Duplicate tropes discussion thread

- Red Baron means the nickname isn't just appended to the name, it's a replacement for it, and better known than the original name.

I need some fine details for the difference of Clothing Combat and Arsenal Attire. Please?

(My question for Human All Along and Was Once a Man hasn't been answered either)

- It seems Clothing Combat or Arsenal Attire needs some description changes or something...

As the latter seems to imply that Clothing Combat is whacking someone with jeans, Improvised Weapon-ish while Arsenal Attire is deliberate.

But CC's first subtrope is Armed Legs, whose picture is shoe guns, which seems like what AA is.

And the name sounds like it should be leg guns, instead the presumably intended legging guns.

Edited by Malady on Jun 30th 2018 at 2:24:34 AM

Why should Heterosexual Life-Partners be a separate trope from Platonic Life-Partners? They're exactly the same except for the gender of one partner.

• Many members of "Platonic" life partnerships are in fact heterosexual (making the name of HLP a little misleading).
• One or both people in a "Heterosexual" partnership may not actually be heterosexual—which doesn't affect the partnership because it is platonic.

These as two separate tropes implies that the dynamic is different depending on the gender of one, which goes against the common definition of the tropes (two people spend their lives together although they are not attracted to each other).

If the dynamic is not different, that implies that the reason behind it is different: whereas a (heterosexual) man and a woman are not together because they are not attracted to each other, two men or women are not together only because of their Incompatible Orientations. The implication there—that they would be in a relationship if they were not heterosexual (which, as i stated, one or both of them well might not be)—is, frankly, homophobic.

Edited by TheGreatConversation on Jun 30th 2018 at 8:46:34 AM

- Was Once a Man seems to be transformation, while Human All Along is for evolution?

Or Was Once a Man is a single person, while Human All Along are for species...

But yeah, they seem similar, and they don't wick to each other, so there's nothing to help clear the confusion?

I need distinction between Techno Dystopia and Cyberpunk.

I mean, doesn't all Cyberpunk stories feature Techno Dystopia?

I think Techno Dystopia is a purely setting trope about the society/technological context of a work. Techno Dystopia is a prerequisite for Cyberpunk, but Cyberpunk has other aesthetic and plot characteristics as well, such as dark, noir-esque visuals and a plotline featuring rebels fighting the system from the bottom-up (usually as The Protagonist, an Anti-Hero, or at least Anti-Villain).

You can have a work set in a Techno Dystopia that's also a Crapsaccharine World where Everything Is an iPod in the Future, which would definitely not be cyberpunk. Or a work in a Techno Dystopia featuring a Villain Protagonist trying to work within the system or a character who has personal, non world-shaking goals.

Edited by naturalironist on Jul 4th 2018 at 10:33:19 AM

So, apparently, The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything doesn't have to be about actual pirates, but refers to "any character who, despite having a certain canonical job, is rarely, if ever, seen engaging in that job" (and could apply to office workers, student, and other mundane professions). How is that definition distinct from One-Hour Work Week again?

I think The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything is for a character type that has both stereotypes/behavioral aspects as well as an occupation. So someone who dresses and talks like a pirate, or a wizard, or a superhero, or a cowboy, but is never seen doing any piracy, magic, crime-fighting, or cattle-wrangling would be the The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything. Whereas someone who has a normal job like being an accountant or psychologist or janitor that doesn't have a lot of affectations associated with it who is rarely seen doing their job would be One-Hour Work Week.

With the The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything, they have a job that seems reasonably exciting that seems like it would make for good plots, but it implausibly never does. Whereas with One-Hour Work Week the job is unrelated to the plot, and is minimized for narrative purposes. Also I think with One-Hour Work Week, the character is occasionally seen working, but far less than most people in real life would, whereas The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything literally don't do the one thing that arguably most defines their character type/occupation.

The recently launched Writer Conflicts with Canon seems to be identical with Lying Creator.

It doesn't seem to be the same trope, but there is overlap. From my view, the overlap is strictly one-sided, making for a sub/supertrope pair.

A Lying Creator is when the creator straight up lies about things regarding the work.

Writer Conflicts with Canon is a bit wider, and covers any instances when what the creator has said something that wasn't true, or isn't true when the work reaches that point. It doesn't have to be lying, but any reason.

One point that may or may not be included (and would mean they're not sub/supertropes) is that Lying Creator is about things that are not canon, because they're meant to be lies. Writer Conflicts with Canon is about things the creator says that are meant to be canon, but for some reason are in conflict with the published work's canon.

So, Lying Creator is the sub-trope, because it only cover instances where we can confirm that the creator was deliberately lying, right? Does that mean that any examples of that specifically should just be on Lying Creator, not Writer Conflicts with Canon? That should probably be made more clear, because as of now there is no link on Lying Creator to Writer Conflicts with Canon.

Lying Creator is in WCWC's page, but potholed.

Yes, but there's nothing on Lying Creator to indicate that it is now a sub-trope. That fact should also probably be more explicit on Writer Conflicts with Canon.

I don't think anyone made note of that connection while launching the latter trope. Old tropes are usually not updated to reflect their relationships to new tropes.

Also, that's just my interpretation of it. I'm not sure if I've missed something, or if the focus on the tropes are elsewhere.

It's just a simple edit (crosswick) away...

Can someone explain the difference of UltimateGamer386 and That One Player?

@naturalironist: The definition of The Pirates Who Don't Do Anything doesn't seem to exclude mundane jobs though, and I'm not sure that "this character has a job but works far less than they logically should" and "this character has a job but is never seen working at all" isn't really a difference now, is it?

Also asking for the difference between Cuteness Proximity and Cuteness Overload. What I'm getting is that one refers to the reaction to cuteness, and the other refers to the one causing the reaction?

- Cuteness Overload says:

Isn't that The Same, but More Specific? Now it sounds like the only distinction between the two is the required distance to achieve the same effect.

Edited by Adept on Aug 1st 2018 at 11:04:33 PM

What's the difference between Reality Ensues and Truth in Television? Aren't they similar tropes that deal with situations that actually happen in real-life or are backed by science / history?

These two are quite different.

Reality Ensues is when someone attempts to invoke or exploit an unrealistic trope, resulting in unexpected consequences when things happen in a more realistic way instead. For example, a character with a flashy fighting style involving lots of acrobatic dodging is easily defeated by a character who just uses normal punches and grappling moves.

Truth in Television is used to describe a trope that can happen in real life.

Essentially, Reality Ensues is a subversion of expected storytelling tropes into surprisingly realistic consequences, while Truth in Television is just a note that the trope happens in Real Life. This also means they're mutually exclusive as applied to the same trope in the same situation.

Question is there a difference between Orphaned Series and Cut Short?

Orphaned Series is when a creator just decides to stop making a work without giving a resolution. Cut Short is when a work unexpectedly ends mid-Story Arc due to external factors like cancellation.

Edited by Primis on Oct 9th 2018 at 9:40:02 AM