During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
We got 35 this week (the Buffy one counts twice: Once for the franchise page and once for the Lit page).
Oh, and captain, if it's gone from the Drafts page, that just means it's in my Word file (or, in this case, with the posted batch). Let me know if there are anymore changes you want.
EDIT: That 35 does NOT include the Transformers stuff.
Edited by ACW on Feb 10th 2019 at 5:40:13 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Someone ask favorite C Ms again eh in terms of being E Pd?
Well...
From my behalf, anyone who are a female especially attractive ones are the ones that I consider personal favorite Complete Monsters of all time. Kurara Tendo, Cecilia and Sara Warren to name a few. I am really having a fun time when it comes to E Ping a female C Ms. And speaking of which...
Man, I really am disappointed that I didnt get into Tate no Yuusha, proposing 1999!Dakki or Queen La back then. 
But cant blame em. I mean... Any attractive female C Ms esp. Caligula type or Uber Evil type would be an insta-favorite so yea...
For other ones? Arty, Alexis Kerib and Snark comes to mind.
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Just cut this unapproved entry from How to be a Werewolf
- Complete Monster: Connie, also known as Flora Conway is intended as a realistic version of this trope; she is a narcissist, exploiting and taking everything she can to keep herself going, up to and including abducting children to use as living werewolf batteries. She does at times show something resembling compassion or love, but the second she's in a corner, she'll choose herself over anyone else
I'll be handling Connie eventually.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Back to the favorites? Well, limited to just the ones I've put up (out of how many hundreds, now, I don't know), I think Mothergod and Bill Cipher top that list.
Sure to Ipslore.
Zamasu is definitely my favorite, along with the most heinous as his actions threaten entire timelines.
Alrighty, in honor of the film being out...here's an EP:
What's the work?
Battle Angel is a 90s OVA, an adaptation of the early volumes of the Battle Angel manga. The manga keeps the heroine's name of Galli, as opposed to the americanized Alita...it's far in the future and the haves live in Zalem, a massive floating city. The have nots live in the Scrapyard below. Most everyone is cybernetic, too. Dr. Daisuke Ito discovers an intact cybernetic girl in the junkyard. Taking her home, awakening her and naming her Galli, Ito makes her his daughter, but soon discovers...Galli has incredible power. Ito is a Hunter-Warrior, a bounty hunter against the worst criminals (there are, uh, a lot of those)...and one night, Galli saves his life seemingly on sheer instinct. Becoming a hunter herself, Galli meets a young junk trader named Yugo and begins falling in love with him...but, tragedy is ahead, and the villain of our story? Yugo's wicked boss, Mr. Vector.
Who is Vector?
Lemme preface: in the manga, Vector is a much nicer guy, as bad as he can be. The OVA excises all his redeeming qualities. A corrupt crime lord who finances bounty hunting, sports and so forth. Vector's nastier business? Vector has his traders, indebted to him and borderline enslaved, hunting down cyborgs to steal their spinal columns, leaving them broken on the ground so he can sell them on the black market. This is Yugo's true day job. Vector is also involved with Ito's ex-wife Chiren...it turns out? Chiren and Ito are from Zalem and were exiled for an unknown reason. Vector has Chiren working for him with the promise of sending her back to Zalem...with part of the deal including sexual services (he's a sleazy fucker, make no mistake)...
Anyways, things go to a head when Vector interrupts one of Yugo's spine removal operations...and while Yugo has tried to leave the victims alive, Vector calmly executes the cyborg as a witness. Ordering Yugo to speed up production to send him to Zalem, things go wrong when Yugo and his partner try it on a bounty hunter, who kills the partner. With Yugo on the run, Vector decides he's too 'hot' and decides to sell him out for the profit. Chiren is furious at Vector's manipulations and is about to cut ties...when Vector says the time has come to send her to Zalem...
Yugo ends up having a breakdown and tries to flee to climb his way to Zalem, Galli running after him, after the fight with a bounty hunter, and Ito revealing it's impossible for anyone from the Scrapyard to ever make it to Zalem. Here's where we get dark. Ito, enraged goes to confront Vector...who reveals where Chiren is...
Everyone he's ever promised to be sent to Zalem? Is murdered and harvested for organs, with all remaining of Chiren being her organs in tubes and jars. Vector grins that "the order comes from Zalem ever year. I dunno what they do with 'em" before he sics a cyborg on Ito. In the ensuing fight, Ito wins, but when the cyborg has an arm severed, it flies into a screaming Vector, impaling him and finishing him off..
Sadly, at the very end...Yugo's climb to Zalem is cut off by its defense mechanism. He has only enough time to tell Galli he loves her and to bid her goodbye...before his arm breaks off in her grip and he falls to his death, smiling at her the whole way.
Heinousness?
As a standalone OVA? Vector has the spine removal, the organ trade and murder. Yeah, the organ trade, of which there's a ton, plus his really nasty manipulations? Gonna bump him up into this column as the OVA is standalone and not into the insane levels of its manga counterpart. The only other villains are the evil cyborg serial killer duo, and Vector has the bigger count than them. Also, they care for one another, as one is furious when his partner is killed by Galli
Mitigating Qualities?
Now, in the manga? Vector cares for employees. Chiren is an OVA invention seemingly to make him more despicable. He does do the organ harvesting in the manga, but it actually seems to disturb him and when he gives Yugo the price for being sent to Zalem, it's absurdly high...because Vector likes Yugo and is trying to set it as an unrealistic goal so Yugo will give up...it's also implied in the manga Zalem is forcing vector to it, and while he's a bad person, he's not the gleeful, sadistic scumbag of the OVA. Obviously he has no care for Chiren despite sleeping with her (he kills her for her organs the second she's more trouble than she's worth) and he cares nothing for Yugo here.
Conclusion?
I'd say OVA Vector is a keeper. This is an example where it's not just a truncated adaptation, but completely different take on the character. Notably, Vector survives in the manga.
Edited by Lightysnake on Feb 10th 2019 at 5:53:49 AM
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
@Scraggle I also feel you do like Mok and Wraith too haha.
Yea on Vector... I do want to see the movie though. Sad that sfm91 cover it first but cant blame em.
Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Feb 10th 2019 at 5:53:55 PM
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Sanfran is still around, yeah? Their activity is admittedly... sporadic and they haven't contributed since November.
And yea to Vector.
Well, if they're not in after a grace period...I might just see the movie. I'm rather curious for it.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
for Vector.
I guess my favorite CMs I got approved are everyone from Grandville and The Mice Templar and...eh. Good enough. Can't really think of anyone else since I've done quite a few and I keep forgetting whenever this question gets asked.
Jupiter stands out as being my most complex I think.
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
Sounds like what the Chrono Crusade anime did to Aion, yes there.
Btw, I finished reading Lady Smoke...the qualifier's actions are pretty much all in the first book from last year. Should I wait the two weeks, or anyone mind if I just do the EP for Kaiser Corbinian?
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
for me:
Id say go ahead.
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Vector.
Short-Term Projects herald
Vector.
Addendum: You know what I might as well list off my most embarassing EP's. I only get them like about three times a year. Post 2014 because my early years wasn't the best.
2016 Catalina.
2017 Dr. Grant and Tamora Monroe. I remember EP-ing Glory although my embarrassment with that one was the fact she was shot down with arguments I adressed in her effortpost.
2018 Fergus Hobart, Ginger Snaps Back: The Beginning duo, The Storm King.
2019 Wilkins.
Edited by Beast on Feb 10th 2019 at 5:31:09 AM
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
OVA!Vector.
I guess we'll change the current Gunnm entry to Battle Angel (or Battle Angel Alita), since that's the English manga title.
That current entry...needs some work:
- Complete Monster: Most iterations of Desty Nova have been amoral at best and have performed inhumane experiments on humans all for the sake of research on Karma. The latest incarnation, Super Nova, powered by two Brain Chips, direct access to Melchizadek, and an afro in his introduction betrayed the main characters and the other two clones of himself to Aga Mbadi. He then proceeds to gleefully tell Alita how LADDER is going to send down an army after the Z.O.T.T. to wipe out The Scrapyard and capture all people on Tiphares for their brains, just before destroying Alita physically and mentally by telling her her brain was replaced with a chip and deconstructing her body, causing her remains to fall down a shaft all while maniacally laughing about it and celebrating over her despair and sadness, disturbing even his other clones. When he asks if the clones would like to work together with him and they politely decline, stating that their methods have grown too different, he uses his power to kill NovaPod and would have killed Nova X if he didn't unplug communication. He has yet to have been seen eating flan, Nova's usual dish of choice and what was a considerable quirk of his, showing just how different and evil he is from the regular Nova. While various Novas have been Faux Affably Evil or Affably Evil, Super Nova is just plain evil.
As for Kaiser Corbinian...I'm fine whenever.
Edited by ACW on Feb 10th 2019 at 6:32:55 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Current mood: sick of your shit
Vector
And I guess my favorite E Ps would probably be the Tooth Fairy and Dr. Harrison.
Read "Ghost Stories of Remnant" here.
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
to Vector.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Favorite that I've done? Probably Astaroth from the The Tapestry. Certainly the worst, in terms of the sheer scale of his atrocities.