Prematurely launched pages and pages that weren't fully fleshed out at the point of launching, are a big problem. Since these usually share several problems at once, this thread is aimed at re-running them through the TLP for fixing - the usual fix - or cutting them if they are too bad.
Problems this thread deals with include bad names, not enough/bad examples, unclear description, etc.
For the interested, here's a list of recently created pages
. Launches
Note: Please do not request a mod to unlaunch drafts that don't have any issues besides lacking a launch notice/24hr launch notice. While 24hr launch notices are mandatory, there are a few exceptions to the rule. If you see a draft's sponsor launch a TLP without an announcement, it's best to remind them of our TLP Guidelines first. If they continue to repeatedly launch drafts without a launch notice, you can report them on Ask The Tropers or the TLP Community Issues thread.
Edited by MacronNotes on Jun 24th 2023 at 12:24:55 PM
Blapper of Water
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Would having TLP-specific mods be helpful or practical?
As it happens to be, Informal Fallacies is a sockpuppet made to evade a TLP ban that was issued for junk drafts about colours and heroism. Bounced the sock, upped the ban on the prior handle, discarded their other TLPs and cut Gods Of Adulterers And Harlots.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Also asked for the discard button to be rendered visible immediately after a draft is posted in TLP.
Upon some thinking, I've also unlaunched Eye Scar and put a note in the TLP about not making tropes that are an appearance trait with no significance.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13544789560A75740100&page=190#4731 has not been processed yet, seems like.
I cut Diaper Shock. It was not worth keeping.note
- Misplaced Bubbles is old. Very, very old. That it has managed to get zero attention since 2011 says a lot. Nothing salvageable here, would cut it.
- Creator's Pest looks alright to me. A bit of monitoring and Wiki Magic should do the work for it.
- Film Of The Ride is definitely an adaptation thing. It might be a bit rare, but that's just its nature. I say keep it.
- Incident Of Way Back When is a Noodle Incident on a specific date. I don't think it's worth troping. Cut.
- Robots Are Just Better is a horrible name that should be punted off to oblivion. The description manages to be a confused mess when it's only a few lines long. Are they more intelligent? Faster? Stronger? Not swayed by emotions and desires? Why is there a Pot Hole to Gamebreaker? Is this a gameplay trope where mechanics give synthetics distinct advantages? This needs reworking if someone feels there is something to see in there.
- Mystical Item TM needs a better description and a not horrible name (if it's trying to be witty, there's better options). It can be smoothed out.
- Where They Were can be cut and if anyone wants to expand on the concept, go to YKTTW.
- Cast from Stamina is...Cast from Calories? Cast From HP? A Sub-Trope of it? I think we need to clarify the relationships between these concepts in a clear tree/diagram before we take any definitive action. I think that using actual, physical weight like the Naruto example or Shadow Hearts may be distinct, but it bears further looking into.
- Mystery Arc makes me weep. Cut it. If someone wants to make an actual something on the subject, The Hero's Journey is a good starting point to see how these pages should be built.
That's my opinion from a cursory glance.
edited 19th Feb '17 6:35:07 AM by lu127
"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer
Blapper of Water
I would like to point out that Everybody Loves Zeus was also sponsored by Informal Fallacies. I do think this one could be salvaged since we have other straight-inverse trope pairings (IIRC), but it might not be needed or necessary(?). What d'y'all think?
I still think Everybody Hates Ares is chairsy. Most Greeks didn't like Ares (Spartans did, and the Romans liked Mars, but I'd think of those as exceptions), and media portrayals of him as unlikeable is along the lines of Shown Their Work, I think. "People in general don't like the War God" doesn't seem like a trope to begin with, and I admit that I'm trying to interpret this in a charitable light since it's older.
Look at all that shiny stuff ain't they pretty
Pretty sure the policy mandates "launched by banned user = torch it and start over, no exceptions". But let's wait for a mod to confirm that.
There is no such policy. Practically speaking, it comes down to how bad the page(s) in question is/are and how much the sockpuppeteer pissed us off.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
K. So is this salvageable then?
Zzzzzzzzzz
Like Sept said, we don't have a set policy, but the page would need to be not only perfectly or almost-perfectly made, but a fairly major trope that we really didn't have to survive.
World's Toughest Milkman
Ok...taking a deep breath....
- Bust Chart: Like Larkmarn, I'm dubious but neutral.
- Creator's Pest: Not terrible. Given that it's trivia, I'm pretty neutral.
- Gentle Touch vs. Firm Hand: doesn't seem terrible (although I agree with the suggestion to trim and improve the description). Neutral.
- Most Definitely Not Accompanying Us: I'm ok with this one.
- Film Of The Ride: A symptom of Missing Supertrope Syndrome, I think, but not beyond the pale. Neutral.
These should go:
- Act Of True Love Stalemate: redundant/overly specific and unnecessary. cut
- Cast from Stamina: seems like a dup to me; cut
- Cast from Calories: getting downright silly. cut
- Casual Sports Jersey: Not A Trope. cut
- Death Rides A Skateboard: the same but more specific. cut
- Deus Ex Savant: snowclone and badly thought out. cut
- Incident Of Way Back When: indistinguishable from noodle incident. cut
- Magical Guide: redundant and badly thought out. cut
- The Princess And The Pirate: redundant, overly specific. cut
- Robots Are Just Better: too broad, too vague, not a trope. cut
These need work:
- Literal Self Made Man: I thought we already decided this should be sent back. There's a possible trope there, but it needs work. Send it back
- Actually Real Magic: misleading name is the main problem; Send it back.
- Misplaced Bubbles: I'm not sure. There might be a trope here. But it's clearly a premature launch in any case. Send it back.
- Mystical Item TM: Horrible name. Might be workable concept. Send it back.
- Poverty Porn: A bit torn on this, but I think it needs more work at the least. And probably a new name. Send it back.
Other:
- Mystery Arc: Good god, where did all those inbounds come from? Oh, wait, this is ancient. And horribly pathetic. Send it to repair shop.
- Where They Were: an older trope really doesn't belong on this thread. Send it to repair shop. Definitely not thriving.
edited 19th Feb '17 1:14:05 PM by Xtifr
Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.
How sweet it is
I randomly found VideoGame.Wild Metal Country. It's got a ton of issues, including ZCEs, anemic description, and no wicks of any sort—not even an index. Is it salvageable in any way?
she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
This editor created a whole lot of sub-pages for games with just the number 1 on them - it might need a cleanup
Might?
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Zzzzzzzzzz
Shall I nuke those pages, Sept?
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
May as well.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Zzzzzzzzzz
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
I've ben trying to take a more proactive approach to preventing the launch of blatant duplicates, lightning the workload on this thread, but I've hit a few snags, Mainly troopers who refuse to acknowledge when We Already Have This One, and don't see what's wrong with tropes being The Same But More Specific. Would anyone here care to help smooth the discarding process?
Ye who would Tope Meaninglessness. Ye who ignore All We Have. I say to you You Shall Not Pass!!
Zzzzzzzzzz
You'd be much more effective if you'd post something more than a simple statement that "this is a duplicate" or "this is Chairs." Give your reasons, rather than expecting that your bare declaration is all that should be necessary.
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
The Lightfooted got launched. 6 hats... and 4 bombs, so really it got launched with 2 hats.
It's... definitely problematic. The description and examples are just a bit unclear, but it seems to boil down to a character who is "the agile one" in a group (if we don't have that, how did we miss it?)... except for the ones that are more about a character's poise than their agility (the context for one example is entirely about the character always collected and curtsies before a fight). Or other examples that are more about being a quiet walker, or someone who is literally lighter than others.
Basically, it needs to figure out exactly what it is, and the name doesn't really help that.
Seems a clear cut and send back.
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Most of the bombs on that one had no reason given for them. It reached a point where it was nearly discarded for no reason. Nobody who participated in the discussion thought it was a duplicate, and my search did not uncover any tropes that fulfilled it's role. I see no problem with it as is.
edited 24th Feb '17 12:53:33 PM by sailing101
Ye who would Tope Meaninglessness. Ye who ignore All We Have. I say to you You Shall Not Pass!!
Did you read my post? My issue wasn't that it was a duplicate, I said it was unclear and the examples are poor.
I would happily throw a bomb on a draft that poor. Remember, a bomb doesn't mean "this should be discarded" a bomb (counter intuitively) just means "this is not ready for launch."
I agree, people throwing bombs in should ideally chime in why, but part of the problem is that it's so ridiculously easy to launch a trope in TLP that the idea that "oh, they didn't say why, therefore we may as well disregard the bombs altogether" is very dangerous. Putting another roadblock to bombing is the opposite of what we need.
edited 24th Feb '17 1:40:21 PM by Larkmarn
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Trivia.Underside Ride seems to be misplaced, badly formatted and uses This Troper
Just cutlist it.
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Zzzzzzzzzz
OK, this is a meta post.
This is the group of people who have the most hands-on experience with what makes a good YKTTW and what makes a bad one. So:
What suggestions do you have for TLP to make making good ones and stopping bad ones from launching easier?
I'm looking for concrete suggestions that I can pass on to the admins.
So far I know that 1) Bring back the tags, and 2) "do something to require that adding a bomb needs a reason" have come up before.
Give me input, so that I have something concrete to take to TPTB. I'm thinking that if y'all post suggestions here and then we run a crowner for "acceptable or not", I'll have a relatively solid position to start from.
Personally, I'm inclined to wish for some sort of a counter, so that it can't be launched if Bombs outnumber Hats, no matter how many hats it has.
edited 24th Feb '17 2:42:56 PM by Madrugada
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
I honestly feel like the whole TLP system needs some kind of major overhaul to prevent people from launching proposals that have been heavily questioned just because they've managed to get the right number of hats. That's not logical.