Too Bleak, Stopped Caring

Nobody is forcing you to use DIAA in those cases. If a better trope fits, use it instead. I'm getting sick of reminding people that you should use the most applicable trope for an example, not every trope that could vaguely be interpreted to fit if the Moon is in the right quarter and you ignore half the context.

Seriously, people. Beelzebub didn't give us brains so we could let them dribble on the floor.

Edited by Fighteer on Sep 19th 2020 at 9:01:09 AM

From YMMV.Fosters Home For Imaginary Friends:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: A big reason why so many of the later episodes are less well-remembered and liked is because they relied a lot more on idiot plots and Kafka Comedy, the latter of which does not go well with such a lighthearted fantasy premise. This is the main reason that "Everyone Knows It's Bendy" is so despised: The Bad Guy Wins and Bloo gets in even more trouble trying to catch him in the act.

Yet another comedy gag show. Not sure if any other trope would fit, but I think it's safe to say it's not DIAA.

I agree.

Yeah, totes agree. I think that's just the intended reaction to a Downer Ending.

I think Eight Deadly Words requires a citation if it's not In-Universe.

From YMMV.Batman Returns:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: It's one of the strangest and most depressing Batman films. While this is a big part of the appeal to some fans, for others it makes it difficult to enjoy. There's also the fact that for all its bleakness it is also rather campy in some aspects (especially the more fantastical elements related to Penguin's plan), which some argue leads to the film's tone feeling muddled.

Batman is unambiguously a hero in the film, so again, it fails the "both sides are equally bad" criteria.

...How is that movie even remotely depressing?

IMO, the tonal dissonance the entry talks about is actually very real, and I honestly consider it a worse Batman movie than Batman and Robin - which is quite consistent in how it leans into camp - for that reason. But that's... not exactly what I'd call depressing.

Cut that nonsense.

Edited by nrjxll on Sep 20th 2020 at 8:58:13 AM

Thoughts on this example from YMMV.Pirates Of The Caribbean At Worlds End?

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: A variant sets in due to the overdose of Gambit Pileup and Chronic Backstabbing Disorder. Will, Elizabeth, Jack, Barbossa, Cutler Beckett, Davy Jones, Norrington, Sao Feng, and Tia Dalma/Calypso all have their own agendas, most of which change at least once over the course of the film and result in more Enemy Mine situations than you can shake a stick at. Some viewers had no choice but to resign from the story entirely.

That "some viewers" thing is a red flag. Also, it's misuse of the trope. Yes, everyone betrays everyone else, but those films are escapist fantasy. Completely ineligible for DIAA.

Here's the example from the main series YMMV page for context:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy:
  • As the sequels kept going and the Cerebus Syndrome kicked in, many fans and critics noted how the protagonists started to do more morally-gray things and enter Chronic Backstabbing Disorder mode. Viewers started to care less about the characters and feel like everyone in the cast became an Anti-Hero with their own agenda. By the fourth movie, most of the likeable secondary characters were either dead (Norrington, Weatherby Swann, Groves, Gillette, possibly Cotton, Pintel, Raggeti and the rest of the Black Pearl's crew), had to stay in an unfavorable situation ( Will, Elizabeth, Jack, and Angelica), or disappeared in a way that brings about Fridge Horror ( Anamaria, Philip, and Syrena). Many former fans don't want to keep watching since every sequel makes the characters more miserable.
  • The fifth movie tries to avoid this reaction by introducing some happier moments, like Jack Sparrow finally getting the Black Pearl; ending the curse of the Dutchman so Will and Elizabeth are together again; bringing back Marty, Murtogg, and Mullroy which means some of the Black Pearl's original crew was still alive; and having Henry and Carina working together instead by their own agendas. Unfortunately, this movie also shows Jack Sparrow at his most unlikeable to many fans— blaming his crew for his failures, demanding tribute or payment for being rescued, and not caring about his old friends even when he has no conflicting agenda against them.

Edit: Went ahead and removed it.

Edited by costanton11 on Sep 26th 2020 at 12:46:40 PM

Sorry for the double post, but found another example from The Breakfast Club:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: The Breakfast Club is to Sixteen Candles what Neon Genesis Evangelion is to The Simpsons. A common complaint some viewers have about the film is that, in spite of its moments of levity, the film is too bleak and cynical to get emotionally invested in. In addition, there are virtually zero characters that aren't damaged or have some sort of agenda, and a popular interpretation of the ending is that the kids didn't really learn anything, and will most likely become just as bad as their parents, if not worse.

From what I recall, the film ended on a somewhat optimistic note.

Fuck that noise. That's a trash entry. Delete it.

How are The Simpsons and Evangelion in any way related? The Breakfast Club and Sixteen Candles are at least both teen movies from the 80s made by some of the same people, but I have no idea why that example is comparing a mecha anime to an animated sitcom.

Edited by Serac on Sep 26th 2020 at 1:24:42 PM

Taken care of.

From YMMV.The Amazing World Of Gumball:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: This is one of the reasons why the show's second season was rather divisive, as the Wattersons were gradually flanderized into such petty, ungrateful, selfish jerks that there's no one really to root for, and as a result, the series' attempt to be heartwarming comes off feeling forced and unearned. For example, in "The Hero", Gumball and Darwin laugh about how much of a loser their father is with their classmates, which Richard overhears and is wounded by. Instead of explaining how their insensitivity has hurt Richard, Nicole and Anais rage at the boys and decide to refuse them food, starving them into changing their mind for over a week. Darwin realizes the error of his ways, while Gumball doubles down on how pathetic he thinks Richard is — verbally tearing into the man with surprising cruelty during the climax, while Richard is in the middle of trying to save his life. It's not an unpopular opinion that the inevitable reconciliation between father and son that happened a minute later felt very unearned and very rushed.

Another comedy gag show, another easy cut.

Edited by costanton11 on Sep 26th 2020 at 2:31:59 PM

It's also clearly an excuse to complain about a specific episode, which is another form of misuse.

From YMMV.My Gym Partners A Monkey

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: Some viewers feel that the only problem with the show is that it's a little hard to watch Adam constantly lose (even when he wins, life goes back to being crap for him) and be maltreated by his "best friend", Jake in almost every episode.

Yet another comedy gag show.

That one is pretty much identical to the one that got cut from the trope's Western Animation subpage.

I feel Eight Deadly Words is the closest thing we have for all those comedic works that are too mean-spirited to be enjoyable, but is that correct? I also don't know if the citation rule applies only for the page or for all pages like with Unfortunate Implications.

In fact, I kind of want to sort out the differences between DIAA and Angst Aversion, since I've seen people just move removed DIAA entries to that trope as well. Best I can figure, these are the differences between the tropes:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: The audience becomes apathetic to the central conflict of a work because either the situation is presented as hopeless or both sides are portrayed as terrible.
• Angst Aversion: Audiences begin to avoid a work because it has gained a reputation for being dark or depressing.
• Eight Deadly Words: The characters are either all unlikable or not interesting enough to engage with the audience, so they become apathetic to the outcome of the story.

I see a lot of overlap, but I think this is my best approximation between the three tropes. I feel a clear divide between these items will help us a lot down the road. If I misinterpreted any of them, feel free to let me know.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Sep 26th 2020 at 1:06:04 PM

Removed the My Gym Partner's a Monkey example.

Here's one from YMMV.Star Trek Deep Space Nine:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: The Dominion War arc can induce this reaction as it becomes obvious just how outmatched the Federation and its allies are by the evils that assault them. The arc is essentially a long chain of really bad things happening that directly result in even worse things happening. Things always get worse. In the end, though, the tide suddenly turns in the Federation's favor and the Dominion is defeated. As a general note, newcomers can have a hard time having any fun watching a series that's full of characters that do horrible and horrifying things on both sides. Captain Sisko, for example, starts off witnessing the death of his wife at the hands of the Borg, and by the time the Dominion War breaks out he feels justified in committing torture, kidnapping, and (being an accessory to) murder. And he's one of the nicer characters. Of all the main and recurring characters, the only ones who never do anything particularly morally questionable are Ezri Dax, Jake Sisko (outside of a few early episodes, and even then only due to Nog's influence) and Leeta.

The example itself admits that the heroes win in the end.

YMMV.The Cat In The Hat

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: As stated under Designated Hero and Unintentionally Unsympathetic, absolutely none of the three main characters hold much of any likability, leading to this happening in full force.

ZCE much?

Severe misuse.

Thoughts on the DS9 example?

Edited by costanton11 on Sep 28th 2020 at 10:57:23 AM

Winning in the end shouldn't count against DIAA as it is not an ending trope, it's about being so dark one stops caring about the series such they don't care how it ends. DIAA has to set in before the ending and should mean they're too burned out to care if the ending was worth it or not. That's my impression at least.

If so, I think individual films should be expert as too short for apathy to set in (it would mean audiences walk out of the film for anything else because they don't care enough to see it through, the only walking out examples I know of are disgust as opposed to apathy).

Again, why not have DIAA require evidence audiences lost interest like we do Audience-Alienating Premise?

DS9 absolutely does not count. There are elements of the Trek fandom who object to it throwing out/deconstructing some of the more utopian aspects of the setting, but overall it was and remains very popular. For a long time it and TNG tended to be automatically considered the "good" Trek spinoffs as contrasted to the more poorly-received Voyager and Enterprise.

Edited by nrjxll on Sep 29th 2020 at 4:51:05 AM