Removing Gushing from the Wiki

With regards to the Flamingo entry: I've checked the page history and nearly all of the edits were made by the same troper. The only exceptions are the Screams Like a Little Girl entry, and a mod removing Needs Wiki Magic Love, extra spaces and commented out tropes that do not belong on the main page (as well as an aversion). Even the edit reason upon the page being created is rather gushy ("yay this marks the first Flamingo tv tropes page!").

Edited by Shadow8411 on Apr 1st 2021 at 2:05:02 AM

This was in the YMMV page for UTAU:

• Fridge Brilliance: Tei SCREAMS this. Using a lot of Hatsune's songs to usurp Hatsune, hardly using any of Len's songs so as to NOT usurp him, using other Vocaloid songs to take over, ect.
  • As of the chorus for Five Nights at Freddy's, Tei is a kitsune. Fridge Brilliance sets in upon that Foxy is the most famous of the original four.

For clarification, UTAU is a singing voice program that can be made by anyone and Tei is no exception. There isn't anything from fans stopping her from singing any of Len's songs. Also I'm not sure if the second example is a good example for Fridge Brilliance or not, especially since the video link is unavailable.

...what does that first part even mean? "Tei scream Fridge Brilliance"? I don't understand how it's trying to use the trope, but it's likely misuse.

The second part seems like sheer coincidence as well.

Edited by jandn2014 on Apr 7th 2021 at 5:59:42 AM

Skimmed through the Comic Books page for Mr. Fanservice and found these:

Admit it, you're staring.^note  Men, you're not excluded from this.Even the image caption feels gushy.

It can be generally stated that most comic book heroes are this. Skin-tight clothing on muscled bodies? Hell yeah! Gushy on top of being a general example.

Dick Grayson. There's a reason why he always ends up parading around shirtless or in his underwear, and his tendency to get tied up... often while shirtless or in his underwear. It's because Nightwing makes female Bat-fans. He also tends to suffer extensive Clothing Damage and gratuitous shots of his lovingly rendered ass (such as the one viewable to the right). While this example is valid, it feels very gushy. That pause makes me worry about this being troped with one hand.

• Especially in Grayson in which he becomes a sexy spy. Characters in-universe refer to his good looks & physique often. One recurring Anti-Villain, because of perception-scrambling implants obscuring Dick's face, is able to identify him solely by his ass. Seems legit, although I think this would fit better under Chick Magnet and maybe Even the Guys Want Him, I don't think Mr. Fanservice can be in-universe. Also, incorrect indentation, if this is valid then it can be merged with the first bullet.
• All the male Robins. You've got Jason, who has a dark and troubled past and a tendency to wear leather jackets. Tim, a dork with his tendency to ponder his next move and life situation in gratuitous shower scenes. Even Damian has his fangirls. Not sure why these can't be moved into separate examples under the same franchise. Jason doesn't sound like a Mr. Fanservice, just a bad boy. If he is intended for fanservice, then the entry doesn't really get that across. Tim sounds like an Adorkable nerd who has Shirtless Scenes, it doesn't mention anything about his appearance. The Damian example is gushy on top of being a ZCE. Personality has nothing to do with this trope anyway.

Asterix The Gaul gives us Tragicomix, who is blonde, handsome, and never wears a shirt so as to allow viewers to see his very nicely built chest. The "very nicely built" part feels gushy.

Booster Gold was made for this trope. Tall, blonde, muscular, pretty, form-fitting outfit that gets shredded a lot, and a great ass. His character development from money-grubbing media whore to tragic genuine hero doesn't hurt either. What does his characterization have to do with fanservice? Also, "X was made for this trope" is Word Cruft.

Tony Stark could have very well made his fortune by getting a nickel for every time he ends up naked, tied up, brainwashed, imperiled, or otherwise put into situations that give the fangirls squee-fodder. There is at least one blog solely dedicated to all the times the various incarnations of Tony end up at least half-nude, and it's quite large. The "give fangirls squee fodder" is unnecessary gushing. I don't think the blog mention is needed either. What's fanservice-y about being brainwashed and imperiled?

Of the Flashes, Wally is usually the one who gets the most female attention, and for good reason. K, Why though? This entry also comes off as mentioning out-of-universe attraction, which isn't what this trope is. Mr/Ms Fanservice is for characters themed around fanservice, not just characters that the fanbase finds hot. Some parts of fandoms will want to fornicate with anything, that doesn't make that character a Mr/Ms Fanservice.

Superman himself isn't immune to this treatment, even if it's rarely focused on. By sheer dint of his looks and Heroic Build, and his general adorableness and Nice Guy personality, the Man of Steel has been subjected to his share of Shirtless Scenes. The New 52 had his first panel in one issue benchpressing the equivalent of the Earth's weight. In nothing but his boxers. It also extends to the actors cast to play him in just about every live action adaptation. Personality isn't needed. Also, Is mentioning the attractiveness of the actors really necessary?

• Then there's the Kon-El Superboy, specifically designed to be a younger hotter Superman visually with bad boy imagery included by way of his leather jacket, shades and earring to go with his upbeat too cool for school Fun Personified personality. Personality has nothing to do with fanservice. He doesn't sound like a Mr. Fanservice, just a bad boy that the troper found hot.

Daredevil has the reputation of being "the greatest himbo to have ever worn tights" and is indeed a huge Chick Magnet. Red-headed lean hunk, and you could even argue those milky eyes give him a strange allure. Mentions out-of-universe attractiveness. "You could even argue those milky eyes give him a strange allure", Examples Are Not Arguable.

We might need a fanservice cleanup thread. Issues with lewdness aside, it attracts gushing and some of the examples involve out-of-universe attraction towards characters not intended for fanservice. Shirtless Scene also has a problem with ZC Es, if it's tropeworthy at all.

A long-term cleanup thread for fanservice tropes isn't a terrible idea. By their nature, they're inherently always going to attract a higher degree than normal of badly written examples.

I'm open to a long-term Fanservice cleanup.

Seems like a good idea!

Good idea.

Guess I'll make a thread then. My only concern is it being redundant with the lewdness thread. Problems with lewdness aren't restricted to fanservice tropes, and vice-versa, but fanservice tropes are where most of the creepiness comes from.

Edited by RainbowPumpqueen on Apr 8th 2021 at 1:02:03 AM

YMMV.The Trials Of Apollo is very gushy about Rick Riordan in general and LGBT representation, which distracts from the rest of the page's neutral tone, and said representation has come into question in recent years as more people found problems with the work(s). I've never read the series but I think the page is overdoing it with the gushing, at least.

EDIT: Awesome.Rick Riordan is a thing and is one of the most gushy things I've ever read.

Edited by lalalei2001 on Apr 10th 2021 at 9:26:53 AM

Not sure where else to ask about this, but do I have permission to just cut the entirety of Demon Slayer Kimetsu No Yaiba? None of the entries do anything to explain how the actors share a particularly noticeable relationship. It's just lists of instances where several voice actors collaborated in another project.

I'd say so. Relationship Voice Actor is kinda a Just for Fun thing in disguise with how much it's been misused.

Honestly, it's one of those pages where the TRS backlog is the only thing preventing me from attempting to have it cut. (Though making it JFF does sound like an acceptable compromise for the people who are into that sort of thing.)

I think I found some gushing in YMMV.The Annoying Orange. Under Broken Base it says that some people consider the show bad, "but it's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be", which seems too defensive.

That's misuse of Broken Base anyway, as it has to refer to the fanbase, not the hatedom. Unless it's referring to the web show's fanbase but that's unclear.

This line from The Mist. Scroll all the way down to the bottom...

• Another meta-example: Marcia Gay Harden's performance as Mrs. Carmody. It takes world-class talent to play a character the audience loves to hate instead of just outright hates, and her performance is flawless. It won her a much-deserved Saturn Award for Best Supporting Actress. — That sounds... like a fanboy Squeeing all over the trope page. You can literally say that about ANY good actor who gets to play a Hate Sink once in a while. Cut?

Edited by RobertTYL on Apr 23rd 2021 at 9:57:53 PM

It's a meta moment, so it should be cut regardless.

I was searching a work's related pages and came across Awesome.Cinema Sins Absolved, which seems to be a list of every single time Cinema Sins removed a sin from a movie/game/show, and some are just 'x actor in x role'.

But if that is the only reason CinemaSins actually gave for removing the sin...

(well, the fact I don't like that much their videos is how the reasons for adding to the sin counter are too often void of context)

I found these entries on YMMV Eddsworld:

• Creator Worship: To say Edd Gould is looked upon with such love and admiration is an understatement, with many people still labelling him as an inspiration and praising his determination to do whatever he desired with Eddsworld, with some still missing him despite being gone after so many years. It also helps he was an avid One of Us (notably being a huge cartoon lover such as enjoying Adventure Time and was even a brony!) and an immensely Nice Guy adored by his friends and colleagues (if the posts by Matt and Tom give an indication). It's even believed that this is why Shadbase (a notoriously infamous NSFW artist best described elsewhere) became such a despised figure when they did a Dude, Not Funny! picture in response to Gould's passing. That's how respected the man is!

And then there's this...

• Too Cool to Live: Edd Gould, a very witty, Nice Guy, and overall chill individual who had creativity abound only to pass away in 2012 in his young twenties. The world is not fair.

Btw, I made a Fanservice cleanup thread like I said I would.

Zap them all to hell, and cite this thread as edit reason

Creator.Norio Wakamoto really needs to be toned down. There's currently an Image Pickin' thread for the image but the description also needs work.

I found this on the page for Dynamic Character. It seems really defensive and gush-y:

• The Nostalgia Chick has evolved from "Lindsay acting like the Critic" to a pathetic, nuanced, sympathetic failure of a human being. While it might not sound like a good thing, ask yourself, how many female characters do we have like that?

What in the fuck. I mean, I guess what they mean is that she's a "likable loser" kind of persona, but it honestly sounds like they want more women to be failures.

Speaking as a woman, I do hate the You Go, Girl! kind of attitude that doesn't allow female characters to have realistic relatable flaws, but speaking as an on-and-off Channel Awesome fan, I don't like the annoying amounts of gushing the old TGWTG pages attract, especially not those that end with complaining. Nostalgia Chick is a pretty decent character but she's really not that deep.

I could try to rewrite it, but I've been wondering: why does Dynamic Character even have examples anyway? Feels like a recipe for gushing about how complex a character is. At least the inversion, Static Character, is worth describing as an aversion of what we expect from characters in most stories. Even this very entry seems covered better by Character Development.

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 26th 2021 at 6:33:37 AM