Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

No bias. I like the quote; I think it just works better as the caption. But whatever; I'm not gonna pick a fight over it.

Though thanks for that; I was the one who thought of that caption (I think)

edited 1st May '17 10:51:16 AM by ACW

Oh yeah, it's May 1st. Time to talk about 24: Legacy.

No one counts. Every potential candidate either fails the heinous standard or is a clear case of Even Evil Has Loved Ones.

Chopper I think.

Anti-Monitor, Wolfgang, and Chopper.

That's why I only have one write-up per post

I mean its easier for me. I'm can be little impatient in doing stuff and an entire write post with making the entries, and adding the links to where can be a hassle for me. I mean everyone has their own way of doing things.

edited 1st May '17 12:45:33 PM by G-Editor

I find that mass writeup posts work a lot more conveniently when you propose candidates at the sheer frequency me, Ravok, or Lighty do. Little tedious, but it's organized and extremely cathartic to get it all done at once.

edited 1st May '17 12:33:01 PM by Scraggle

Anti-Monitor (You convinced me he wasn't a GDV. such a shame the show was cancelled), Wolfgang, and Dr. Chopper.

Concerning Broadchurch, I don't think the Serial Rapist of the last season counts. He raped three women, committed one Rape by Proxy, filmed all four acts and attempted to frame an innocent man. It's also implied that he's addicted to unconventional genres of pornography. That being said he has one Pet the Dog albeit a sick one.

He thought that forcing his friend to rape a woman would help him to stop being a doormat and help him to grow a spine.

It's disgusting and wrong on many levels... but it's still a redeeming quality.

to Wolfgang Manteuffel and Doctor Chopper.

EP for Ruby from The Neon Demon:

Who Is She?

Ruby is a makeup artist for models in Los Angeles who also works a second job in a morgue, where she improves the appearance of the recently deceased for viewing.

What Does She Do?

Ruby is also a necrophiliac who also lusts after the main character, a 16-year-old new model named Jesse. She pretends to care about Jesse and Jesse trusts her enough that she runs to her after her hotel manager Hank rapes a young girl in the room next door. Ruby attempts to force herself on Jesse twice. Ruby then imagines one of the corpses in the morgue as Jesse as she masturbates. Later at the mansion that Ruby is house-sitting, Jesse is pursued by Ruby, Sarah and Gigi (two other models). Ruby personally murders Jesse by pushing her into the drained pool, before she, Sarah and Gigi cannibalize Jesse's body for her beauty, drinking her blood as well. Ruby is last seen after digging an unmarked grave for what's left of Jesse, pleasuring herself as blood gushes from her genitals.

Freudian Excuse?

None.

Mitigating Circumstances?

The entire film is an exercise in Mind Screw, especially at the end.

Heinousness?

Pedophilic rapist Hank barely has a role and Ruby calls the shots for Sarah and Gigi, the other Elizabeth Bathory vampire-types. It seems that Ruby will prey on the next virgin girl who comes to Los Angeles as a model as she goes unpunished at the end. Essentially, Ruby is a modern-day Elizabeth Bathory.

edited 1st May '17 1:52:49 PM by k410ren

Yeah, you 3 average, what, a couple a week? One a week at least. I average...around 1 every 6.5 weeks

That;s,,,all kinds of fucked up.

BTW, I'm feeling a little better (damn allergies), and I got a doctor's appointment tomorrow morning (not related; nothing serious), so I MAY (emphasis on may) have time to at least start this week's batch.

One murder? Not sure if heinous enough.

edited 1st May '17 1:53:22 PM by ACW

chopper

It's also what she does with the body after she dies, with cannibalism and all. Felt like Jumping the Shark with how out there it was. It's also implied this isn't the first time she's done it. It's weird as hell.

edited 1st May '17 1:55:29 PM by k410ren

If she's murdered before, then maybe. But cannibalizing and necrophizing (don't know if that's a word ) a dead body? Squicky, yes, but that's about it.

As I said, the film's an exercise in Mind Screw.

edited 1st May '17 1:56:16 PM by k410ren

No to Ruby. Too much a Mind Screw, one murder, etc. Kylo, I think you should hold off on proposing someone for a while now. Implications aren't enough. there needs to be an actual pattern established, and cannibalizing a body after doesn't earn you a spot on the list.

edited 1st May '17 2:00:53 PM by Lightysnake

Ruby. Doesn't seem heinous enough

I posted a question a few days back but no one seemed to notice it, so here it goes again. So:

I watched Cliffhanger for the first time in my life and I've been wondering: does Delmar really count? Qualen is an easy keep, since he has more blood in his hands than anyone else in the movie, has no redeeming qualities and is responsible for his men's actions both directly and indirectly. Delmar, on the other hand, has a noticeably less count of crimes:

- He is seen laughing when a fellow henchman Kynette guns down one of the teenagers (this was because of Qualen's orders). He then hands Kynette a gun so he could kill the other one, too (I don't see neither of these as counting, since Delmar himself didn't personally pull the trigger)

- He guns down Frank, the rescue pilot, seemingly on his own without Qualen's orders for "wasting their time" (fellow henchman Krystel was angered by this)

- He is ordered to kill Hal quietly but after noticing that he is ready to die an honorable death, Delmar decides that torturing him to death by using his head as a soccer ball is more fun.

- On a side note, he's the only racist in Qualen's group, mocking Kynette a "black bastard" and not getting along with him at all

Does Delmar really strike out that much? He is the most over-the-top, hammy bad guy in the whole movie but has not that much characterization to begin with since he dies after having a little more screen-time towards the final arc of the movie. Kynette on the other hand, while also a sadistic psychopath, seems to only follow Qualen's orders and tries his best to please his boss while Delmar is the loose cannon. Delmar really is the most sadistic of the group but does Qualen outheinous him? My issue is that, to me, all of Qualen's henchmen are scumbags, but they all seem like unique kinds of psychopaths.

I'm not sure whether or not Delmar should be cut but I just like to know a little more what people think of him.

edited 1st May '17 2:57:59 PM by Kookosbanaani

I have zero issue cutting Delmar, honestly.

Feeling's completely mutual. Not really sure why Delmar's even listed... Qualen I think is an easy keep but Delmar's just a nastier-than-usual thug. And no on Ruby. My previous thoughts continue, Kylo; reevaluate the heinous standard. I want to be as nice as I can here while still getting the point across; it's obvious you're having a real hard time struggling with understanding the baseline.

edited 1st May '17 3:06:43 PM by Scraggle

I'd still like to highlight that Delmar is the most reckless of Qualen's group and does things against his boss' orders. Killing Frank was against Qualen's orders, also the soccer torture he pulls on Hal since he was ordered to kill him quietly. But that part where he laughs at Kynette gunning down a teenager and then handing him a gun so he could kill the other one too bothers me. He didn't personally pull the trigger yet took sadistic pleasure in it and helped his fellow henchman to kill the said teenager. Is that a qualification or not?

Edit: Just rewatched that scene and Delmar had nothing to do with Kynette attempting to gun down the other teenager. He is just seen sadistically smiling in the background. I think I'm going to say to Delmar too, he is a piece of shit but Qualen is the kind of evil who utilizes his recklessness the best way possible.

edited 1st May '17 2:55:03 PM by Kookosbanaani

I'm in favor in cutting Delmar.

As for Ruby to her. I'm going to have to second what Lighty and Scraggle is saying Kylo. You seem like a nice guy but you're still having a hard time understanding the baseline on what qualifies as a Complete Monster.

edited 1st May '17 2:38:45 PM by G-Editor

no on Ruby. Not heinous enough.

Hemann.

Johnson and Meachum.

Shogen.

Lazar and Vorza.

Karthalo.

the Anti Monitor.

Wolfgang.

Dr. Chopper.

Got a new re-evaluation post from the Silent Hill series; ''Silent Hill: Homecoming".

The game focuses on Alex Shepard, a young soldier returning home from a war (except that turns out to be untrue, they where delusions he conjured up to deal with the traumatic death of his brother), to his home town of Shepards Glenn, which neighbours Silent Hill. Alex discovers his mother Lilian is catatonic, and pretty much the entire population of Shepard's Glenn, including his father Adam, who disappeared when he went searching for Alex's brother Joshua (who turns out to be Dead All Along). With the help of Sheriff's deputy Wheeler, and Alex's childhood friend Elle Holloway, Alex seeks to find brother as well as get to the bottom of this mystery. Throw in some cultists for the Order of the Holy Woman, and eldritch monsters typical to the series and you got a game.

The character I'm bringing up is Judge Margaret Holloway, Elle's mother, one of the town leaders and current leader of the reassembled Order of the Holy Woman.

Who is Margaret Holloway ? What does she do ?

Margaret Holloway is a well respected town leader and one of the descendants of the four founding families of Shepard's Glenn (the other three being the Fitch's, the Bartlett's and of course the Shepard's). She is the mother of Elle and Nora Holloway, and was seen as a mother figure to Alex due to how distant his own parents where. Despite this, Elle resents her for her laconic attitude with parenting.

A little backstory, but the founding families left Silent Hill at the time Shepard's Glenn was founded, but had to make a pact with the God of the Order. Every fifty years, these families would sacrifice one of their children to appease the God. These sacrifices required a specific method, with the Holloway's using nooses.

In 2003, before the events of the game, the time of the sacrifices came; Mayor Bartlett and Dr. Fitch killed their children in accordance to the pact, but where remorseful for it. Adam and Lilian Shepard intended to sacrifice Alex and tried to be distant from him so as to not get attached to a son they would have to kill (didn't work) but while Alex and Joshua where on a fishing trip, Joshua accidentally fell off the boat and drowned. Holloway meanwhile, choose to sacrifice her youngest daughter Nora, by strangling her to death with her own two hands, all the while smiling as Nora screamed and begged for her life. Unlike the others, Holloway is completely remorseless about it.

Since Josh wasn't the intended sacrifice, the pact was broken and Silent Hill's infamous otherworldly fog descended upon Shepard's Glenn. Alex found himself in a mental health clinic, with his memories of serving in the military being Trauma-Induced Amnesia to cover up his younger brothers death. As for the otherworldly fog, Holloway came up with a solution, to revive the since disbanded Order of the Holy Woman, place herself as the leader and bring and army of Order Soldiers to Shepard's Glenn, lead by Curtis Ackers to kidnap residence of Shepard's Gleen to be brainwashed into joining the Order. Those who don't join are simply tortured to death. This explains where all the missing persons are, and by the time Alex returns home, everyone in Shepard's Glenn is either dead or a soldier for the Order.

When Alex first returns to Shepard's Glenn, Holloway is one the first people he meets. She advises Alex to go see his mother before entering town hall and mentions her daughter Elle would like to see him again. As it so happens, Elle is putting up missing persons posters for Nora. Later on Fitch and Bartlett are killed by Eldritch manifestations of their children, who become bosses for Alex to fight. Following this, Holloway sends Order soldiers to abduct Alex and his mother at their home.

Alex would later find his mother strapped to a torture device that would stretch her to death. Alex is given the option of letting his mother be tortured to death or mercy killed (the latter is necessary if you want the good ending). When Alex, Elle and Wheeler try to escape across Toluca Lake, she sends her men to capture them, resulting in Elle and Wheeler getting captured themselves. Alex encounters Holloway again, tied to a chair inside a gas chamber at Overlook Penitentiary, where she gets Alex to help her escape. Alex frees her as the Eldritch manifestation of Nora arrives to kill her. Holloway then leaves Alex in the gas chamber intending for him to die there, but Alex defeats Nora's manifestation.

Alex would later find Wheeler back at the Orders lair, tortured to near death. Holloway tries to convince Elle to join the Order, but is rebuffed. Alex awakens strapped to a chair, and he sees Holloway sitting next to him. At this point Holloway reveals everything to him.

She explains that she blames Alex and his father for the pact with the Orders God being broken, claiming Adam was too weak to choose which child to sacrifice. She also reveals her intention to have her remaining daughter killed for rejecting the cult. She sends Curtis off to do the deed while she takes out a power drill. Holloway then begins torturing Alex by drilling his leg, before Alex breaks free and in the following struggle, turns the drill onto her and forced it through her jaw into her head, quickly but painfully killing her. Alex laters kills Curtis to rescue Elle.

Redeeming Qualities or Freudian Excuse ?

When the player first meets her, she puts up a warm friendly facade, but it's just that. Her true personality is a cold blooded sadist on a power trip.

The reason she originally didn't count was because of arguments that she was a Well-Intentioned Extremist. However a look at the character will show that is total bunk.

She claimed to be doing what she's doing because protecting her family is her first priority. Which is why she killed not only her first daughter as per the pact, but plans to kill her other daughter as well. It's also quickly shown that her apparent concern for her faith is a ruse her her totalitarian personality. It's more accurate to say she is just power hungry. Even when she saved the town from the Otherworld fog, it had more to do with maintaining control over the town as leader of the Order in accordance to her vision and ideals. Plus it's not like what she does to the town is any better, what with mass murder, torture and brainwashing until the town is near desolate.

She is just as well intentioned as Morgan Landsdale.

As far as actual redeeming qualities go, unlike the other parents who had to sacrifice their children, she is completely remorseless about it. She also planned on killing her only surviving daughter for simple disobedience. Alex mentions that growing up, he saw Holloway as a motherly figure as a substitute for the lack of affection from his own mother, but as we plainly see, that ultimately means squat. Her alleged loyalty to the Order is just another front for gaining and maintaining power over Sheperd's Glenn, with fear and an iron fist. Not only that but she has a taste for and developing cruel and extraordinary killing and torturing on those who refuse to follow the Order's teachings and/or cross her.

As far as the heinous standard goes, her main competition in the CM department would be Dahlia Gillespie from the original game and it's prequel. Like Dahlia, Holloway seeks to use the Order as a means of gaining personal power and they are both horrible mothers. But there's some pretty obvious differences.

See Dahlia has ambitions to bring about her cults God onto the world, and has been preforming impregnation rituals on women in Silent Hill, including her seven year old daughter (as well as burning said daughter alive and keeping her that way for years). Where Holloway differs is that she isn't out to bring about a God onto the world but is content with ruling Shepard's Glenn in a despot state. She also isn't one for magic rituals like Dahlia, save for the sacrifices. What Holloway does though is torture, murder and brainwash the population of Shepard's Glenn until all it's residence are either dead or soldiers for the Order.

As far as Offscreen Villainy goes, we at least see the aftermath of her actions throughout the game, and get a brief flashback of her strangling Nora to death.

edited 1st May '17 2:53:07 PM by Beast

For Delmar... well laughing at an evil deed in my eyes is equal as actually committing it. But ultimately, while he does few sadistic things on his own accord, he is just the most sadistic henchman but he probably doesn't have enough deeds to his name. I was the one that originally advocated keeping him, but seeing as Qualen is the leader, and Delmar shares "the most sadistic role" with Kynette, I am fine with cutting him, even if I wouldn't necessarily advocate it myself.

I'd like to call any writeups on potential Into the Badlands season 2 monsters, please. It should be ending three weeks from now.

edited 1st May '17 3:10:55 PM by PhiSat

Go ahead.