During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Malachai
Where is the cut proposal for this Alexi? I can't find it with the Find function in the previous pages for some reason.
Professor Gigachad
Oh, he is called Alexei. That's why I couldn't find him with the Find function.
cut Alexei
Malachai. ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Looger, SCOPES and Alexei.
I'm upvoting you too, Malachai...
Goku Black
Btw if we're keeping Mireau (which is what the vote count indicates).
Could we please trim him. His current is 254 words....
Which is excessive for a one movie villain....
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Yes to Malachai but no on Looger. If we're sure he's getting cut then I can finally say...
Looks like this candidate got 360 no SCOPED.
Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
The Draftsman of Doom
YEAHHH!!!🎶
Yes to Malachai, no to Looper
Here you go mir:
- Paths of Glory: General Paul Mireau is the opportunistic commander of the 701st regiment in World War I. Taking his men on a dangerous mission to secure a promotion by capturing Anthill, Mireau threatens and beats even his shell shocked soldiers and eventually sends thousands to their deaths while only concerning himself with the speed of his forces' advance. When a group of his own soldiers refuse to participate in the fruitless conflict, Mireau orders them bombarded with artillery, executing the artillery commander for refusing the insane order. After losing the battle an enraged Mireau tries to execute one hundred of his own soldiers, forced to amend the order to three but enjoying their wrongful killings all the same.
to Malachai
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
With Alexei, the dub...is this a game dub, or an anime dub? If the latter, is it canon?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
RIP Toriyama
Easy yup to Malachai, great work!
@43: Immensely approve of the rewrite—it was in fact this same month last year that I intended to rewrite him myself and asked the thread about it, but I never got around to it and that one is tremendous, major approval,
Yes to Malachai. Cut SCOPES.
Malachai
@ACW: This is about Alexei from the game dub of Tales of Vesperia. Unlike a few of the other Tales games, Vesperia doesn't have an anime series, though it does have a prequel movie.
Edited by Bugfragged on Oct 12th 2021 at 3:00:19 AM
Ultimate Moral Compass
Mireau rewrite
Here’s a movie that’s kind of related to this month of horror. Kind of.
What Is the Work?
The Angel movies are a series of films about Molly Winters. By day, she’s a high school sweetheart. By night, she’s known as “Angel”, a prostitute on Sunset Blvd. The first movie from 1983 was a box office success, enough to warrant not 1, not 2, but 3 sequels, all of which did poorly in theaters.
Played by a different actress in each installment, Molly often uses her wits, courage, and brute force to take down whatever threat harms her friends and family.
Today, we’ll be looking at the third installment, Angel 3: The Final Chapter (spoiler alert, this wasn’t the final chapter), directed by Tom DeSimone, who had directed a wide variety of pornography—including Chatterbox, the greatest musical comedy about a singing vagina—and television shows.
In this movie, Molly, having become a photographer, is called back to Los Angeles to uncover a variety of disappearances amidst the porno scene. Oh yeah, and the mysterious death of her long lost mother. All trails eventually lead to this woman.
Who Is She?
Nadine (played by Maud Adams, aka Octopussy and fellow CM Fima) is a porno producer who doubles as the leader of a crime gang.
What has she done?
Nadine lures in women, mainly prostitutes and up-and-coming actresses, with the promise of fame, only to sell them as sex slaves to foreign buyers in return for drugs, which she sells for money. Having Molly’s mother killed for attempting to leave her gang to protect her daughter Michelle, Nadine keeps files on every women she’s sold, of which there are dozens of.
When Molly looks to finally uncover her operation, Nadine has her friend Gloria, who was a mole in Nadine’s gallery of actresses, killed and Molly herself kidnapped, gleefully telling her how she’ll sell her as a sex slave. Luckily, Nadine is apprehended by Molly’s friends, and is stored in an ice cream truck freezer for the police to arrest her. Yeah, don’t ask.
Redeeming Qualities?
She objected to her right hand man’s method of killing Molly’s mother with a car bomb, but that’s because it drew too much attention. Other than that, nothing good to say about her at all.
Heinousness?
The Big Bad of the first movie, The Killer, is a serial killer who kills prostitutes and has sex with the bodies. Prime CM material, except I feel he genuinely cares for the prostitutes he murders; he treats their bodies with care as he makes love with them. So yeah, I feel he’s too twisted to really count.
The Big Bad of the second movie, Gerrard, is a gangster himself, but not only is his ultimate plan lacking compared to everyone else (essentially to buy out Sunset Blvd for himself, like he’s in a lame western), but he genuinely cares for his son, who’s kidnapped and accidentally killed by Molly’s friends in a lengthy hostage trade.
The fourth movie’s main villain is a murderous rock star named Piston Jones, who’s too delusional to understand that he’s killing people, plus he has a very small body count. His manager, Roddy McDowall, also doesn’t keep, despite being Piston’s enabler, mainly because he’s just not heinous enough.
Nadine, on the other hand, is a smug sadist who deals in white slavery. Nothing else to be said.
Conclusion
Keeper
Edited by therealjackieboy on Oct 12th 2021 at 3:15:05 AM
"No running in the halls!"
Yes to Nadine. Simple, easy keeper.
Also, I remembered I technically have a Sometimes We Come Back candidate of my own. From the third movie Sometimes They Come Back For More, which...really has nothing to do with the short story or any of the previous movies beyond the vague premise of "people returning from the dead."
What has Karl Schilling done?
Doctor of an Antarctic research base (yeah, it's basically The Thing with Satan) Karl Schilling is actually an evil Satanist communing with an evil force beneath the base. By the time some soldiers responding to distress calls come to the base, Schilling has massacred all but two people in the base and resurrected their bodies as grotesque, undead abominations, while he himself has tapped into some Satanic powers to become a full-on demon like his predecessors.
Schilling's end goal is a lot more wide-scale than the greasers before him, though. He's not content torturing and murdering people in one Antarctic research base—he wants to awaken Satan himself with ritual sacrifice and bring about absolute Hell on Earth. Thanks to the soldiers, he's stopped and destroyed.
Any mitigating factors?
I mean, where he's lacking in the creative sadism and...well, really anything interesting about the greasers before him, Schilling is flat-out attempting to desolate humanity by putting it beneath Satan's foot, and he's got the onscreen body count to match.
Conclusion?
Yeah, sure. If this film has shit-all to do with the others, at least this is a rare case of a film series where the Big Bad of each film keeps.
Edited by Scraggle on Oct 12th 2021 at 4:08:39 AM
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
Nadine and Schilling.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Ditto.
An even rarer case in which the first goes to TV, and the other 2 to film.
Yea to Nadine and Scrags' there. I have one more from Children of the Corn proper and it might be obvious who....gonna nay to SCOPE and honestly leaning cut to Alexei too
Goku Black
Nadine and Schilling.
to Nadine and Schilling
Cut Scopes and Alexei
Edited by G-Editor on Oct 12th 2021 at 12:18:34 AM
to Nadine and Doctor Karl Schilling.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
Malachai.
Why so serious?