Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

I agree with N, though I will say that I don't feel like the edits are necessary

Abstain on Beckett.

As for the Trunchbull entries, I'm staying out of the conversation.

I've gotten chewed out for trying to re-rail the thread before, N. So, please understand that I don't mean to overstep my boundaries when I suggest that you please knock it off resist the urge to do so.

If you think the thread has derailed too much, you can holler. Otherwise, I think we just may be better off letting the discussion run its course.

Edit: I'm rephrasing it to sound as civil as I originally intended. Additionally, I never said he was wrong about the thread being derailed. I just wasn't sure if making a post saying as such was the correct way to address it.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Oct 23rd 2019 at 12:35:49 PM

That could have been said in another way. I think N has the right to express his opinion if he wants to... and he's right; echoing Tyk, PMs are there for a reason.

Hm... Gotta think on Beck. That said, I'd recommend bring him to the Hate Sink thread too; sounds like he'd be an easy upvote there.

Gonna give a no to Beck. Not convinced he's heinous enough. Maybe if more emphasis was placed on his time as a serial killer, but as it is, it seems to be treated like a side note.

Leaning to Beck for now due to heinous standard concerns. Can I get some more elaboration on what the heinous standard is like?

@Demon: I will modify the EP to be in HS format some time tonight or tomorrow.

@Awesome: Yeah I get that. It's not a hill I am willing to die on. I just read the story and thought he was worth discussing.

@Dragon: It's in the same m multiverse as a vampire who started a war and wiped out almost all of a royal bloodline, a werewolf who eats people and sold out her own kind, and a wizard who ran a human trafficking ring (she doesn't count dou to redeeming qualities). Hence my abstain. Though it should be noted that all those ones were supernatural beings while he was just a human. And it was only retroactively added to the multiverse.

Edited by Bullman on Oct 23rd 2019 at 12:42:40 PM

Rando

Abstain on Beck

Abstain on Beck.

Speaking of cuts, I may need to remove a certain candidate from the past, Jack Collector from The Angel's Game. He's still the most sadistic, depraved character in the setting who brags about killing an autistic boy and other atrocities, but I definately overlooked the relationship between him and his girlfriend. After analyzing the forgotten blog spinoff in more detail, which is seen from his POV, the Collector does see her as a partner-in-crime to share his twisted hobby, but he also goes out of his way to protect her; when she is tortured by an Anti-Hero for murdering the girlfriend of his host, the Collector not only does his best to not take it personal, but he also calls for medical attention to save her, ordering his associates to drug her if they have to but to not leave a scratch on her. It may be out-of-character for him to actually sympathize with his Arch-Enemy but it did come across as a genuine Pet the Dog moment to humanize the wild beast that he is, brief as it may be.

Edited by TheMadCr0w on Oct 23rd 2019 at 4:45:57 PM

Well then, let's blow Jack Collector's entry out of the sky.

Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on Oct 23rd 2019 at 8:31:27 PM

Cut Collector in that case

Cut Collector in that case.

Cut Collector.

As for Joker, I think we can change "Jack also abuses his girlfriend, Alicia Hunt, disfiguring and eventually killing her, before trying to seduce Vicki Vale immediately after her death."

to: "Jack also abuses his girlfriend, Alicia Hunt, disfiguring her, before trying to seduce Vicki Vale immediately after her death."

I removed all of the Honkai stuff from video games.

Edited by ACW on Oct 24th 2019 at 3:01:29 PM

I don't see the need for the Change

Becka

Rando; abstain on Beckett. "Cut" to Collector.

Alright, to reiterate @Servbot's post, the 12th Herrscher isn't explicitly said to have caused the Black Plague, although it's hinted at because another manga mentions the Plague having some sentience.

However, the Overseer started human experimentations and eventually opens the Box, but again it happens on-screen and by that time, the Plague was already a thing. So yes, you can scratch the following line from the Complete Monster entry:

So:

• Complete Monster: The Great Overseer of Schicksal is the first leader of Schicksal Organization and the father of Otto Apocalypse. Initially presented as a benevolent figure helping several European princes create a feudal order and stop the Honkai in order to take back the lost lands that the latter conquered, the Overseer reveals his true power-hungry nature by performing experiments on innocent civilians to turn them into zombies or monsters and kickstarting a war with the Ming Empire. Losing the war, the Overseer extorts the money from poor civilians and allows his priests and aristocrats to abuse the population as they please, and later attempts again to start a war with the Ming Empire again.

Abstain on Beck.

Alright, now for the discussion Meta Runner’s first season, which is completely amazing and I recommend you check it out. As for anyone who qualifies, I strongly believe that Lucks, the head of TA Scorp and the series’ big bad, is a serious contender. Lucks has already displayed some truly heinous crimes, such as having Tari’s Meta Runner arm experimented on and causing her great pain, something that Lucks shows no concern for in episode 2. According to MD 5, and a quick glimpse from Sofia’s demonstration of operation silent demon, Lucks has destroyed countless lives, and has Meta Runners tortured via electricity. In the season 1 finale, Lucks is at his most vicious, where he ruthlessly shoots Masa’s Meta Runner arm, threatens to kill him if Sofia does not surrender herself and delete the TA Scorp info that she had stolen, threatens to kill Belle of she makes another mistake, has Tari, Theo, who is a kid mind you, and Lamar tortured with electricity, and finally, when Tari offers to join TA Scorp in exchange for letting her friends go, Lucks decides to up the stakes by smashing Theo’s Cartridge, causing him to vanish before Tari’s horrified eyes, and then taking the chip where Theo is now trapped in, and threatens that if Tari does not stay loyal to him or if MD 5 interferes with his plans again, he will erase the chip and kill Theo, who is, again, A CHILD!

Personally, I think Lucks has enough crimes to qualify. But I’m not gonna EP him just yet. Why? Because there’s a scene in the post credits scene involving Lucks having someone in cryostasis, which may or may not support Belle’s claims of Lucks being a Well Intended Extremist, especially if the subject turns out to be supposedly deceased Meta Runner, Lucinia, Belle’s best friend and Sofia’s sister. Personally, I think what Lucks has planned is NOT well intended at all, but just to be safe, and to see if he has more heinous crimes in Season 2, I’m gonna out Lucks on the wait and see until Season 2 is completed, which I’m gonna go ahead and reserve it as well, and Austin DR, if you want, you can collab with me on Meta Runner’s second season, it’s always nice to be a part of a collab. Personally, I believe Lucks will count in the future, but only time will tell.

Collector

@Lightysnake and August. Ishtar is viewed as exceptionally heinous by all the other characters in the series, once her acts become known. She is universally condemned, even by those familia who weren't directly affected.

Edited by Overlord_2018 on Oct 24th 2019 at 5:44:31 AM

‘Heinous standard’ means what crimes do the other villains commit and how is your character nastier than them? It also means: Are your character’s atrocities remarkable or unique in the setting or the genre the work belongs to?

Though I will say, the fact that she's viewed as heinous in story, while not THE factor, definitely works in her favor.

@ Overlord_2018

For more information about the heinous standard, look here.

Basically just how she compares to other villains and if her deeds are worse or unique.