During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
The Draftsman of Doom
I think that it would be worthwhile discussing Echoes in depth, if not cutting it outright until we get the chance to discuss it in depth.
We all know this item is not a badge of honour. Literally anyone here who has done an effortpost is capable of having a candidate downvoted. All that matters is that essential information is not left out or mispresented. Okay, I think this last bit was gratuitious.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Noted.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 7th 2020 at 10:34:33 AM
Feels good, don't it?
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Lester Lloyd Goodman.
Mir: Sure. Basically it seriously exaggerates a few parts, the only person who's intentions for the Stag are flat out rape is Quested himself. The rest of the villagers treat more akin to a weird swingers party, with it being clear a lot of their targets are equally enthusiastic (whilst the sane, sober people simply don't go).
Their is a even a comedic scene of one half drunk yokel knocking on the door of a woman he fancies, only for her husband to open up and lay him out a single blow.
After Quested gets exposed and arrested, everyone involves just sheepishly slinks off home without a single word.
Even him offering up his daughter isn't played as horrific as it sounds. The guy he offers her to is presented as a dimwitted pathetic sap whom he simply lies to that she's willing if he ensures the event occurs (and he mostly fails at that). The event itself goes nowhere, with her effortless escaping him and him being left dumbstruck trying to comprehend what just happened.
Edited by MGD107 on May 7th 2020 at 7:15:55 AM
Sky, please don't belabor the point 43 said it handily enough without needing that. It feels like it's just rubbing it in at that point.
I don't want to cut Echoes, but I want to just ensure they all keep.
Yes to Goodman.
My stance is cut them all right now and if anyone wants to individually revisit them, they'll be free to.
Want me to vet, if anyone wants to assist?
Sure bro.
Iago, Spore, Michael and Goodman
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Yuan
Switching to an abstain on Mommy.
Sir Michael (yuuuuck) and Goodman.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
S'up guys, how ya'll doing? I just caught someone adding an unapproved block of examples on YMMV.Mo Dao Zu Shi. Do with it what you will.
Edited by WarJay77 on May 7th 2020 at 11:19:32 AM
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
But Sir Michael sounds like such a Nice Guy...
Juust kidding. Michael
I'll cut the entry in a sec WarJay... given his character page tells me his fate is to get gang raped to death this is probably another uncomfortable Malty case right off the bat and the fact half his entry is devoted to generic Jerkass behaviour isn't helping disprove that.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Not sure what "uncomfortable Malty case means", but glad you've got it covered I'll let ya'll handle it while I return to lurking like a weirdo.
Malty was a genuinely evil character from an anime whose karmic punishment was to be married to a man infamous for raping and torturing his wives to death....we weren't much happy about that.
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
I did plan on later on relitigating Alpha (I believe I've mentioned that to Lighty in PM) when I had more time much like I did with the Warlord, but that being said, Kenta and Obito are firm keeps. Again, that's just my opinion. You can read it and see for yourself...
Oh yeah, Malty. She had agency problems, from what I've heard...
Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on May 7th 2020 at 6:48:22 PM
J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
Wild Child
On Avatar: The Last Airbender fanfic YMMV.Distorted Reality.
- Complete Monster: Azula from Aang's world
Georgie are you saying you're planning on bringing up Alpha and the Warlord again or that you were planning on relitigating to cut them as we've already done? I think they've run their course and Lighty and I will look into the other characters to see if they hold up.
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I said that I was planning to relitigate them like it was already done because like I've mentioned when I dealt with the Warlord again, I thought my arguments for their cases was quite weak in retrospective.
Got it!
Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on May 7th 2020 at 7:46:54 PM
J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Two times in one night... but I've taken the liberty of axing this one myself (since it's also a ZCE) and left a link to the thread. It's also hilarious to imagine these two characters are so heinous as to be pure evil; they're both just petty assholes befitting the fairy-tale plot, and nothing more.
Ah well, I've done my job for the night. Later ~
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
BTW guys, upon re-reading Uchiha Heiress Remix and noticing something I failed to notice beforehand... I think we might be cutting Sakura. Now, that isn't fault of the character itself, as Sakura fits every required aspect without falling into Ron the Death Eater.
The issue is, upon re-reading chapter 22 (it's been years since I've read this one, as it happened long before Sakura's Face–Heel Turn and thus I didn't feel the need to re-read it when I effortposted her)... I've noticed a short lime scene between Naruto and Hinata... Who are 12.
In the event that it isn't conductive to our standards - and I doubt it is -, Sakura needs to go now.
J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
Lizzid people!
Is the overall fic rife with scenes like that?
Edited by AustinDR on May 8th 2020 at 12:26:12 PM
Fielding and Goodman.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Malty was from The Rising Of The Shield Hero; her rapist DOES count.
Yes to Michael and Goodman.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Yes to the last two... Georgie between you waffling on the points you tried to use to protect her inclusion, touch on her insanity only to go "But it's okay since she can tell the kids apart... she's got multiple personality disorder, but they're all dicks" and wrote an ostensibly neutral EP as indicated by the "I abstain" conclusion only to fight tooth and nail to see her go up, I'm seriously having trouble trusting any argument in her favour.
Reading through your latest post here... there are about three red flags popping up from it alone, so I'm not sure what you've got to be ranting about.
What are we doing about Echoes? Lighty and I have some serious concerns about that whole sheet.
Edited by 43110 on May 7th 2020 at 9:47:51 AM