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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
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therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#234579: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:35:13 AM

[tup] Dracula numero dos

Yeah Sang was a mistake on my part as well. Let's just move on from it and agree the Headmaster keeps.

So let’s get this show fucking started.

Happy Halloween, and an RIP for Sean Connery.

What Is the Work?

Onechanbara Origins is a 2020 remake of the first two Chanbara games made for the franchise’s 15th anniversary. This is actually a good thing, since the first two games never made it outside of Japan and Europe, and information about them is incredibly scarce (though both English versions can be found on YouTube if you search hard enough). It’s even still published by D3, who are still around after all these decades (though granted, when your games cost about $5 to make…).

Taking parts from both games and cramming them together into one digestible product, the plot follows zombie hunter Aya, whose mother Tsubaki has been killed, her father Oboro has disappeared, and her sister Saki doesn’t like her anymore. But a new threat emerges from an organization called… The Organization (or Uroboros; the game at first says it’s the latter, but then it switches to the former, maybe it’s a subdivision of the Organization), who unleashes a swarm of zombies.

With the help of her newfound friend Lei (pronounced Ray, and is essentially a replacement for the character of Reiko from the original games), Aya must take down the zombies, the Organization, and her own sister Saki to save Japan from doom.

Who Is She?

Eva is the source of the zombies, the leader of the Organization, and the one behind the family’s dysfunction.

What has she done?

The one behind Tsubaki’s murder in order to take the Baneful Blood from within her, Oboro sets out to kill Eva, leaving his daughters behind. Eva takes the opportunity to caress Saki into joining her, manipulating her into believing that Aya and Oboro never loved her, and that she can bring Tsubaki back from the dead. Ultimately, Eva wants to use the Baneful Blood to make herself powerful. Eva also has expendable clones made to serve as her regular army, one of whom being Lei, who was sent to personally bond with Aya and Saki in order to kill them. But when she starts to slack off, Eva sends the clones to kill her.

But it’s not enough to send out clones to do her bidding. No, Eva also has zombies created in an attempt to kill our heroines. Eva sends out the zombies to wipe out a hospital, and later on an entire city, while also having experiments performed on them to make them stronger.

Defeating Oboro in a fight, Eva sends him to kill Aya and Saki, sadistically taunting them about how he was a weakling who lost. During her own fight with Aya and Saki, Eva promises the two that she’ll eat their hearts, and takes some Baneful Blood of her own to become ultra-powerful. But after she’s defeated, Lei shows up out of nowhere, tears her heart out, and shoots her out of the arena.

Redeeming Qualities?

Zero. Eva is a sadist who only cares about power, and is willing to destroy an entire family plus who knows how many other people for it.

Heinousness?

Since this is a remake and thus its own thing, Eva handily passes the standard. Lei is a massive jerk who wants to become the true Origin™ of the Baneful Blood zombies, but it’s mainly because she’s a wreck whose mind was broken from all the cloning.

Conclusion

I think she’s a keep.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Oct 31st 2020 at 11:35:41 AM

"No running in the halls!"
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#234580: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:36:01 AM

[tup]Eva

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#234581: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:39:14 AM

[tup] Eva.

So the first 2 games are on the PS 2...but No Export for You. This game is in the US...but not on the PS 2. Fuckers.

EDIT: Whoa, cool, it's on Steam.

Edited by ACW on Oct 31st 2020 at 2:42:34 PM

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Bullman "The Juice is Loose." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#234585: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:45:00 AM

Yea to Eva....and alright, my next Dracula!

What's the work?

Remember I said we had some odd translations? Here's the oddest.

Powers of Darkness, or in Icelandic, Makt Myrkranna was a 'translation' of Dracula serialized in Reykjavik newspaper Fjallkonan...it's a little unclear who rewrote Bram's novel, quoting Wikipedia:

The first book edition was in 1901, mentioning "Valdimar Ásmundsson as "translator" for the first time. The book was published by Nokkrir Prentarar, which simply means "various printers" in Icelandic. Nokkrir Prentarar published only one other book, and it is unclear who the actual publishers were; possibly, Ásmundsson himself participated in the enterprise"

Let's talk...Dracula

who is he?

Dracula, but not as we know him in the books. Here, Dracula is a lusty monster out to dominate the entire world, with lots of dark eroticism, Jonathan Harker being kind of a horndog who comments upon a lot of bosoms and rushes into the darks of Dracula's brides. Dracula here? Not only kills babies, he runs a Satanic cult.

Yes, that's right. Dracula is the devil's emissary here. Running a mass cult for power, Harker sees the Count presiding over the human sacrifice of his victims, killing several maidens in a virgin sacrifice and drenching himself in their blood. Now, in this version, Mina and team arrive in Transylvania to see what's going on...and the body count is higher in this one. Dracula kills a ton more people, and has a bigger Social Darwinist philosophy. Dracula intends to throw Harker to the 'Countess' here.

So, yeah, things proceed as we basically know: Dracula kills people, sacrifices people, but here, he intends to overthrow the worlds' government into a social darwinist hellhole and continue human sacrifice across the world, as the reigning emissary of the devil. Thankfully defeated, the heroes/Harker, etc. put him down and destroy the wicked count.

Any mitigating Qualities?

Nah, not really. It's Dracula but it's the worst of the major novel ones. Dracula is pure evil, lusty, rapacious and in the Icelandic one...with mass human sacriice, attempted mass murder and world domination? Yeah, we're good here. I know this one's shorter, but I'm gonna take a break to let anyone else catch up with my final Dracula later.

Conclusion?

Another easy keeper, and thanks for bearing with me, guys!

Edited by Lightysnake on Oct 31st 2020 at 11:45:19 AM

Bullman "The Juice is Loose." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#234588: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:46:52 AM

[tup]Dracula

Didn't bram stoker himself help with writing this translation from what I've heard ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#234589: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:48:16 AM

[tup] to the Demon, Turkish Dracula, Eva, and Icelandic Dracula.

Abstain on the Headmaster.

[tdown] to Sang.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#234590: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:48:22 AM

Yeah, Stoker did give a foreward to one, IIRC, and may indicate he could've helped with that one.

OH, Bram, you poor, sexually frustrated bastard.

therealjackieboy Ultimate Moral Compass from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Ultimate Moral Compass
#234591: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:48:49 AM

[tup] Dracula numero tres. Did not expect Satanic Dracula and his erotica of darkness™ to make an appearance here, but there you go.

"No running in the halls!"
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#234593: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:55:09 AM

[tup] to the unnamed demon, Vlad the Impaler/Dracula, Eva, and Makt Myrkranna's Dracula. A weaker [tup] to Chris too.

Abstain on Sang and the Headmaster, barring more details to see if there are redeeming factors to either of them.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#234594: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:57:33 AM

[tup] Dracula. Again.

Also I finished reading one of two Halloween transcripts, and to be honest ? Michael leaves much to be desired here; sure he's killing people as usual, but he doesn't really do much of anything new or spectacular aside from setting a house to explode with himself inside on the off chance it could take out his target. I just feel it doesn't have much going for it.

Edited by Beast on Oct 31st 2020 at 11:59:24 AM

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ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#234596: Oct 31st 2020 at 11:59:18 AM

I'll hold off on expanding the Jinmen EP until tomorrow.

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MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#234597: Oct 31st 2020 at 12:05:09 PM

[tup] Eva and other Drac.

So I refreshed my memory. Just to have it here, and to lay out all information, here is my re-EP:

What's the work?

Seven Mysteries is a Vietnamese RPG Maker horror game with a remake- however, I will be focusing on the original game. It stars Tuan, a boy in a Vietnamese school, as he hears from a girl called My of mysterious illusions/incidents in the school. It is a mystery-type game with a central mystery to solve, with several viewpoint characters and reveals. The first three chapters feature three characters- Sang, My, and Lio- all experiencing the illusions said to center from a curse, while the rest of the game has Tuan investigate directly. Said illusions are caused by Thuy, the local onryo, who was said to be responsible for seven murders in life. However, she actually isn't our candidate. The real mastermind?

Who is the Headmaster? What does he do?

The Headmaster is, well, the headmaster of the school. So a bit of background. Turns out Sang, the boy who was the protagonist of Chapter 1, had killed a girl named Thuy, telling Linh she was the culprit of the mysterious seven murders beforehand. It is suggested he framed her. The ghost of Thuy, enraged, haunts students with illusions, and so students become terrified and wanted to transfer out. But the Headmaster doesn't want to lose his job by having to shut down the school- so, having caught Sang and Linh in the act of killing Thuy, he gathers evidence and decides to blackmail them into killing people for him instead. Anyone who gets too close to the truth of the curse or wants to transfer out, the Headmaster marks for death while Sang does the killing. In this way, the Headmaster keeps the school from shutting down by keeping the truth of the curse and deaths from reaching the outside world. They then dump the bodies inside a secret room behind a mirror- Tuan, in the last chapter, can see the pile of corpses they created. Linh, meanwhile, finds the whole thing distasteful and doesn't want to do it, but is forced by the Headmaster to aid in the killings.

Their fate is different depending on the ending. In Bad End 1, Tuan decides he has had enough and wants to transfer. He tells the Headmaster he would like to do so. Of course, the Headmaster leaves him there and presumably orders Sang to kill him, which he does. In Bad End 2, Sang pretends he has a way to lift the curse to lure Tuan to the room only to push him inside. In Bad End 3, which continues onward, Sang eventually returns to the room and kills Tuan. The Stinger shows several new students entering the school and being welcomed by the Headmaster, with the heavy indication that he and Sang (who is also there) will be killing them soon enough. In the True End, Tuan fights back and seemingly kills Sang, only for the Headmaster to frame him for the murders and have him Wrongfully Committed to an asylum.

But there is a happy ending. In said Happy End, Tuan uses a pen and stabs Sang after fighting him off. Although he still succumbs to Thuy's curse, he leaves enough evidence for the police to arrest the Headmaster and shut his school down. Linh gets away, but then again he was never really anything more than an unwilling accomplice.

Heinousness?

Big Bad, sets it. The Headmaster may not directly kill anyone himself, but he is the one ordering Sang around and marking people for death, at least after the first seven murders, and since Sang's body count is in the double digits, this means that the Headmaster is responsible for at least ten murders. Plus, he blackmails Linh into being his unwilling accomplice and, in the True End, personally has Tuan framed for the murders and carted off to an asylum. And in Bad End 1, he is plotting to have several more students killed, with the indication that, without Tuan getting in the way, he will be continuing for quite a while. Thuy, meanhwile, assaults students with horrific illusions... but never kills anyone, always leaving them alive.

Mitigating Qualities?

Unlike Sang, nothing. He orders the killing of his own students just to keep his job and reputation, and his kindness is skin deep. He acts nice to Tuan, telling him he understands that he is going through something and leaves the room to get his school report, being very understanding... just before ordering Sang to kill him. He tells Sang “good job” after the deed is done... because he is pleased that Sang is being so obedient. Remember, he is actively blackmailing Sang- if Sang disobeys, the Headmaster can and will pin all the crimes on him and get away unscathed. He tells several students in Bad End 3 that he wishes them the best... but he clearly doesn’t care about his students, given how he is willing to have them murdered to keep the secrets of the school.

Verdict?

So this guy I am sure keeps. Just to be totally transparent, here is Manly Badass Hero’s Let's Play of it, in case you want to see for yourself.

Edited by MasterN on Oct 31st 2020 at 12:08:05 PM

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#234599: Oct 31st 2020 at 12:15:14 PM

I'll say sure, leaving aside my scepticism of parts of the case I think the principal pushes for enough further murders he's not out-heinoused even if he had nothing to do with the original murders, as he willingly pushes for them to be covered up and continued to save his reputation.


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