During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
That depends. Was that question about the Metal Gear Solid series. Sorry, just needed to be sure.
The wifi here sucks
I think you're talking about Huey Emmerich. I haven't gotten far into the game buy his character folder here makes sounds like he could count
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Liquid Chris (anyone get the reference ?)
But don't feel to bad; I'm getting dozens of awful folks who barely scrap the heinous barrier. Thanks SpookyRice.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
I COULD Effort Post Huey, but first I need some clarification. Is everyone alright with me Effort posting Dr. Huey Emmerich.
Edited by Michealthehero21 on May 14th 2019 at 5:05:26 AM
Shin Megami Tensei IV
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Victor Guisman
Okay, I would like to have a CM removed: Leo from the Kirby fanfic Cupies . Here is his entry:
- Leo is a sadistic dragon who torments the Cupie Kingdom. A greedy creature, Leo attacks the Cupie Kingdom, during which he scares a family into their home, then burns it to the ground. He did this in order to blackmail the king into paying him on a monthly basis under threat of slaughtering the whole kingdom. During one of his monthly visits, when Leo cruelly crushes a guard to death in his hand for the king "getting too pushy", King Cupie decides to call in Kirby to free them from this threat. When confronted by Kirby, a terrified Leo sets fire to a populated building as a distraction. When defeated, the king asks him why he attacked them, to which Leo reveals he thought it would be easy to push them around.
Having just read the story, I think it is too brief; it is a mere 1k, without any kind of depth(it is literally just "dragon attacks castle and extorts money from the kingdom, Kirby saves the day, the end"). I know that we don't accept C Ms from online stories that are really barebones, so should Leo be cut?
Also, if you're curious, here is the original EP.
Edited by falcontalons on May 14th 2019 at 5:19:33 AM
Showtime!
to Liquid
to Liquid snake
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
Christ, Cupies was EPed by fucking UtterKoala. 
Honestly? I'm tempted to say cut him. I'll reread that story later tonight, but I remember it being paper thin.
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
Yes, cut it.
Liquid and Leo
Cutt the dragon.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
The Draftsman of Doom
![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
Terminate it with extreme prejudice.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 14th 2019 at 8:33:22 AM
Feels good, don't it?
Short-Term Projects herald
Leo.
That is, cut him.
Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!
Cut the dragon’s head off and feed it to the worms!
In any case, i’m not sure if anybody saw my reply to papyru, so I repost.
I COULD Effort Post Huey, but first I need some clarification. Is everyone alright with me Effort posting Dr. Huey Emmerich.
The Unknown Unknown
Liquid.
Cut Leo.
A cruel, sick joke is still a joke, and sometimes all you can do is laugh.
We did discuss Huey. He was (rightfuy, IMO) voted down. He's deplorable, but he's not a CM
The Draftsman of Doom
I suspected he may have been discussed.
Feels good, don't it?
Huey has already been discussed. My thought is that he's a broken man whom I'm not comfortable having listed even if he's crossed the line.
Skull Face has a tragic backstory and seems genuine in wanting to free the world from the English language. He may also have a Pet the Dog moment when he executes that one victim of his experiments, but I don't know what he says so maybe I be wrong.
Liquid may have counted if MGS 1 was inexplicably where the series ended, but he has a bunch of issues with his backstory and strange relationship with Psycho Mantis in 5 and, you know, he isn't that bad by the standards of the franchise. Hot Coldman is, I'd say, worse and he's not even deemed heinous enough and is on our Never Again list. And that's not even mentioning Volgin.
Thank you guys. Still, Huey will still remain one of the series’ biggest hate sinks. (I mean, using your own kid as a test subject for a Metal Gear, WHO DOES THAT?!)
@Polarphantom I figured his backstory was too tragic, thanks for the clarification. I would also like to thank you for reminding of that pet the dog moment. I think I remember him comforting a boy about to die from an attack from the man on Fire, AKA Volgin. Comes to show that even tragic villains can have monstrous actions, take it from me, I had Ardyn Izunia cutted last month.
Edited by Michealthehero21 on May 14th 2019 at 5:42:54 AM
Ghoulish Brain Worm
So here's my expansion of General Franz Vahlen fron Sniper Elite III.
What Is the Work?
Sniper Elite III is the 3rd Sniper Elite game, and part of the same continuity reboot as Sniper Elite V2. Specifically, this game serves as a prequel, set 3 years before V2. In contrast to the ruined cities of Berlin, this game is set in the deserts of North Africa, from Libya all the way to Tunisia. The game starts during the Siege of Tobruk in June 1942, and ends around the time of the Tunisia campaign in March 1943.
An SOE officer by the name of Lt. Karl Fairburne is sent to North Africa to help hold the Libyan port of Tobruk. Following his actions in covering the British retreat there, he is given a new mission by British Naval Intelligence. It is during this time that he uncovers a top-secret wunderwaffe project, known simply as "Seuche". The rest of the plot has Fairburne uncover bits and pieces relating to the project, and killing any personnel involved as well as stealing plans and intel relating to it.
Who is he?
Franz Vahlen is a General in the Afrika Korps, and the head of Project Seuche, the MacGuffin Karl is tasked with discovering and hopefully destroying. In short, he's this game's Big Bad.
What has he done?
During World War I, he was one of the advocates of using poison gas on enemy soldiers. During the North Africa campaign, he becomes the head of Project Seuche, which by the middle of the game turns out to be the supervision, production, and eventual deployment of a massive super-heavy tank called the Landkreuzer P.1000 Ratte.
As for his actions relating to Project Seuche itself, he's done a number of very questionable things, ranging from: ordering his men to work around the clock, to executing men for simply complaining about their tight work shifts (brutally), and even ordering his men to execute Allied prisoners simply for knowing too much about the Project.
Redeeming Qualities?
None. Intelligence gathered by Karl beforehand as well diary entries by several Afrika Korps and Italian officers reveal that he's clouded by his ambitions, and has plans to overthrow Rommel, the German High Command, and eventually, Hitler, once victory in North Africa is assured. He's so vile, in fact, that several German and Italian officers already planned on ratting him out to Rommel and Hitler as soon as they found out about Vahlen's endgame plans.
Heinousness?
Probably around the same level as Bohm, if only a fuck ton more incompetent and petty.
Conclusion
I'd say a pretty generic (not surprising, since Sniper Elite is known for having mediocre plots overall), if still vile, Nazi.
Edited by Rmpdc on May 14th 2019 at 8:44:49 PM
The Fight Continues!
Leaning to the above candidate; Heinz and Hitler both sound worse.
The Draftsman of Doom
Wasn't there a villain, I believe an Evil Cripple, from the 5th game? Could he count?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts