Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the new Complete Monster (CM) cleanup thread! This thread is where we clean up or cut already-existing entries.
If you're looking to add new entries, please see the approval thread.
IMPORTANT: Before you begin any discussions on this thread, please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List. Here, you'll find explanations of the criteria for the trope as well as our rules/procedures for approving and cutting candidates.
What goes through this thread?
- Cut requests. If you believe a CM has been approved and they do not count, this thread is where you propose their removal. To know how to go about this, please see the FAQ folder on the Administrivia page, where the process is explained in detail.
- If we ever need to consider cutting multiple examples without individually reviewing them (e.g. if we discover widespread plagiarism with a particular troper's CMs), the initial discussion will be on this thread and we'll then escalate to the mod team (as described here) to get a formal consensus if we decide to recommend a mass cut.
- If an entry was put on the wrong subpage/YMMV page, you may propose where they should be moved to.
- Full rewrites of existing entries, including expansions, trims, and ground-up rewrites. If your rewrite is approved by the thread, feel free to add it to the drafts page so that other users can check grammar and the like before it is included with the rest of the weekly swaps.
- If an entry on a work's YMMV page doesn't match the entry on the media subpage, you can bring it here to discuss which entry works better.
What does not go through this thread?
- New candidate proposals - as stated before, those are done on this thread.
- Unapproved wicks - if a Troper encounters either of these kinds of wicks, they can be cut with no approval.
- Any CM link on a non-YMMV page - as a YMMV trope, it should not be linked on those pages regardless of any cleanup effort. The only exception is if the wick is being used within the definition of another trope.
- If an CM link on a YMMV page refers to an unapproved character. If it refers to an approved character on any such page, the wick can stay. On the other hand, if the unapproved character being linked to sounds like they might have promise (and you don't feel like checking it out for yourself), feel free to mention it on the approval thread - someone may already know why they don't count, or it could invite a brand new discussion!
- Proposals for images, quotes, and videos of already-approved CMs - quotes and images are proposed on the approval thread, while videos can be uploaded normally as they are screened for approval by the moderation.
- Crosswicking examples to YMMV pages - if an example has already been approved and added to the main page, you do not require any special permission to add the example to a work's YMMV page (assuming the work has a page already). If a YMMV page doesn't exist yet, then you can make it yourself, but either way, feel free to just add the example without asking.
- Small changes to existing entries - these can simply be done on a Troper's own prerogative with no approval.
- Spelling and grammar fixes.
- Pothole changes.
- Minor rewordings.
- Spoiler tags.
While these changes do not require any kind of approval, it is requested that should you make any of these changes, you do one of the following:
- Make the same changes on the relevant Sandbox page, then add the Sandbox to the list at the bottom of the drafts page. This will add the Sandbox to the weekly swaps and ensure that the edits end up on the relevant locked page. If the Sandbox is already listed, then once you make the edits, your job is already done!
- If you don't know how the Sandboxes work or simply don't have the time to find it, then you can simply post on the thread about the changes you made. Someone else can then make the edit on the relevant Sandbox and add it to the weekly swaps.
- Alternatively, you can simply request that the change be made directly to the locked page on the Locked Pages thread. Members of this thread keep track of that one, so we will ensure that the changes are made in the Sandbox so that it doesn't get deleted during the next swap.
Again, these changes don't require any approval, but we prefer to keep the entries on the YMMV pages and the locked pages the same in order to avoid any miscommunication or errors between entries, so if you do make the change, we would greatly appreciate it if you could ensure the change is made on the locked page as well.
As a final note, we do not care what other sites have to say regarding whether or not a character counts. We have our own criteria and they have theirs for their CM equivalents; while they are similar, they are not exactly the same and should not be treated as such. Another site removing a character from their equivalent should not be a reason why a cut is proposed here, and if this is the case, it will likely lead to mod intervention.
Other than this, once again, welcome to the cleanup thread, and we look forward to your contributions!
Edited by Mrph1 on Jan 14th 2024 at 11:30:03 AM
Lord of Space
Tiny addition to the Entity's entry from Mr. Hopp's Playhouse.
From:
- Mr. Hopp's Playhouse series: The Entity is the ultimate evil of the series. The former Guardian of Hope before being banished to the Underworld because of wrongdoings, the Entity stole the six medallions that kept balance between the realms and used them to create three loyal servants that'd help him in his harvest of souls—seemingly having a preference for the young. During one of his harvests, the Entity gave the Six to a young girl named Isabelle, leading to her death and transformation. Years later, the Entity tormented a pregnant woman named Faith in her dreams and became obsessed with the latter's daughter—Esther—due to the latter's pure soul, and attempted to have her join him by psychologically breaking her down, even going as far as literally dragging everyone else in Esther's orphanage off to Hell. After being apparently defeated for good, the Entity returns years later to torment an elderly Esther, and has her give one of his servants—Mr. Hopp—to her own granddaughter Ruby before trapping Esther's soul in the Underworld. After Mr. Hopp fails to kill Ruby, the Entity has Ruby taken into the Underworld, where he attempts to have both her and Esther killed by his servants, and later manipulates Ruby into turning against her grandmother, only to attack the poor girl when she betrays him in the third game's Golden Ending.
To:
- Mr. Hopp's Playhouse series: The Entity is the ultimate evil of the series. The former Guardian of Hope before being banished to the Underworld because of wrongdoings and corruption, the Entity stole the six medallions that kept balance between the realms and used them to create three loyal servants that'd help him in his harvest of souls—seemingly having a preference for the young. During one of his harvests, the Entity gave the Six to a young girl named Isabelle, leading to her death and transformation. Years later, the Entity tormented a pregnant woman named Faith in her dreams and became obsessed with the latter's daughter—Esther—due to the latter's pure soul, and attempted to have her join him by psychologically breaking her down, even going as far as literally dragging everyone else in Esther's orphanage off to Hell. After being apparently defeated for good, the Entity returns years later to torment an elderly Esther, and has her give one of his servants—Mr. Hopp—to her own granddaughter Ruby before trapping Esther's soul in the Underworld. After Mr. Hopp fails to kill Ruby, the Entity has Ruby taken into the Underworld, where he attempts to have both her and Esther killed by his servants, and later manipulates Ruby into turning against her grandmother, only to attack the poor girl when she betrays him in the third game's Golden Ending.
So, I have a cut to propose, upon revisiting the games now...
From the Suikoden series, Luca Blight I think has to go from CM. Now, he is the most horrific villain in the entire series and the cruelest figure who intends on pure omnicide of the world, slaughters children to start a war and sadistically butchers civilians...
BUT, as detailed in the manga and Suikogaiden, his issues do stem from the brutal rape of his mother which he was forced to watch as a child. While he expresses it in the worst, most unhealthy, wrathful terms possible, there's one quiet scene where he drops his ravening monstrosity as his father dies at his hand and mentions Luca's mother Sarah. Luca icily tells him (who fled the scene and left Luca and his mother behind) to never speak her name, in a moment of quiet solemnity that is a contrast to any other scene where he's a cackling sadist. It's also strongly implied as much as he loathes his sister Jilia, he can't bring himself to kill her based on her resemblance to Sarah.
It's only a few scant moments for an otherwise pure evil character, but it's still there. Luca at point of dying gleefully declares himself the face of true evil who desires destruction for its own sake, but the one time his mother is mentioned, he acts different from usual.
Edited by Lightysnake on May 1st 2023 at 8:45:04 AM
Ok, Jesus. That is way too much right there especially the rape on his mother. Cut Suikoden
Edited by Echidna on May 1st 2023 at 11:49:20 AM
Ate those canon or a separate continuity though? If canon then sadly slash him
REALITY IS AN ILLUSION, THE UNIVERSE IS A HOLOGRAM, BUY GOLD BYEEEE! | She/Her
Not the Eye
Cut Luca
Cut Blight.
They're all canon. Suikogaiden is a set of visual novels that interact in and out of the main series. There are only implications of Luca's mom in the main game, but those implications are fleshed out heavily in those materials.
Cut Luca (Even Bad Men Love Their Mamas has struck again)
Edited by G-Editor on May 1st 2023 at 5:56:06 PM
Then yeah, cut Luca "the true face of evil" Blight
REALITY IS AN ILLUSION, THE UNIVERSE IS A HOLOGRAM, BUY GOLD BYEEEE! | She/Her
Bye
Cut Luca
It's a true shame we lose such a great quote; "It took hundreds to kill me, but I killed thousands! Look at me, I am sublime! I am the face of true evil!"
Lord of Space
What about the rewrite I proposed?
The Draftsman of Doom
Cut Blight.
I'll wait for the original effortposter to weigh in on the rewrite, if applicable.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
I didn't realize.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 1st 2023 at 4:34:30 AM
Feels good, don't it?
Lord of Space
But I am the original effortposter.
Cut Luca.
A nice swimmer
Okay, so checking YMMV.Xenoblade Chronicles 3 and the candidates all seem cool, but Y i have a bit of a problem. Probably nothing too important but his character page says this:
- Graceful Loser: Takes both of his defeats to Ouroboros in stride, and unlike X and Z, he's the only one of the original Moebius to Face Death with Dignity.
- Visionary Villain: Relative to the other Moebius, Y is one of the few who expresses any serious concern over Aionios' gradual decay and the decay of his fellow Moebius into mindless hedonism, with some dialogue indicating his experiments are with the intent of making it so that Aionios can continue indefinitely by removing memories and emotions from soldiers to make them fight easier.
For the former it's weird, cause from what i've seen, i think he has two death quotes. First one is this one:
and the second one:
I am not truly sure, you can be the judge regarding that in this video:
For the latter, i'm guessing it's true, though the ground is also shaky in that one. What are your thoughts?
Due to unfortunate events, i will continue to exist until further notice.
RIP Toriyama
Cut Luca, shame to see him go!
Y is fine IMO, he's a Mad Scientist who speaks in broad "visionary" terms but shows himself regularly to be an egotistical psychopath. Him taking his death relatively well is just a further example of his scientific curiosity on display for me.
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If it's all canon, cut Luca.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lord of Space
Anyway, may I post my rewrite in the drafts?
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Cut Luca. Keep Y.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Sure, but what exactly changed?
The Draftsman of Doom
Nox: Just for posterity, what exactly was changed? Can you highlight it?
![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 1st 2023 at 4:35:35 AM
Feels good, don't it?
Lord of Space
I added "and corruption" in the part where it said "wrongdoings".
For the current page quote of RWBY Fan Works, you could also just cut it down since the entire quote isn't necessary. Just as an example, I tried it.