front of her father, but she quit because she wants to see Maria’s suffering, submeting her to horrifiying and painfull experiments, instead of giving her a quick death, and later, make Maria, unwittingly and, at the same time, aware, kill her friends with an obedience chip like the one she put in Samira, and suffer with what Julia would force her to do. Also, Julia shows sadism with all of this. She also threats Maria’s father if she refuses to obey her.

When Samira becomes pregnant, breaks free from Julia’s control, redeem herself from her evil acts, especially against her sister and join the good side, Julia Zaccarias arrests her, her sister and the biological and adoptive mother of Maria, looking to kill them all, with both Samira and Maria pregnant. Draco and Telê, two of the bandit league mutants tries to prevent Julia to kill the pregnant twins Maria and Samira, since they believe the children are their. But Julia does not cares and threats to kill them also if they continue opposing her and refusing to attack Samira. Samira ended up shoot by Julia and dies in Maria’s arms.

Julia follows wittingly the orders of an “occult chiefing” and wants a deadly virus to be unleashed and kill all of the humanity, so that the reptilians could dominate planet Earth.

Heinous Standard

It is noteworthy that although Samira was quite cruel, Julia was the one behind Samira's evil. And in addition to serving as a villain of great scope, responsible for making Samira a villain, in addition to several other mutants, Julia is in itself quite hideous, not hesitating and fully willing to kill two pregnant women, as well as having framed Maria, tortured Samira and the mutants, besides happily trying to extinguish the human race with a deadly virus.

Despite following the orders of an “occult chiefing”, Julia shows total consent with everything, not for fear, but why she is a jingoist and also wants everything the “occult chiefing” wants to do. She wants he humanity to be wipped out.

Mitigating Factors

The reptilians they would be wanting to take the land just because their planet was destroyed and they would need a new planet to live on (something similar to the D-Bari in X-Men: Dark Phoenix). However, unlike the D-Bari planet, that was destroyed by a cosmic entity, not by D-Bari themselves, the repitilians was the one responsables for the destruction of, not just their planet, but all the planets they take from themselfs, showing the repitilian race most as a parasitic species than a specie asking for survive.

The only thing that could disqualify her is the care she had with her reptilian commander when he was harmed and was angry when he was killed. The community can decide if it is just a sense of submission/obedience and jingoism. Could she be compared to Bellatrix Lestrange (who cares and helps Voldemort) in this aspect or it is an actual redeeming quality? Actually, I think she should be just a jingoist, not someone able to genuinely love someone, because repitilians are unable to love. To me she is comparable to Bellatrix's loyalty to Voldemort.

Veredict?

I will give a tentative yes to her.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#281022: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:32:55 PM

So long as he gets truncated (even with the new crimes), I'm fine either way, but I do structurally prefer 43's writeup.

YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ordeaux26 Professor Gigachad from Canada Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Professor Gigachad
#281024: Sep 27th 2021 at 2:50:45 PM

I used 43's writeup but made a few changes as there was one sentence issue the makes the timeline messed up.

  • Murdoch Mysteries: James Gillies is Detective William Murdoch's Arch-Enemy. Murdering a professor before escaping execution by switching places with another man, Gillies savagely saws a man's head off while he's still alive. He then initiates a twisted mind game with Murdoch that culminates in him burying Julia alive with her only being narrowly rescued by Murdoch. Gillies returns to frame her for the murder of her husband as part of a ploy to force Murdoch to choose between his own life and Julia's. Arranging for the escape of a group of violent criminals aboard a train, Gillies uses the free murderers as a diversion for his own escape. Years after his supposed death, Gillies, now seeking to end his own life, drives a man to insanity, resulting in the man killing two innocents as well as himself, all just to draw out Murdoch and force his nemesis to kill him.

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance

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