The Scrappy Cleanup

The kett definitely wouldn't qualify since they're a group; groups can't be The Scrappy.

I'm not too familiar with the Mass Effect expanded universe or Mass Effect: Andromeda. Anyone more familiar with those works know just how much those characters are actually hated?

Tann, at least, is a racist jerkass who nobody can really stand in-universe. I have a hard time believing he wasn't meant to be disliked.

edited 10th Sep '17 7:53:43 PM by nrjxll

I rather like the title of scrappy heap, it implies that the retool rescued them from being put on a bus do the unpopularity.

I removed Ezlo and Ooccoo from the Zelda page. We hadn't really come to a consensus, but both entries provided little context for why either were disliked.

Moving on to https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/TheScrappy/FinalFantasy My thoughts:

Edward and Tellah: Entries read like Tier Induced Scrappy rather than this trope.

Rosa: Bad entry. It outright says much of the hate comes from shippers and that she actually isn't hated so much as liked less because other characters are stronger/more interesting.

Faris/FFV translations: I am not so sure one bad translation/localization makes a character a Scrappy.

Cyan: Reads like complaining and Tier Induced Scrappy.

Spoiled Rich Kid: Do annoying, nameless NP Cs even count?

Barrett: Is he really that hated? Americans Hate Tingle if anything (the page calls him an Ethnic Scrappy)

Cait Sith: The "possibly Rescued Fromthe Scrappy Heap" line makes the entry seem weak.

Genesis: Complaining.

Quina: Probably a Lethal Joke Character and a bit complainy. If Quina is a valid example of a Scrappy (and we would need to know how he/she was received by the Japanese fanbase), the entry probably needs a rewrite.

Eiko: May need more context and could be a case of Americans Hate Tingle.

Zorn and Thorn: Entry waffles on different aspects of the characters.

Seymour: Recurring boss who is annoying because he is recurring is not this trope.

Tidus: Americans Hate Tingle if anything.

I am not familiar with the newer games, so I'll leave that to someone who knows the fandom better.

Cait Sith has at least a moderate hatedom, but I'm not sure it's enough.

Quina is similar, with the difference that some people appreciate her from a mechanical perspective, but I've heard very few people who like the character, and many who hate it.

The rest of the ones you mentioned are cuttable. Some I believe have Japanese fanbases, some are hate sinks, and some are plainly just not hated.

For later characters, Vaan has a fair bit of hate, but most of it is just wishing someone else was the main character. He also still has a fair few fans. I don't really like him, but I don't think he fits.

Noel and Serah at best fall under Replacement Scrappy, but they're popular enough anyway.

I was waiting for more input before cutting things, but I can start cleaning up the Final Fantasy section.

Vaan is more of a Replacement Scrappy then anything. People don't like him because he takes up the MC spot. Character wise he isn't really a problem, and he's a good party member gameplay wise.

Quina probably could fall into being one though. Main complaint is lack of role in the game and annoying character gimmick. While I'd say Quina is annoying, not sure about being a scrappy.

edited 25th Sep '17 1:55:02 AM by keyblade333

The FF 6 Spoiled Rich Kid in the auction probably is hated, but probably fits better as a Scrappy Mechanic then a Scrappy. It's a funny joke the first time, but then you realize it shows up randomly (as part of the RNG that is the FF 6 Auction House).

Edit: And if that's being added to FF 6 Scrappy Mechanic entry, then so should the randomness that is the FF 6 Colosseum; the Auction House randomness only wastes time, while the Colosseum randomness costs you items if you don't resort to Save Scumming.

edited 25th Sep '17 5:09:53 AM by thok

I went ahead and removed the entry on Faris and the different translations for Final Fantasy V because the entry was more about the changes to the translation rather than the character herself.

Ehhh, a lot of people seem to genuinely hate him, not just his role. Personally I don't get it (he's a nice kid, he just makes no sense being called the protagonist), but the sentiment is absolutely out there.

I think there are still enough people who like Vaan for him to not be The Scrappy. While he doesn't fill the main character position very well, he does fill the viewpoint character role very well.

edited 25th Sep '17 6:21:15 AM by AnotherDuck

Should entries from other Scrappy pages, like Tier Induced Scrappy, Replacement Scrappy, and Rescued from the Scrappy Heap remain on the main The Scrappy page?

I'm not sure if we have a definite ruling on that, but in my opinion, they can overlap, but will require sufficient context to explain why they fit both tropes, similar to examples that are both The Scrappy and Hate Sink.

Rescued from the Scrappy Heap examples that are also on The Scrappy will need need some time limitation in the writeup for The Scrappy. Rescued from the Scrappy Heap isn't as strict with the hatedom part as The Scrappy is (for instance, the description includes a Hate Sink type).

Replacement Scrappy might be better to just consider as mutually exclusive, but if there's a strong case for why a character would be The Scrappy even without the replacement aspect, then I think an examples on both would be okay. But only if.

Tier Induced Scrappy is about a different aspect. The Scrappy is about the character, while Tier Induced Scrappy is about the game mechanics. As they're not about the same concept, they can overlap without too much trouble. And that trouble is mostly people not adding sufficient context.

What's our policy about Scrappy Mechanic ? Cause right now it's becoming the place for easy complains in the Metroid: Samus Returns page.

• Scrappy Mechanic:
  • The melee counter. While it's fairly easy to execute, the sheer amount of enemies that almost require it if you want to kill them quickly can get extremely tiring as it halts the flow of the game. The need to do this lessens as you get stronger weapons and some enemies become able to handle the counter. Melee counters are also the only way to earn more Aieon energy from enemies since successful counters have them drop the energy more than they would have from a normal kill. On Hard and Fusion difficulties, you pretty much need to melee counter everything just to be able to survive.
  • Some argue that the Scan Pulse makes the game too easy by removing the need to find breakable blocks by yourself. Others argue that this mechanic is not fundamentally different than revealing breakable blocks using a Power Bomb or the X-Ray Scope.
  • Metroids that flee to another room mid fight are annoying since you have to track them down to continue the fight, which is also a nightmare for speed runners.
  • The controls used to go into Morph Ball form isn't exactly fluid or comfortable; you can either double tap down on the circle pad or tap the touch screen to activate the Morph Ball. Double tapping on the circle pad isn't as quick as double tapping on the D-pad and using the touch screen for a mode change briefly taking your finger off of the face buttons when you may need to be ready to jump or make another move in the moment. The controls not being editable doesn't help either.

Which basically is "every new mechanics sucks because they're not in the original games" at this point.

The fleeing metroids and the morph ball controls are at least vaguely legitimate but they're more "a mechanic that is slightly annoying but doesn't impact much on the game overall" than an acutal scrappy mechanic, and i'm not sure if that is or not People Sit On Chairs .

The scan pulse is probably the most undefendable one, since how can a 100% facultative gameplay element be a scrappy mechanic ?

edited 25th Sep '17 9:42:47 AM by Yumil

I think that fits more to the Remove Complaining thread

The Scan Pulse is just whining. It's also weaselwording.

I don't think things that impact speedrunners count, since that's a specific segment of the fanbase and Self-Imposed Challenge. Overall it's a very small part of the total fanbase. Furthermore, the speedrunning community is more likely to see things that makes it harder as a challenge than as a Scrappy Mechanic. That makes it sound as a personal complaint more than anything else. Possibly someone trying to argue for others.

Slightly annoying or uncomfortable controls is rather weak, but I'm not sure about the fandom.

YMMV.Rock Band lists songs as The Scrappy. This seems to be misuse, since The Scrappy is an audience reaction to a character, not to a song. And on top of that, the way some examples are worded comes awfully close to applying this to real-life people.

I scrapped those. Complete misuse.

Alright, scrapped the samus return section too. Ain't in the mood to take people disguised complaining. I'll make sure to take other cases of Scrappy Mechanic to the complaining thread next time.

edited 25th Sep '17 2:21:54 PM by Yumil

I've deleted some examples from Video Game/Xenogears

Entry describes Base-Breaking Character, not Scrappy.

Yeah, "hotly debated" and "controversial" means there are arguments for and against, which means it's not The Scrappy.

Caillou

Its somewhat bratty protagonist is listed both as Base-Breaking Character and The Scrappy, and not on an escalation way but in a simultaneous one.

A Base-Breaking Character, by definition, has too many fans to be considered a Scrappy. I haven't watched that show, but I suggest erring on the side of caution and removing The Scrappy entry while leaving the Base-Breaking Character entry there.

Unless someone with more experience with the show's fanbase would like to weigh in?

edited 30th Sep '17 9:32:39 PM by dragonfire5000

As far as I can remember, Caillou could be too rude.

I did the change, although I did not delete the entry at TheScrappy.Western Animation. The main and YMMV articles seem to show that his personality is divisive. The nice, Mr. Imagination is either charming or bland, while his Bratty Half-Pint personality is either realistic or a terrible influence for children. He is mostly a Karma Houdini.