NATTER ALERT!

Bringing this up from Obligatory Swearing:

• Early episodes of Funimation's One Piece dub on DVD often had rather excessive amounts of profanity. Apparently, this was a direct result of the show's target audience, which in the United States would be teenagers - many of whom were right in the middle of their "swearing makes anything cooler!" phase and who would make requests to the effect of "I think it would be cool if Luffy calls [insert antagonist here] a bastard in the next episode" on the forums. After a couple of disks, the dubbers thankfully stopped listening as much; it simmers down to the occasional "bastard" or "I'm gonna kick your ass!"
  • Somewhat justified with the early episodes, especially Sanji's introduction episodes, because his Catchphrase is commonly translated as either "shit" or "crap."
  • Another theory is that the swearing was meant to separate Funimation's translation from the infamous kiddie 4Kids Entertainment version.
  • On the subs for Episode 432, the inmates' nickname for Magellan is "Shit Man" (likely derived from his spending hours every day in the bathroom with diarrhea), and they say it over and over in that scene.

Bringing these up from 555:

• Slipknot's song "The Heretic Anthem" featured the chorus: "If you're 5-5-5 then I'm 6-6-6", though the lyrics feature no real Satanic overtones and the use of the number was really just for shock value.
  • Since 555 is commonly used as the exchange for phone numbers in movies and television, the line could be interpreted to mean that if you're trying to fit in and be acceptable, he's trying to be edgy and unacceptable.

• Of course, there's "867-5309/Jenny", the 1981 smash hit from power pop band Tommy Tutone. Which is still a bane to anyone in the US with this number. A few scans of the number in every area code have been made: this one-man effort in 2004, this collaborative effort in 2007 and an attempt at a wiki whose last sign of life goes back to 2010. All three have found that most were disconnected (for obvious reasons), but most that worked went to voicemail, and most of those made some reference to the song (ie, "...and no, Jenny is not here." or sometimes "Hi! This is Jenny, leave a message.") At least one extension of the number is held by the company Retrofitness, a chain of fitness gyms. It uses the number for potential franchisees.
  • Two extensions in Rhode Island and southern Massachusetts are owned (and trademarked!) by local plumbing company Gem Plumbing & Heating. Their television and radio commercials prominently feature the number, but they aren't allowed to use the Tommy Tutone song or even a soundalike (their jingle that uses the number sounds like it was intentionally written to sound as little like "Jenny" as possible). Gem even sued a national plumbing outfit for using the same number for their toll free line. That case made national news and greatly annoyed Tommy Tutone singer Tommy Heath, who called the whole thing ridiculous (courts ultimately found for Gem, since they had the trademark).
  • Rumor has it that attracting crank calls was the purpose of the song: it was written to get back at the singer's ex.

Reporting natter on Creator.Sean Chiplock, under the Berserk Button entries, although shamefully this was largely my own doing before I finally learnt what Natter is, but my editing rights have been revoked by the time I learnt. The Natter are encapsulated by Note tags.

Edited by RAMChYLD on Oct 29th 2022 at 10:11:42 AM

I think they could be cut.

Right. Now that I know what I'm doing wrong, the Notes should all be removed outright except maybe the short one explaining what "backseating" is. I think it's beneficial to leave that in as it's not a term widely used outside of streaming circles, I even had to look it up the first time I heard it. If there's a useful notes page about streaming jargons, maybe it can be removed and a link to the jargon page be placed in it's place.

Edited by RAMChYLD on Oct 29th 2022 at 1:59:58 AM

Added to Trivia.Sonic Frontiers

• Dueling Games:
  • With God of War Ragnarök, a highly anticipated title and sequel to acclaimed God of War (PS4). It even releases a day after Sonic Frontiers.
  • To a lesser extent, Pokémon Scarlet and Violet, which releases a week after Frontiers, since both involve an Open World gameplay that neither franchise has experienced before.
    • Lesser extent due to the Pokémon franchise having already experimented with a wide open space you can spot Pokémon inside in Sword/Shield, and an actual open world in Legends Arceus, in the span of barely three years. So franchise fatigue is likely a factor.

I don't get what this third bullet is trying to say.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

I don't feel the third bullet is necessary and I believe it's trying to explain things... I think. As a side note, I don't feel these entries have enough context.

The third bullet makes the entry argue with itself by saying, in essence, "Not exactly, Pokemon has experimented with open world gameplay before", so it's not exactly new. As such, it can be cut for being a natter and justifying edit combo.

Edited by UFOYeah on Oct 30th 2022 at 10:13:11 AM

Bringing these up from 555:

• Slipknot's song "The Heretic Anthem" featured the chorus: "If you're 5-5-5 then I'm 6-6-6", though the lyrics feature no real Satanic overtones and the use of the number was really just for shock value.
  • Since 555 is commonly used as the exchange for phone numbers in movies and television, the line could be interpreted to mean that if you're trying to fit in and be acceptable, he's trying to be edgy and unacceptable.

• Of course, there's "867-5309/Jenny", the 1981 smash hit from power pop band Tommy Tutone. Which is still a bane to anyone in the US with this number. A few scans of the number in every area code have been made: this one-man effort in 2004, this collaborative effort in 2007 and an attempt at a wiki whose last sign of life goes back to 2010. All three have found that most were disconnected (for obvious reasons), but most that worked went to voicemail, and most of those made some reference to the song (ie, "...and no, Jenny is not here." or sometimes "Hi! This is Jenny, leave a message.") At least one extension of the number is held by the company Retrofitness, a chain of fitness gyms. It uses the number for potential franchisees.
  • Two extensions in Rhode Island and southern Massachusetts are owned (and trademarked!) by local plumbing company Gem Plumbing & Heating. Their television and radio commercials prominently feature the number, but they aren't allowed to use the Tommy Tutone song or even a soundalike (their jingle that uses the number sounds like it was intentionally written to sound as little like "Jenny" as possible). Gem even sued a national plumbing outfit for using the same number for their toll free line. That case made national news and greatly annoyed Tommy Tutone singer Tommy Heath, who called the whole thing ridiculous (courts ultimately found for Gem, since they had the trademark).
  • Rumor has it that attracting crank calls was the purpose of the song: it was written to get back at the singer's ex.

I think the sub-bullet-point for Slipknot should be deleted or merged into the main point with summarization applied (the line "Since 555 is commonly used as the exchange for phone numbers in movies and television" can be cut since it's already in-context). For the Tommy Tutone example, I think it can use some tidying up. The mentions about the effort of scanning the number can be cut.

Maybe:

• Of course, there's "867-5309/Jenny", the 1981 hit from power pop band Tommy Tutone. In most areas, the number is disconnected, in those area where the number worked, the call went to voicemails that usually made some reference to the song. Other noteworthy companies making use of that number included a gym franchise called Retrofitness and a plumbing company called GEM Plumbing and Heating respectively.

I don't know about the mention of getting back at the singer's ex tho. That sounds like natter to me. What do you think? If you think it can be left in, it probably should be merged into the main point.

Edited by RAMChYLD on Nov 4th 2022 at 10:26:22 AM

This entry on No Port For You is pretty nattery and violates Examples Are Not Recent.

• American Girl is guilty of this - for no explicable reason other than mentioning on their Facebook page that they are comfortable with iOS development. Even if Android's market share "makes them attractive" they only released most of their recent games for Apple's mobile operating system.
  • This is compounded by the fact that the companion app for a toy television made for Maryellen Larkin is designed with regular-size iPad models in mind, since the TV playset essentially acts as a specialised case for the original model up to the iPad 4. While there are Android devices using a similar form factor, e.g. Goopads and models from lesser-known firms, they're few and far behind, and most tablets are just too small or odd-sized for it to fit inside the television.
  • Also, the comfort zone excuse is moot considering how the mobile games were written using cross-platform libraries like Adobe AIR or Unity for example. With the case of AIR all you have to do is to recompile the Flash project with little or no changes and set Android as a target, provided you have Android Studio installed. Whether American Girl was paid off by Apple to snub Android users or not is anyone's guess.
  • In general, anything put out by Mattel/Fisher-Price for the mobile platform tends to be this, if not a bad port that is several versions behind the iOS version, and all of their mobile accessories to date are for iDevices only. Many have speculated that they have an exclusivity deal with Apple.
  • Still an issue as of the recently released Wellie Wishers game, and that's despite AG's assurances of a port or two for other platforms, along with children's electronics firm Nabi (who were recently acquired by Mattel) releasing an American Girl-themed variant of their Nabi SE tablet. The latter would've given them an even bigger reason for them to port most of their games to Android, but strangely enough this hasn't been the case as of now.
    • Except that as it turns out, they did make a port of some of those games. The clincher is that not only it's exclusively available upon purchase of the American Girl-themed tablet, it is not available from other tablets in the series.
    • While the original WellieWishers remains iOS exclusive, Garden Fun is available on both Android and iOS worldwide. Except that the Android port of the game became a Porting Disaster when it was first launched, crashing silently on a number of devices, and was even made worse with the 1.1 update, of which American Girl seemingly forgot to upload the updated OBB files for the game; this was later corrected in a recent hotfix.

Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!

Condense the useful info to just a few sentences.

Well, while the info isn't current, it's still worth noting. But yeah, I think it can be condensed better. Not everything in there is natter. I also see a major indentation issue with it. I suggest crossposting it to the Fix Up Example Indentation thread.

Edit: Nevermind, I crossposted.

Edited by RAMChYLD on Nov 11th 2022 at 11:41:34 AM

This is on Weird: The Al Yankovic Story under an admittedly lengthy Artistic License – History section:

• Why did we keep adding to this part of the page?!

Is that natter, or no?

I'd say it is.

Yes, it's someone trying to be snarky. (also the previous line has broken spoiler markup)

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

(x3) Yeah, and feel free to remove it.

Bringing this up from the Turn of the Millennium sub-page for Unintentional Period Piece:

• Gossip Girl:
  • The show's first couple of seasons uses the fact that the principal casts have cell phones that can send pictures as a way of showing how rich and privileged they are. It's very telling that the eponymous columnist operates from a website rather than a social media account. Social media would probably make it hard for Gossip Girl to even exist, as the teens could probably just tweet the gossip themselves. With social media, it would make Serena's sudden disappearance to boarding school at the start of the series a little harder to take — it's easy to not return Blair's calls but ignoring her on social media would be tricky (MySpace is mentioned, but it wasn't as widely used as Twitter or Facebook would be), and Serena would not have been able to completely avoid her friends that way.
  • Additionally Jenny is a budding fashion designer and has to pay her dues sorting thumbtacks at an internship — whereas in the age of social media she could easily promote her dresses through Facebook, Instagram, and/or Pinterest. She does have a brief storyline in Season 2 where she and a model called Agnes try to market her dresses online, but they need Agnes's photographer friend to take high-quality pictures. Overall the flamboyant lifestyle reeks of a pre-2008 recession age. More superficially, the soundtrack is comprised of the most notable pop hits of the day.

@fragglelover: I think that should be removed. It shouldn't be there. If the film keeps breaking the fourth wall, it should be an entry on it's own.

@Dongwa Chan: Those entries probably could use some condensation but are otherwise fine I think. I think the elaboration for justification of the setting of the show would at least make it clear that social media doesn't exist to those who don't get to watch it?

Edited by RAMChYLD on Nov 17th 2022 at 3:52:05 AM

Bringing this up from Market-Based Title:

• Hellmann's mayonnaise. "Known as 'Best Foods Mayonnaise' west of the Rockies". ^note Best Foods, based in California, bought out Hellmann's, based in New York, in 1927, but since both brands had such huge sales shares in their particular regions, Best Foods elected to keep the separate brandings.
  • Similarly, Dreyer's Ice Cream became Edy's Ice Cream (named after a different company founder) when it started selling products east of the Rocky Mountains. In this case, it was to prevent confusion with already-established ice cream maker Breyers. On the other hand, people west of the Rockies can get both Dreyer's and Breyers and there doesn't seem to be any problem telling them apart.
  • Oddly enough, both Hellmann's and Best Foods Mayonnaise, as well as Dreyer's and Edy's Ice Cream, are both available together at some Grocery Outlet supermarkets in California.
  • Unilever, who owns Hellmann's/Best Foods and make various other products, is known for buying local brands in different countries and keeping their names, so the same company's "Heartbrand" ice creams are known by dozens of different names across dozens of countries. (Note that Unilever also controls a number of other non-Heartbrand ice creams, e.g. Breyer's and the premium brand Ben and Jerry's.)
  • Unilever uses a similar strategy for Axe deodorant (it's called Lynx in the UK, Australia, and China).
    • Similarly, what's Degree in the US is Rexona in South-East Asia. Right down to the logo and the slogan "It won't let you down".

Firstly, I feel that needs more context. Nextly, the first sub bullet sounds like it should be its own entry since it's about something else. The rest don't add anything and should be cut.

I second with Random Troper 123. Some of these tropes could be broken up into their own entries. I feel like the elaboration is not so much as natter than providing context tho, so they could probably just use some condensation and cleanup.

Edited by RAMChYLD on Nov 21st 2022 at 4:06:44 AM

This entry from Small Reference Pools has a bad example of first-person writing in the second bullet:

• Green Day only ever released two albums: Dookie and American Idiot. The only songs they ever made are "Basket Case", "When I Come Around", "Good Riddance (Time of Your Life)" (which is from Nimrod, for bonus points), "Boulevard of Broken Dreams", "Wake Me Up When September Ends", and "21 Guns" (from 21st Century Breakdown!). Considering they were one of the biggest rock bands in both the 90s and 00s, it's a bit frustrating that these are the only songs people refer to.
  • It only gets worse when we're talking about Millennials, many of whom think American Idiot was their first album. Outside of the album's singles, the only other song of theirs widely known to the new generation is "Good Riddance." Don't expect them to realize it predates Idiot, though.

Edited by DongwaChan on Nov 28th 2022 at 10:20:33 AM

Second bullet could be rewritten as "For audiences born after 2000, American Idiot may as well be their first album because everything older than it, except for 'Good Riddance', rarely receives attention nowadays." and merged with the first bullet.

The entire example currently feels like complaining. I'm also not sure how millenials fit into this because they were born from 1980-1995, meaning they largely grew up with the albums that the example says that they don't know about.

Edited by Blegh on Nov 29th 2022 at 9:47:28 AM