During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Convex.
Robert Walton.
Ah Puch.
I also got news that Sony and Disney cleared the air with a new deal. Aong other things, Venom (2018) may be implemented into the MCU.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Yes to Convex, Walton and Ah Puch.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Showtime!
to Convex, Walton and Ah Puch
I'm making this EP because I searched it up and it looks like no one has discussed it before in this thread. Either no one thought of discussing it or no one thought it would count. Either way I am going to EP it, and I'm sorry if anyone wanted to or had dibs on it.
What's The Work?
The Harbinger Experiment, a Creepypasta
Who Is He? What Has He Done?
"Zimmerman" (Real name unknown as the narrator refuses to reveal it) was a scientist from the 1970s and the director of the titular Harbinger Experiment of the story.
He was known for being a ruthless and cold man who would commit heinous and amoral acts in order to get results for his research, enough that he is seen as a monster and freak among the scientific community.
Though he has wealth and loyalty partially because he can pay his security team and scientists to go along with his monstrous experiments. He is obsessed with the supernatural, believing in beings from other dimensions and spent 16 years preparing for his project to summon entities from beyond this world into ours.
He bought a plot of land and created a facility there for the project, hiring countless scientists and researchers, including the narrator. Zimmerman has more or less made it so his security team have kept everyone there regardless of whether they want to be or if they choose to back out.
The experiment would open a portal between worlds momentarily, allowing three random "entities" to cross over to our world, and each one these beings would be trapped within one of the three rooms to possess a host trapped within them.
Zimmerman found three hosts of the form of a desperate man in need of money, a drug addict woman and a male drifter, believing to be taking part of a social experiment, a harmless study of the effect of isolation on the human mind which is also the lie Zimmerman told his backers. The point of choosing them is that they were expendable and that no one would notice them if they disappeared.
The experiment began in 1987 in which Zimmerman used a chant or some sort of arcane spell to try and open the portal. This seemed to work as the agonizing screams of the subjects were heard, frightening the researchers only there for money while Zimmerman and his loyalists watched with callous disregard.
The next day, Zimmerman and his crew began to enter the facility to see the results of their work, with the place becoming eery and murky as they could feel the presence of a great evil there. Zimmmerman was simply overjoyed, not frightened like everyone else.
When they check on the girl on the monitor, who appears dead with a look of dread on her face, Zimmerman furiously turns off the monitor, only caring that his host died and that he had killed this poor woman.
Zimmerman then ordered if the images in the other monitors did not return within the next two hours, the security team would be sent to investigate the rooms. While the security team accepted their task, even they began to become frightened by their situation.
Afterwards, one of the live subjects appeared on the monitor, mutated and possessed by one of the entities. Even Zimmerman and his loyal collegues finally began to show fear. Zimmerman then orders his security team to enter the room of the other subject, in which they are attacked by another entity possessing the other host.
They were able to kill the host but at the cost of one of their own men, Frank, who is buried outside. Hurs later, the power went out causing a panic which spiraled into chaos as people began attacking each other to try and escape.
Eventually the remaining entity gets out and kills Zimmerman. His experiment leading to the deaths of countless scientists and men, and leading to the narrator being traumatized by his experience.
Freudian Excuse? Redeeming Qualities?
None. He's willing to use whatever methods for his experiments and projects, and those loyal to him are either just as heinous or simply bought with money.
Heinousness
Frowned upon by other scientists for being seen as a freak and amoral scientist?
Willing to use three innocent people as hosts for demonic entities, leading to their agonizing deaths and torture should they fail or be possessed?
Having no pity or remorse, and simply being overjoyed at the possibility that his project is successful?
Sending in his security team into a room filled with possibly a dangerous murderous entity from another dimension?
Final Verdict
Probably not. Yes and no for me but probably not for anyone else.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Yes to Convex, Walton, Ah Puch, and Zimmerman.
Cut Lijah Cuu; barely passes the baseline in general, and I've always disagreed with the idea that standalone Warhammer 40k series should be taken as separate from the overall 40k universe, since I think they're harder to divorce from the main canon then, say, different Marvel/DC titles with the overall Marvel/DC universe.
Edited by falcontalons on Aug 23rd 2019 at 7:14:02 AM
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Yes to Zimmerman.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Here is a question, are all Warhammer 40k media set in the same universe?
Yep. That's why it's Wahammer 40K.
Nobody needs to be cut beyond Cuu.
Goku Black
Yeah novels set in a tabletop game universe tend to be Canon to the tabletop unless specified not to be.
It's where most of the information for some of the more wide ranging cms like Lolth and Nicolas bolas come from.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
The Draftsman of Doom
Leaning towards approving Zimmerman.
Feels good, don't it?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Even though I DO remember a review of a novel that tried to make Fabius freaking Bile sympathetic, but I'm fine just chalking that up to Depending on the Writer.
Fun fact: Even Abaddon cared for Horus at one point, before he went on his Rage Against the Mentor.
Edited by ACW on Aug 23rd 2019 at 10:43:41 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Goku Black
Well there is like hundreds of authors for stuff like this.
Obviously some characters will be portrayed differently under a certain writer.
Cyric also had a Simlair thing in forbidden realms for a bit.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
The MILF Virus
Convex, Walton, Ah Puch, and Zimmerman.
Sad to see this week is much slower then usual. Guess many of us are burnt out with finding potential candidates.
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
It's late August. People get busy.
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
Sure to Convex, Walton, Ah Puch, and Zimmerman.
J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
Well since the EP has gotten a decent amount of upvotes, I guess I'll do a writeup now.
- The Harbinger Experiment: Zimmerman, the creator of the titular experiment, is an amoral and ruthless scientist obsessed with the supernatural. Zimmerman constructs a facility in which he tries to summon demonic entities into our world via magic and have them possess three hosts, people who he chose due to being expendable outcasts no one would miss, leading to the hosts' bodies contorting and twisted into horrid forms and shapes. Callously brushing aside the death of one of the hosts, Zimmerman sends his security team into one of the entity's rooms, leading to several of them being injured and one dying. Through his heinous methods of obtaining results regardless of the consequences and refusing to let anyone leave the facility, Zimmerman indirectly lets loose the entities on the facility, killing several scientists and sercurity alike, as well as traumatizing the narrator for life.
Edited by UltimateDemonBeast65 on Aug 24th 2019 at 1:37:34 AM
to Barry, Robert, Ah Puch and Zimmerman
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'll toss in a yes for Zimmerman.
EDIT: Also, Newton, we still got around 25-30 candidates or so this week.
EDIT 2: Also, here, I think, is everything pending minus Scraggle's and Ravok's:
- Night Trap, by Cullen Bunn et al.: Trapper (Clown-Face)
- Barry Convex (Crow)
- Captain Robert E. Walton (DDD)
- Hotline Miami (Elfen)
- Smite (Elfen)
- Veran (Fried)
- The Lost Empire (1984): Lee Chuck (Jackie)
- Blood Mage, by Edmund Hughes: Emanuel Jacques (Miraculous)
- The Fade, by Demitria Lunetta (Miraculous)
Edited by ACW on Aug 23rd 2019 at 12:54:14 PM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
How long D&D CM page will be reformatting?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
That's up to Lighty and Lore.
That's not a high priority for me, just warning.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Honestly, I'm thinking of just cutting that page, and if someone wants to make it a priority, they can re-create the Sandbox. As of now it's just sitting there.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Also, I read Steel Ball Run to finish my Jojo reads (Part 8 is still unfinished I think, so I can save it for later) and to get a last analysis to Funny Valentine.
My verdict is...99% monster, with his genuine admiration for his father being his only genuine redeeming quality. We can spent hours talking about his patriotism/ nationalism and if it's redeeming or not (It's genuine? And if genuine, what's the difference between it and just being insane?), but as long Funny Valentine loves his father...then I have to say No.
But seriously, how the heck he got such a Draco in Leather Pants? He's so damn openly sadistic and is completely apathetic at the suffering he causes, never showing any feeling of "I feel bad but this is the way" and rather being "Yaaay, I'm closer to my goal, who cares for anyone else".
Watch me destroying my country