Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the mods to add the trope via this thread
.
This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.
Common problems include:
- Conversation on the Main Page
- Flame Bait
- Squicky content
- Impossible in Real Life
Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.
If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.
If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.
Before adding to the crowner:
- The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
- There must be support from others in thread.
- Any objections should be addressed.
- Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.
When adding to the crowner:
- Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
- Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
- An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).
In order for a crowner to pass:
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- There must be a 2:1 ratio
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
- Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP index
- Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page
Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need crowner vote.
Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.
After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.
NRLEP tag:
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
LRLEO tag:
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
Notes:
- This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
- Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
- As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
- The [[noreallife]] tag doesn't currently work. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. However, there's been some staff conversation (Feb 2024) about what a new technical solution might look like, so we'd advise against deleting these from pages, at least until we have a decision as to whether it'll be fixed or replaced.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 8th 2024 at 10:49:13 AM
Sorcerer in training
Look at the American Revolution. I'm sure the British soldiers had lots of names for the American soldiers, but I doubt "freedom fighters" were one of them. 
Hmmm, looks like everything's voted on and called. Who wants to make the new crowner and holler for a switch? 
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
This reminds me of a quote by the late, great George Carlin:
Nominating Memetic Badass.
Memetic Badass is "A specific form of Memetic Mutation when the fandom of a series exaggerates a character that is simply badass, or sometimes not all that impressive, to preposterously epic god-like levels" (think Chuck Norris Facts). The list at MemeticBadass.Real Life consists of:
- Real people who the contributor thinks are badass ("in Real Life!")
- People who the contributor hopes to become a Memetic Badass, because "they deserve it" and because TV Tropes is a great place to start a new meme.
- Real people whose badassery has been embellished by folklore or popular imagination (which is not the trope, as Memetic Badass is a self-aware exaggeration for laughs).
- A small number of examples which get the definition right, but are rather "general":
Edit: Fixed the bluelink to MemeticBadass.Real Life.
edited 1st Sep '15 11:03:39 AM by LordGro
Let's just say and leave it at that.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Do we have a trope for "people whose badassery has been embellished by folklore or popular imagination"?
Otherwise, yes, I agree.
as Memetic Badass is a self-aware exaggeration for laughs
Huh? The trope definition is about characters whose badassitude is exaggerated by the fandom.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
I just went on Misanthrope Supreme and I'm wondering why it has real life examples (several of which are just personal attacks).
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
That...can't end well (even though it's probably true in some cases, like Panzram).
@4805: Found it. It's Historical Badass Upgrade.
No, the other one.
Misanthrope Supreme is a clear case. Morality?
MemeticBadass.Real Life is, well, completely full of natter. On the other hand, I don't think anyone can deny Chuck Norris fits the trope. On the third hand, he's presented in plenty of media according to the trope.
Then we have others like Simo Häyhä, who isn't exaggerated, and thus, while actually being that badass, don't fit the trope.
Also also, MemeticBadass.Chuck Norris has mostly "Chuck Norris Facts" type stuff for other people. And again lots of ZCEs.
edited 1st Sep '15 6:44:40 AM by AnotherDuck
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Website.Chuck Norris Facts is its own page.
Is it necessary to ban real examples for Card-Carrying Villain? Someone who outright considers themselves to be EVIL, and offers no excuse for their actions, wouldn't be offended by being called "card-carrying villains".
Exactly. But it's a conscious exaggeration for humorous purposes. The fans know the character is not actually that badass in canon. Or as the description says,
"[a] specific form of Memetic Mutation when the fandom of a series exaggerates a character that is simply badass, or sometimes not all that impressive, to preposterously epic god-like levels" (my italics).
Memetic Badass is an Audience Reaction and my understanding is that examples for Audience Reactions are sorted into the media category of the show/work that is being reacted to. At least that is the only system I am aware of. Unfortunately it can lead to conflicts when it is not clear which work exactly is being reacted to. Chuck Norris is an actor who played both in movies and TV shows, therefore the Chuck Norris meme should be filed either under MemeticBadass.Film or MemeticBadass.Live Action TV (I think TV is preferable). Not, however, under MemeticBadass.Real Life, because, even though Chuck Norris is a real name, the meme is really inspired by the actor's screen persona.
Coincidentally, MemeticBadass.Chuck Norris gets it all wrong when it says "Chuck Norris is the Trope Codifier". Insofar as Audience Reactions have a "Trope Codifier", the codifier is the meme called "Chuck Norris Facts". Which, Wikipedia tells me, started out as Vin Diesel facts and hasn't all that much to do with the actual Chuck Norris, because the name of the action star is almost completely exchangeable. There are also Mr. T Facts, almost to a T identical to the Chuck Norris Facts.
edited 1st Sep '15 11:16:30 AM by LordGro
Let's just say and leave it at that.
I think that reading of Memetic Badass is overly narrow.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
So basically what you are saying is that actors typecast as action heroes tend to have this applied to them based on their on-screen personas. That is different from having Memetic Badass being applied to specific work in a specific medium.
Chuck Norris isn't an example of TV or Film, because Chuck Norris isn't a character on TV. He is a Creator, not a Work. These aren't Walker Texas Ranger Facts.
I would say to permit actors as examples because they are closely related to media, but leave out politicians and others.
Also, what to do about the Honey Badger?
edited 1st Sep '15 11:23:27 AM by Catbert
Why?
Okay. But then the example category should be called MemeticBadass.Actors. A "Real Life" section under anything with "Badass" in the title is going to attract problems.
Personally I feel Audience Reactions should not have Real Life sections as a rule.
edited 1st Sep '15 12:34:21 PM by LordGro
Let's just say and leave it at that.
I think you are reading things into the definition that are not quite there. "For laughs" or "self-aware" are not part of the definition. These folklore examples would not qualify as Real Life, though.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Wait, what about my proposal for Card-Carrying Villain?
It's not happening because we have a site policy for not making moral judgments on real people with the wiki.
I know. You said that before. I am, however, fairly certain that I am paraphrasing the trope definition exactly as intended by the author of the description.
I did, in fact, not get it the first time I read it. Only a careful second reading convinced me Memetic Badass is about a type of joke. It is a counterpart to Memetic Molester (a perfectly harmless character is reimagined as a sex offender) and Memetic Psychopath (a perfectly harmless character is reimagined as a dangerous madman). It is about fans making things up about characters of shows they like. It is not fans fawning over their favorite "badass" character in earnest. The many examples of the latter type are just ordinary misuse.
Let's just say and leave it at that.
No, the other one.
Technically, if used properly, we wouldn't be the ones making moral judgments on real people. It would only apply if the people themselves consider themselves Evil.
That said, is there a compelling reason to remove the RL example limitation? How many actual people call themselves Evil without just joking around? Also, I don't personally think it's a good idea to spread their fame for them. Not exactly the kind of people we want to promote, intentionally or not, given the choice. This is aside from Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgment and similar, so there are all in all a lot of different issues with allowing real life people on the trope page.
Cultural Posturing is divided between in-universe posturing about fictional cultures and in-universe posturing about real cultures. The latter is ok I think, but that section has an additional section for people in real life posturing about real life cultures. Isn't this basically Patriotic Fervor by another name?
You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
No, the other one.
The tropes are somewhat different.
Cultural Posturing is shilling a culture. Not necessarily your own.
Patriotic Fervor is about being loyal to your own country. Aside from the slight difference between country and culture (which is often marginal enough to be irrelevant), it's not necessarily about claiming your country is the best one.
Certainly, there's an overlap, but there's a difference.
Now, as far as Real Life examples are concerned, I don't think it's a problem by itself. Attracting natter or using them to complain is another, although I've not checked what if any problems there are with the pages.
Check out my fanfiction!
I'd like to discuss a few tropes:
- Broke Episode: Truth in Television isn't supposed to be used as a heading for Real Life sections, but it is here, as I discovered during a recent wick-cleaning. I hereby petition for it to be placed under the "Narrative, Characterization, and Plot" category of NRLEP.
- Awful British Sex Comedy: This was added during the rush to place everything on Sex Tropes in NRLEP. Despite the indexing, it's not a trope; it's a genre of works that probably wouldn't even fall afoul of the wiki's content policy. I think it should be removed from NRLEP and Sex Tropes.
- "The Villain Sucks" Song: The Real Life section was unilaterally deleted by Nakuyabi over a year ago, on the ground that all Villain Tropes are NRLEP by definition. However, the description says that "the character this song is aimed at doesn't have to be the villain." There are plenty of propaganda songs (some examples of which were kept just because they were in the Music section) that could be written up as examples without the sort of subjective hedging that might plague a Real Life section of, say, White Hair, Black Heart. Should examples about Real Life people be allowed, and where should they be put?
If Awful British Sex Comedy is a genre of works, why would it even have real life examples?
Crown Description:
Vote up to either forbid all real life examples (No Real Life Examples Please) or forbid real life examples for specific subjects (Limited Real Life Examples Only); vote down to Keep Real Life Examples. To add a trope to a No Real Life Examples Please index or the Limited Real Life Examples Only index, its crowner option must meet the following criteria:- Stable 2:1 ratio needed for NRLEP or LRLEO
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple of extra days to see if more votes come in.
That makes sense.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts