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Cleanup thread: Magnificent Bastard

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous post 
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

  • Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.

  • What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
    • Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
    • Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
    • Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
    • Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
    • Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.

  • What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.

  • Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.

  • What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
    • Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
    • Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
    • List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
    • The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.

  • How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.

  • What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.

  • What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.

  • What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.

  • Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.

  • What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.

  • Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.

  • What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.

  • Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.

Thread rules

When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.

Resolved items

In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.

However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.

This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.

Definitely an MB

Definitely not an MB

  • South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#76276: Jun 3rd 2022 at 7:35:23 PM

[tup] King, and thanks for all the well wishes everyone! Now, here's a late birthday present for myself.

So the Dead King was next on my list, but... well, there's a lot to cover for him. I've been waiting for a particularly slow day on CM to get that half of the crossover out first, to sort of establish groundwork for the character for when I bring him over here, but the wait got boring quickly. For now, I'll save him for last and move on to the handful left. Incidentally, they're the main characters.

Anyway, A Practical Guide to Evil again! No, I'm not done with it just yet. In case you forgot, fantasy tropes are tangible laws of reality here and many character archetypes from stories manifest as "Names" that give people superpowers.

Now, before we get into this EP, first we have to talk about the Ranger. While most Names fit into a general good or evil classification, some are a bit more neutral. The Ranger, aka Hye Su, aka the Lady of the Lake, is a brutal Social Darwinist who has honed her skills by slaying all kinds of monsters and gods, becoming easily the most dangerous fighter in the world. After a fling with the Black Knight, one of the leaders of the uber-evil Dread Empire, she's since retired to the Refuge, a village in the woods where the only rules are "do what you want so long as it doesn't go against what the Lady says" and "don't come whining to her about your problems." There she "trains" her various pupils she's picked up in her journeys, and it's... well, I mentioned the whole Social Darwinist bit already, right? Let's just say it's abusive and move on.

Who is Indrani, the Archer?

Originally a young slave girl, Indrani caught Hye's interest at an auction one day. The Ranger, apparently feeling bored that week, stole a bow on sale, gave it to the girl, and told her to shoot her owner. So began a heartwarming mother-daughter relationship.

Whereas the other students she had brought to Refuge were usually left grievously injured and/or traumatized after their Lady's life-threatening lessons, Indrani took to them with gusto, wholeheartedly embracing the social darwinism teachings and reveling in her newfound freedom (not to say she wasn't psychologically scarred by the experience, the Blood Knight tendencies Hye cultivated left her with horrible social skills that alienated her from the other students, but she came out with a happier attitude in comparison). By the present, she's following in her mentor's footsteps as an unstoppable warrior wandering the land for anything that can challenge her.

First meeting our lovely protagonist, Catherine Foundling, upon being sent to retrieve one of the Ranger's students who was captured after ignoring her orders to leave the Dread Empire alone, Indrani decides to briefly stick around to kill some devils Cat just so happened to be in a pitched battle against. Intrigued enough to return when Cat somehow accidentally pisses off the entire realm of the fae, Indrani proves to be a versatile and creative fighter and semi-officially joins Cat's growing Five-Man Band, the Woe.

Indrani's whole shtick is basically being an overly dramatic, scatterbrained, perpetually drunk One-Woman Army. For just a few examples, she ventures into an abominable hellscape filled with angry ghosts to retrieve stuff for Cat, fighting off said ghosts as if they were mildly annoying mosquitoes; steals an undead flying horse to crash into an enemy fortress and snipe their officers so their retreat is as disorganized as possible; survives a scuffle with the nightmare grandma known as the Saint of Swords, also taking the time to scope out her limitations; pre-emptively counter-assassinates numerous assassins out to kill Cat; and, having not paid a second of attention in their war council, randomly decides to lobotomize a fae Count into leading a massive attack on Cat's Arch-Enemy under the reasoning "Yeah, that's probably what she wanted me to do, good enough job for today."

Skipping ahead a bit, Indrani eventually gets the chance to reconcile with her fellow students from Refuge and challenges Hye for the Name of Ranger, asserting that she wants to be better — not just be a better fighter or monster slayer, but a better person who won't abandon her loved ones or try to mold her wards into sociopaths. They fight in the middle of a burning building, and Indrani and three of her friends manage to win. They each take a blade to their teacher's face, both as revenge for the neuroses she beat into her other students that got them killed, and to symbolize that they've outgrown her lessons. However, they don't kill her, leaving who now holds the Ranger Name in question.

Skipping ahead to the climax, and Hye, for unimportant reasons, has agreed to help Cat infiltrate the Dead King's fortress. Unfortunately, the Dead King decides to release a giant undead dragon god on them at that time. Yes, he just has one of those lying around. He's awesome. Hye immediately nopes out... but an integral part of the story of the Ranger is challenging monsters, no matter the danger. So Indrani picks up her bow, draws back the string, and jumps into the fight as the new Ranger.

She doesn't kill the abominable god monster, of course. A heroine called the Witch of the Woods turns herself into another god and commits murder-suicide (seriously, read this fucking series, I swear it is the greatest thing ever put into words). Still, it's pretty awesome. In the epilogues, she's busy doing what the Ranger does best: travelling the world and killing monsters, but always making time to return to her friends.

Is she magnificent?

For someone who openly admits their strategies amount to little more than "fight the enemy until it dies?" Absolutely. Indrani is a brilliant and resourceful warrior who, for all her (Played for Laughs) witlessness, remains surprisingly insightful in matters of strategy whenever she deigns to pay attention, not to mention the stories this world runs on — she's the first to realize that Cat going to war with the drow may have been the result of subtle manipulations by the Gods themselves to raise a lesser deity in service to Hell (long story, don't ask). She almost never listens to Cat's orders when she's sent off to scout, but she'll nevertheless always find a way to make herself useful and decimate the enemy with little effort.

As one chapter comment I found succinctly put it, she's basically abridged!Alucard — unrepentantly crass and provocative with only the bare minimum regard for what her superiors want, but when shit gets real she's unquestionably the one you want on your side to kill the problem with ruthless efficiency.

Is she a bastard? Too much of one?

A self-admitted hedonist who is completely upfront that she's only sticking around for the opportunity to kill more people, and happily assists Cat in her adventure to enslave the drow (they're slavers themselves, so she's naturally unsympathetic towards any karmic punishments due to her history, and in any case their society is already slowly devolving into a self-inflicted genocide of a ruined nation. Under Cat they're basically doing the same warmongering they were already doing, only under one banner and with rules against teamkilling, which with drow you absolutely have to specify). Pretty bad, but still meh enough to get by with this series' heinous standard.

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#76277: Jun 3rd 2022 at 7:42:29 PM

[tup]Indrani.

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
Amanofmanyinterests Gotta love Jaws! Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#76279: Jun 3rd 2022 at 9:43:22 PM

[tup] Indrani

Hey guys, I’m currently at work, so how about a special EP?

What's the Work?

Michael Rosen is a loveably British children’s poet and storyteller best known for his videos of himself acting out his old stories.

We’ll be looking at one of them. “The Skyfoogle”, a very short story about a magnificent monster that catches everybody’s eyes. Or does it?

Who is He?

The Man is the one who spreads the word of the Skyfoogle, which can be seen at his circus.

What does he do?

I’ll let Mr. Rosen’s story do the talking.

“There was a man who turned up around our way once, put up a tent in the park he did, put notices all round the streets saying he was going to put on show, ‘A terrifying creature called... 'The Skyfoogle.’

No one had even seen this thing before, the show was on for 2 o'clock the next day. Next day, we all turned up to see... ‘the fiercest animal in the world!’ The man took the money at the door. We all poured into the tent, with a curtain in front of it. We all sat down and waited, the man went off behind the curtains, and suddenly, we all heard a terrible noise.

There was an awful yelling and crying, there was the noise of chains rattling, and someone shouting, suddenly the man came running on to the stage in front of the curtains! All his clothes were torn, there was blood on his face and he screamed... ‘QUICK! GET OUT! GET OUT OF HERE! THE SKYFOOGLE HAS ESCAPED!’

We all got up and ran out the door and got away as fast as we could, By the time we got ourselves together the man had gone! We never saw him again! None of us ever saw our money again either.

And none of us, has ever seen, the Skyfoogle...”

Yep, there never was a Skyfoogle.

Is he charming? Intelligent? Able to think on his feet?

The Man convinces everybody to come to his show by crafting a believable tall tale, then once he has everyone’s money, he pretends the Skyfoogle escaped just so everyone can leave, allowing him to take the money and escape scott free.

That takes skill, and it’s implied the Man has done this more than once.

Is he a bastard? Too much of one?

The Man’s a conman who successfully scams an entire town of people out of their money.

But damn if his plan isn’t ingenious. He’s clearly a bad guy who enables a mass "Shaggy Dog" Story on the town (plus several other towns just like it) but manages to get away with it all with style and great acting on his part.

Verdict?

I think he keeps. It’s a short story for kids, but there’s a clear plot and a unique twist ending. The Man also has enough character I believe to keep.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Jun 3rd 2022 at 9:45:11 AM

"No running in the halls!"
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#76280: Jun 3rd 2022 at 9:46:27 PM

Yes to The Man, Indrani, King, and Dragon.

Before I write up Boogaloo, I have another Halloween Ghostbusters villain from Real Ghostbusters...

Who is Samhain? What has he done?

Samhain is an ancient Celtic spirit that is the basis of the celebration of Halloween. 1200 years ago he was trapped in some ruins in Ireland. Today the ruins are brought to NYC to be displayed in a museum. Some goblins break into the museum and free Samhain from the ruins. Samhain uses his magic to summon an army of ghosts to terrorize NYC, summons a cloud of darkness that spreads across the world, and slows down time so that Halloween last forever.

The Ghostbusters start trapping Samhain's minions and Samhain confronts the Ghostbusters, unhappy that they are attacking his minions, calling them his little ones. At first, the Ghostbusters seem to be no match for him, but Egon deduces his weakness, that light weakens him. Egon shines a flashlight on him, forcing him to flee.

Samhain takes over a skyscraper and makes it his HQ. Samhain summons all the ghosts in the city to join him, which forces Slimer to come to Samhain. Samhain deduces Slimer is allied with mortals, Samhain's minions want to destroy Slimer, but Samhain has other ideas.

The city is hit by a blackout, so Ray, Peter, and Winston confront Samhain and Egon gets some floodlights and hooks them up with his proton pack to power them. The Ghostbusters confront Samhain and he threatens to destroy Slimer if the Ghostbusters do not surrender. The Ghostbusters manage to free Slimer and Egon hits Samhain with the floodlights, weakening him so the Ghostbusters can capture him. Samhain is in the containment unit, just sitting there, waiting for his chance to be free again.

A couple of years later, on Halloween, the same goblins free Samhain from the containment unit during a Halloween party. Samhain casts a spell on the firehouse, transforming it into his personal fortress. The Ghostbusters try to attack Samhain with light and their proton packs, but Samhain's fortress is surrounded by a forcefield that will not allow light or the proton beams to harm him, only ghosts can enter the fortress.

Samhain sends his minions to kill the Ghostbusters and the Ghostbusters defeat them. Samhain annoyed that his minions failed, goes out with his minions to get the Ghostbusters. Samhain doesn't find the Ghostbusters, but he does find the Junior Ghostbusters, a group of kids that idolize the Ghostbusters. Samhain captures the Junior Ghostbusters, intending to use them to force the Ghostbusters to surrender to him.

The Ghostbusters decide to use Slimer and have him enter the fortress, with a camera and headphones. Slimer makes his way to Samhain's throne room, where the keystone and the Junior Ghostbusters are present. The keystone is where the containment unit used to be, if it is destroyed, the fortress will collapse. The Ghostbusters and Slimer distract Samhain, while Janine blasts the keystone apart. Slimer manages to save the Junior Ghostbusters and an enraged Samhain confronts the Ghostbusters. But the destruction of his fortress undoes all of Samhain's magic, trapping him and his minions in the containment unit again.

Is he magnificent?

In his first appearance, he seems to rely more on fancy powers than cleverness, but he deduces Slimer is an ally of mortals and he used him as a hostage against the Ghostbusters. In his second appearance he seems to have learned from his past defeat, he turns the Ghostbusters' HQ into his personal fortress and the Ghostbusters are unable to harm Samhain with light or proton beams while he is in his fortress. He is very no-nonsense unlike Boogaloo, he simply responds to Peter's jokes with an annoyed look in his first appearance. He also takes the Ghostbusters much more seriously in his second appearance, wanting them dead right away so they cannot trap him again.

He does have something of a breakdown after each defeat, screaming no as he is defeated, but I think that is due to not liking being imprisoned. After his first defeat, he is simply waiting in the containment unit for his chance to be free, so these breakdowns seem temporary.

Is he a bastard? Too much?

He is not a nice guy, he wants to blanket the world in eternal darkness and has his ghosts terrorize NYC. He is no problem playing dirty, willing to threaten Slimer and the Junior Ghostbusters to make the Ghostbusters back down.

But ultimately he is just a take-over-the-world villain and he does care for his minions. He chooses to capture the Junior Ghostbusters out of convenience, he doesn't actively target kids the way the Boogieman or the Grundel does. He is nowhere near the worst of the Ghostbuster villains.

Final Verdict?

Yes to this spirit of Halloween.

You can watch the episodes free and legal here:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2wynstOVNdY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y30_iB3vAUg&t=1161s

Edited by Overlord on Jun 4th 2022 at 5:47:29 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#76281: Jun 3rd 2022 at 9:55:25 PM

No issue to either of the above!

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#76282: Jun 3rd 2022 at 10:00:27 PM

[tup]Samhain.

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
DoodSlayer136 Woagh from Pizza Tower (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
TellAll111 Since: Jun, 2010
#76284: Jun 3rd 2022 at 10:25:09 PM

[tup] for the Noble Dragon, King, Indrani, the Man, and Samhain.

Whoa, glad you're okay, Emerald. Happy birthday otherwise.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#76285: Jun 3rd 2022 at 10:36:21 PM

Yes to Indrani, the Man and Samhain. Good work!

TellAll111 Since: Jun, 2010
#76286: Jun 3rd 2022 at 11:02:18 PM

Okay, I've just seen the CM thread and yeah, I'm reiterating my [tup] for the new rule. I very nearly zoned out, because of how bad it got today.

DocSharp Since: Jun, 2011
#76287: Jun 4th 2022 at 12:29:28 AM

Yes to Indrani, the Man, and Samhain.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#76288: Jun 4th 2022 at 2:23:34 AM

[tup] Dragon, King, Indrani, Man and Samhain

Snowy66 Since: May, 2012
#76289: Jun 4th 2022 at 4:52:13 AM

[tup]Indrani, Michael Rosen's Man, Samhain

Happy Birthday Emerald!

Libraryseraph Showtime! from Canada (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
Showtime!
#76290: Jun 4th 2022 at 5:24:21 AM

[tup] to Samhain , Idrani and the Man

Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#76291: Jun 4th 2022 at 9:33:40 AM

[tup] Samhain and the Man.

Wasn't King Solomon from Lucifer approved a while ago? I can't find his write-up on the main DCU page.

Klavice Since: Jan, 2011
#76292: Jun 4th 2022 at 1:41:10 PM

Yes to the Man, (love that poem) Idrani and Samhain.

Edited by Klavice on Jun 4th 2022 at 1:42:02 AM

LoreDeluxe Since: May, 2013
#76293: Jun 4th 2022 at 5:50:17 PM

  • Guards! Guards!: The Noble Dragon was at first merely summoned by royal secretary Lupine Wonse to be slain by a puppet king to gain control over Ankh-Morpork, but she quickly grew to have her own ambitions. Using her mental connection to Wonse, the Dragon engineered her own summoning and quickly gained control of the city by roasting the puppet king at his own coronation. A master at coordinated terror, she subjugated Wonse into being her mouthpiece and invited the heads of the city's powerful guilds to a banquet to intimidate them into providing wealth and promises of sacrifices. While a terrifying monster herself, the Dragon grew disgusted with the people's almost giddy acceptance of her terms. Unmatched for most of her reign, the small swamp dragon Errol stunned her with a sonic boom and earned her respect and love, both then leaving humanity behind to wander the cosmos.

Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
magnumtropus Since: Aug, 2020
#76294: Jun 4th 2022 at 6:42:11 PM

[tup] to Indrani, Samhain, and the Man

A while back, MCU Nebula was approved as an MB, but I wonder if the version of her, from Avengers: Endgame, who returns to 2023 in place of the original, is a distinct enough character to count.

She fools the Avengers into thinking that she is the OG Nebula, and brings Thanos and his army to the present without raising anyone's suspicion (though tbf, they had other things to worry about)

Edited by magnumtropus on Jun 4th 2022 at 1:45:02 PM

jjjj2 from Arrakis Since: Jul, 2015
#76295: Jun 4th 2022 at 6:46:06 PM

I think we talked about her, if I remember correctly we decided while she was distinct enough she was ultimately completely under Thanos' thumb and thus too tragic to count, but I could be remembering wrong.

You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#76296: Jun 4th 2022 at 7:12:39 PM

Yeah, the 2014 Nebula was deemed too broken to count.

Amanofmanyinterests Gotta love Jaws! Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#76298: Jun 5th 2022 at 6:46:23 AM

Second Wano EP go!

Who is the CP0 boss? What has he done?

Strangely never named despite having decent-sized roles in two arcs (keep in mind, Eiichiro Oda once gave a name to a bug that fell into somebody's soup), this character is a field leader, and possibly the overall head, of the World Government's strongest intelligence agency: Cipher Police AIGIS 0, or CP0 for short. There are ten Cipher Police agencies - CP1 through 8 handle general intelligence duties in ascending order of importance; CP9, which doesn't officially exist (and to which longstanding MB Rob Lucci belongs!), carries out political murders; and CP0 is outside the hierarchy of the others, serving as the personal bodyguards and hatchetmen of the World Nobles, the government's depraved and hedonistic uppermost class.

This particular guy, recognizable by his dapper bowler hat, white trench coat, and Mardi Gras-style face mask, first shows up with two other agents in the Dressrosa arc on Doflamingo's orders, where he helps out with Doffy's ruse to fake resigning from the Seven Warlords to bait the Straw Hats and Trafalgar Law into a trap. He reassured the Dressrosa populace that everything is all going according to plan, and then isn't seen again.

He has a much, much bigger role at Wano, where he again arrives at the head of a delegation of three agents (one of the ones from Dressrosa and a new one named Maha), conducting backroom deals with Shogun Orochi. Orochi's terms are flatly refused when he demands Dr. Vegapunk be surrendered to his custody in exchange for Wano's resources. During the final battle at Onigashima, the trio calmly play go in a side room while the war rages outside while reporting back to the Government's leaders, the Five Elders. The boss and Maha join the fight in its latter stages at the Elders' orders (the second flunky stays behind to keep in contact with them), and the duo defeat X Drake and Scratchmen Apoo before Maha and the Star Hats' ally Izo take each other out. Now alone, the boss receives a final order from the Elders - ignore all other targets and take out Luffy, now. The boss heads to the top of Kaido's palace, where he and Luffy are fighting, and just as Luffy is about to land a major blow to Kaido, the CP0 boss jumps and restrains him, allowing Kaido to pummel him nearly to death with his club.

But as Lighty's EP established, Kaido does not like dirty tactics, even when they benefit him. He asks the CP0 boss if the latter knows what's coming. The boss answers in the affirmative with a calm tip of his hat to Kaido... and the club comes down once again.

Mitigating issues?

Surprisingly enough for a minor, unnamed character? I can't really think of any major ones. He's certainly intelligent and tactical, taking part in Doffy's ruse that nearly sends our heroes to their doom, interfering in the final battle of Wano to ensure that the World Government wins out over Luffy, Kaido, and all the other PIRATE SCUM present, and accepting his ultimate fate with utter suaveness. Plus, he and his pals play go, you know, the hardest board game ever? That certainly earns magnificence points in and of itself I should say!

And yeah, he's a bastard - he's an assassin working for the One Piece world's equivalents of the guys from Salo. Honestly, absolute loyalty to that gang of debauched cretins is the only potential complication I can see here.

Verdict?

Very much leaning yes. If he makes it I'll write up him and King together. Wano candidate #3 will wait a few weeks as I still think he has a bit of story left in him.

Bye for now; eager to see how you vote!

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#76299: Jun 5th 2022 at 9:52:38 AM

Interesting minor catch HT and a yes there!

EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!

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