Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

I'm gonna need to Bellamy, since he shares a universe with Norman Daniels.

edited 21st Oct '15 7:01:26 AM by DemonDuckofDoom

to Lin and Wang

to Bellamy. Sounds almost like generic villainy aside from the rape which seems to be off-screen. A 17 year old is not a child, sure it might be under the legal age but at that age you can't really call them defenseless.

Bellamy

For Sergey, currently his arc is on-going, and while he is under the control of the main antagonist Jean-Michael Roger, it's so far ambiguous how much control Roger has over him, or how bad Sergey was before Roger got his hands on him. I'll keep an eye on him (I adore Arc-V) and will report back if events develop to make him more eligible.

I have a suggestion for a character from a The Legend of Korra fanfiction The Saga of Avatar Korra.

Complete Monster: Ming-Hua in Saga is an unrepentant Sadist who gleefully takes every opportunity to physically and psychologically abuse Korra. She also lacks any of the likeable traits that her canon counterpart held and instead is shown to be needlessly cruel to both allies and enemies alike such as when she advocated for the needless punishment of the Red Lotus sentries who were stationed at the compound during Korra's escape and P'Li and Ghazan believe that she will want to "get rid" of Korra after she has served her purpose. Her malevolent tendencies are shown to not be a recent occurrence as flashback segments show that she felt nothing but excitement at the prospect of murdering a young Iroh in his bed. In the present day events of the story there are also several times where she needs to be verbally restrained or reprimanded by Zaheer or other Red Lotus members for her often pointless cruelty such as killing animals in front of Korra during water-bending lessons. When Korra chooses to turn against the Red Lotus, Ming calls P'Li and Ghazan weak for feeling any emotional attachment or reluctance to attack the girl whom was essentially raised by the Red Lotus and threatens to kill them if they defect from the Red Lotus. While the goals of the Red Lotus could be considered noble if unachievable, Ming never shows any interest in the ideological quest of the Red Lotus to bring freedom to the world and appears to only be interested in sating her own bloodlust. Cruel and sadistic, Ming-Hua is in many ways the living incarnation of the moral failures of the Red Lotus and one of several contributing factors for Korra's defection.

Well, I guess the moratorium does expire today, so... whatever.

Even if Rennie's not as bad as Bellamy, there's still The Fisherman to contend with.

Now that the moratorium is over, how long will we be discussing creepypastas and fanfictions? The sequel to that gym teacher creepypasta is not out yet, so it could take another 10 days. I just want to know how long we are going to talk about them before another moratorium.

to Cob, Lin, and Wang Shichong.

Well that we're just not going to discuss any further, period.

On an unrelated note, while I don't mean this as personal criticism, the Lheu Brenin entry at the top of this page made me remember something that's been sort of bugging me for a while: are the little rhetorical flourishes at the end of examples that people have been putting in really necessary? You know, the "Cruel, manipulative, and utterly remorseless, Evil Egbert proves that a silly name does not prevent someone from being a horrific villain" sort of thing. They've always seemed a little pointless to me.

Ming-Hua

Speaking of the moratorium's end, I have a proposition for rules regarding genres like Dark Fic and Torture Porn, though these may have been brought up by others before:

1. Regarding all works: The story has to have a plot beyond "awful person tortures people for no reason." So, Cannibal Holocaust can keep its example, but I'm not sure on The Human Centipede.

2. Regarding fanfic:

a. Any examples from the original canon, barring alternate universe versions, must be somewhat believable. So, say, a monstrous version of Roose Bolton can be there, but a monstrous version of Genie cannot.

b. The setting itself must have the potential for a CM. A The Dresden Files fic can have a CM, but a The Big Bang Theory fic cannot. I have no bloody clue if My Little Pony fics should be allowed, as there is at least one example in-canon.

Thoughts?

I fully intend to ignore anymore Dark Fic and Creepy pasta examples regardless of any future ruling on the matter.

I have to agree with nrjxll that these rhetorical flowers are unnecessary space wasters.

1 and 2a seem like sound guidelines and I can definitely support them. Not so sure about 2b, seeing as how you yourself bring up its ambiguity, but I can appreciate the spirit of it.

edited 21st Oct '15 12:34:53 PM by LordXavius

I'm actually leaning "allow" for MLP fics, since there is that one canon example.

Oh, for anybody wondering about point 1's ambiguity: The only reason I'm unsure on Human Centipede is because I haven't seen the film.

Totally agree on the proposed rules, though the "canon" rule might present a few problems. I think MLP can stay so long as the examples aren't utterly screwed up dark-fics; the POV series in particular seems to have diverged enough from the themes and moods of canon to the point where its become measurable by its own standards. Same with PONY.MOV, because that's more outright parody.

On the subject of fanfics, this entry on the Pokemon page is a cut.

• The Big Bad of Poké Wars, Ho-oh, starts off as a Well-Intentioned Extremist wanting to make a utopia for Pokemon by focusing only on humans and trying to limit collateral damage. He soon starts engaging in things like killing Pokemon who don't agree with him and destroying the environment.

Barely any detail aside, reading the workpage it seems Ho-oh is The Atoner, to the point where he willingly condemns himself to an And I Must Scream fate any realizing his mistakes.

edited 21st Oct '15 12:42:27 PM by Scraggle

Well, Ho-oh, then.

Oh, and, for the record, I'm against the ending remark lines too. I think write-ups should be as concise as is possible while still being clear (see my The Galaxy Invader writeup for an example).

edited 21st Oct '15 12:44:01 PM by DemonDuckofDoom

I also Ho-Oh.

I like Demon Duck's proposal.

As it is, I tend not to bother commenting on fanfic examples.

Ho-Oh.

There was really no point to the Human Centipede, unless you count "Ooh, we're edgy" as a point. A majority of Creepypastas also have no point to them, or they have the gall to use serious subject matter like rape and murder for no other reason other than the fact that they could prove that they could be edgy.

For example, one entry I think could go is Uncle Johnny from Sally, Play With Me, mostly due to the fact that the author used rape as a plot device, and he treated it so lightly. I mean, when Sally told her mother about it, she assumed that she was just having an active imagination. The story could've had it to where Johnny would just kill Sally, but no, the author decided to add in the fact that Sally was raped, because it was "edgy." And don't get me started on the authors who glamorize their characters murdering other people, because it's cool. These authors do not know how to make a scary story if one was to slap them in the face.

I'm seriously not anticipating the gym teacher story.....I mean, having him cut someone's head off and then humping it? What the hell?

edited 21st Oct '15 12:50:46 PM by AustinDR

The creepypasta examples in general need to be looked at. The example from The Dating Game is literally nothing but an excuse for torture porn; it's like if some jackass looked at the Complete Monster page and tried to stretch the definition as far as he bloody could. The wife is definitely a monster, but it's an example of a monster done wrong, and I'd be happy to cut her as well as the other "torture porn" creepypastas while leaving the few examples that come from that of a pasta with an actual story like Red.

What. Let's just cut those two, assuming they have no real plot. I know I'm not reading them.

I like Scraggle's idea.

edited 21st Oct '15 1:03:31 PM by DemonDuckofDoom

I wouldn't mind taking a look at Johnny - when you actually look at the story and following fandom Sally gathered, that's when you realize the story wasn't meant to be scary or "edgy" but to make a new creepypasta icon. The rape was included to build sympathy for Sally and make the viewers further despise Uncle Johnny, beyond the fact he simply killed Sally. Needless to say, it worked, if you read the viewer comments in You Tube readings, they all amount to "Poor Sally, she's so cute I want to hug her" to "I wanna kill Johnny". All and all, Johnny's total count it one person. You can't add rape to a story to make it edgy, if your going to, use it as more then a plot device and have it fit the character or story - Mitch Tolbat being an obvious exception, being a rapist is part of his character and does at one point effect the plot of his movie.

I'm abstaining too, just like Melon. I prefer to discuss actual published candidates.

Earlier, somebody suggested Lewis Snart from The Flash (2014), but didn't go into detailed why he potentially qualified. We learn that he was abusive towards Leonard and Lisa, leaving an ugly scar on the latter's collarbone. After getting out of prison, he convinces Leonard to join him by planting a bomb on Lisa and threatening to kill her with it, and tests said bomb on one of his mooks. He claims to have used it on the mook because he insulted Leonard, but later in the episode, he would keep calling him and Lisa disappointments. Barry goes undercover to help them with their heist, and he repays him by shooting him (though, Barry's speed powers allowed him to catch the bullet). He was so bad, that Leonard was willing to break his deal with Barry not to kill anybody so he could finally get payback for what he did once the bomb planted in Lisa was deactivated.

Sounds like a pretty low-level villain. How do the other common baddies stack up?