The Broken Base cleanup thread discusses about examples in Broken Base, but this talks about examples in YMMV pages of works containing Base-Breaking Character, (despite being an Example Sectionectomy, this can still be seen in the YMMV pages of works) where the details on what is suitable is also vague.
Here is the criteria for Base-Breaking Character:
- A long-term, sustained conflict: Characters that were simply hated and loved, then had their interest evaporated away (both positive and negative) after a few months doesn't count. Characters in upcoming works also don't count.
- A vicious conflict: Factions that have little problem co-existing and doesn't mind about what the other faction likes or dislikes about the character doesn't count. If it's not particularly vicious and heated, then it would be cut or be listed as a Downplayed Trope.
- Two (or more) vocal, almost equally sized factions: A tiny Vocal Minority that doesn't shut up their pet peeve, whilst being outnumbered by more reasonable fans don't count. Nor does a Silent Majority who doesn't make a big deal with the other side count. If one of the hating factions is significantly bigger than the other, it would be classified as The Scrappy or an Ensemble Dark Horse.
- Little to no Middle ground: Scenarios where most of the fandom doesn't care about the character, don't count.
Base-Breaking Character is when half of the fandom likes a character, yet another equally sized half dislikes it. Now that happens, but the problem is, some entries aren't really contentious (thus not resulting in flame wars when someone says they "liked that character"). Also, several entries are one-sided towards the negative or the positive side describing that only side in detail, but then wrapping up with a single line saying "But the other half likes that character". A correct way would be describing it like "a split in the Fandom on who likes it or not", with details on both sides why they're liked and disliked.
Here's an example from YMMV.Undertale:
- Alphys. A lot of players find her character gimmick of constant messages and attempts to help more annoying than funny, especially on repeat playthroughs. And even though she has sympathetic reasons, the reveal that she's been experimenting on sick monsters to create the Amalgamates and manipulating the player to feel better about herself doesn't help, especially since she never directly apologizes for the latter.
While it may have annoyed players due to these reasons above, there has been a considerable amount of fanarts and comics or her, and not only that, the like-dislike situation hasn't been so contentious (compared to Sans, whom he's popular, now he sucks.)
edited 21st Feb '18 1:46:31 PM by AppleGates
Berserk Button: misusing Nightmare Fuel
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Definitely remove Brian from Creator's Pet, and remove Chris. In fact, for these two, you probably wouldn't even need to ask before removing they objectively don't meet the requirements for Creator's Pet or Base-Breaking Character.
I think Stewie just needs a rewrite.
- Stewie, post-Villain Decay. One side hates him for being a pathetic shadow of his former self, while the other loves him for being the most likable member of the modern Griffin family and for providing a good chunk of the series' humor.
Edited by Crossover-Enthusiast on Jul 7th 2019 at 10:21:35 AM
Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢
BaseBreakingCharacter.Pokemon was just made, and seems to list every single major character and has a lot of examples for minor characters/Pokemon that seem to be written at the time relevant episodes involving them were made.
The Protomen enhanced my life.
Industrious Incisors
The page was just made, but it seems to have been a cut-and-paste from the already-written section in Pokémon (Anime).
Redmess
I saw the YMMV page for the React series of web videos has a lot of examples for Base-Breaking Character. I find this a bit problematic, though, since these are not "characters", or even actors portraying characters, these are real life people. I feel like half this YMMV page is running afoul of troping real life people.
Some of these kids are also listed as being The Scrappy, which, again, is a CHARACTER trope, not a real life one. Besides, the reasoning is often rather petty. Troy is a "scrappy" because he does not want to see the Hobbit and has a moptop? Seriously?
When reading that page, it all sounds rather judgemental to me, especially since a lot of them are directed at young children who often lack the knowledge and perspective to know any better, or are just immature because, well, they are kids.
Edited by Redmess on Jul 10th 2019 at 3:00:58 PM
Optimism is a duty.
Short-Term Projects herald
Nuke it.
Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!
Redmess
And then there are the shipping tropes. Of ACTUAL teens. Yeah, I'm nuking that, too.
Optimism is a duty.
Big Brother has a page and judging from the fact both MB and CM, and other tropes following suit, have decided to remove any tropes pertaining to real life people in the shows (Amazing Race and other Reality shows included) should we cut the page as it is troping real life people? It's also worth noting Big Brother also has a Scrappy section.
Edited by Klavice on Jul 10th 2019 at 8:16:42 AM
Fair warning: I can get pretty emotional and take things too seriously.
Redmess
I think tropes that are about the show rather than it's participants can stay, but things like Scrappy should definitely be cut in my opinion.
Also, any form of shipping or Ho Jay or whathaveyou needs to go as well. It is creepy.
Edited by Redmess on Jul 11th 2019 at 12:13:15 PM
Optimism is a duty.
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
This was added to Mamako under Do You Love Your Mom and Her Two-Hit Multi-Target Attacks?: There's also the fact that the entire novel and in-universe game were seemingly set up to be Mamako shills to the extreme. Even though she's already grossly powerful by default due to being a mom, anything and everything going on are seemingly rigged to skew sharply in her favor. If there are many moms on screen at once, Mamako will surely be the most powerful of them all and gets showered with freebies, while the others suffer from The Worf Effect, despite them blatantly cheating with third-party software. The game itself bends over backwards to make her more and more powerful with each passing chapter for absolutely no discernible reason, while constantly leaving her son and the rest of the party in the dust. She doesn't have to conform to any set of rules or mechanics while playing, and nobody, player or AI, will ever call her out on her Insane Troll Logic or the myriad of seemingly impossible feats she cluelessly achieves. And this is supposed to be a 30-something person whose gaming experience stops at the Famicom.
IPP Wick Check created.
Delete it. Way too one-sided.
Is this entry under Captain Marvel (2019) lopsided? It reads to me as "some like her, but some think [list of potholed complaints that's twice as long]."
- Base-Breaking Character: Carol Danvers, Captain Marvel herself. Some people love her for her interactions with Maria, bringing the good side of Fury out or simply being a female superhero with her own solo movie that didn't suck. Others absolutely loathe her for her lack of interesting character traits (especially in comparison to other Marvel protagonists), "emotional" personality, or the fact that she is the first female superhero in the MCU with her own movie instead of a more established character like Black Widow.
That last point strikes me as petty/fringe-y. Also it doesn't adequately explain why people "absolutely loathe" this apparently boring character, as opposed to just... feeling neutral towards this apparently boring character, as people tend to react to boring characters.
I'd say keep with some rewriting as both the pro and anti side have about equal focus. Though the Vanilla Protagonist pothole should be removed due to misuse. Vanilla Protagonist is for protagonists who are intentionally made ordinary to make a more colorful supporting cast stick out, not protagonists that people found boring.
I'll admit, I'm not comfortable with the points against the character because they sound way too much like the points brought up by very unpleasant people (and by unpleasant, I mean "sexist and anti-women").
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Definitely keep but rewrite. I feel the "female superhero with her own solo movie that didn't suck" bit is too gushy for a Base Breaking Character entry given how decisive it is.
Edited by Metaverse on Oct 17th 2019 at 9:51:57 AM
I'm illiterate. Superman 64 has a better characters than The Last of Us Part II.
That's part of my concern. I feel like the segment of fans who "absolutely loathe" her may just be a vocal minority, at least with the reasons given. And then the entry would be giving undue weight to said vocal minority under the guise of "balance". I mean, I can see why fans may not care for the character (heck, the movie didn't win me over), but not why non-vocal minority fans would loathe her. Then it's not a true Base-Breaking Character.
Most of the good=faith negative opinions on her come closer to "meh" than active dislike, aside from a few people who aren't part of the usual suspects but are conservative enough that her actions came off to them as meanspirited.
...
Pokemon YMMV pages have a lot of dubious examples that I'm not sure should be moved to BaseBreakingCharacter.Pokemon. For example, YMMV.Pokemon Red And Blue's examples.
Oh yea for My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic page that was brought up a page ago, Pinkie’s section can stay, but the current entry feels a bit one sided with the complaints against her. Maybe I’ll try to give it a rewrite.
Edit: here’s my rewrite of the entry
- Pinkie Pie. While many love her for being a Fun Personified pony whose driving purpose in life is to make others happy, and find her hyperactivity and fourth-wall breaking antics hilarious; Others hate her for being Innocently Insensitive and getting away with it, being part of the most controversial aesops of the series (Such as "Swarm of the Century", "Feeling Pinkie Keen", "A Friend In Deed”, and “Yakity-Sax”), and find her irritating; though exactly how scatterbrained she is tends to vary between episodes.
How is it?
Edited by PlasmaPower on Oct 28th 2019 at 4:45:56 PM
Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!
Speaking of, G4 Grogar is listed as a Base-Breaking Character when it turns out he was Discord the whole time. What should be done about that entry now that The Reveal happened?
Edited by lalalei2001 on Oct 30th 2019 at 7:36:35 AM
The Protomen enhanced my life.
I was thinking maybe Discord's stint as Grogar could go under the former's entry in Base-Breaking Character. And maybe add on how fans reacted to that twist too.
That could work, but I just realized it hasn't been 6 months since the twist happened yet XD;
Wait there's a wait period for Base Breaking Characters? Or is it for adding twists like I just mentioned?
Edited by PlasmaPower on Oct 30th 2019 at 12:00:28 PM
Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!
"Obviously, whenever a new character is seen, or an old character does something big, fans are going to talk about it for a while. But if the discussion dies down after a few episodes, that's a sign that the character is not that divisive. A conflict should last for at least six months to qualify; any shorter and it's probably just your average fan disagreement."
The Protomen enhanced my life.
There is a waiting period, just like there is one for Broken Base. As you can probably tell, it's to try and curb any kneejerk reactions.
Edited by dragonfire5000 on Oct 30th 2019 at 8:02:41 AM
