During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Nah, you're getting there, believe me. Rereading my message I think that I was rude, though, so I wanna say sorry.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
It's ok. Don't sweat it. And thanks.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 23rd 2019 at 10:41:56 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
@username: I made a similar joke with Amon from Starcraft and The Legend of Korra.
Edited by randomtroper89 on Jan 23rd 2019 at 9:51:22 AM
Don't worry, Bull. You're doing fine. It can take a bit. We all have stumblings.
CW is making a series of The Lost Boys. Who wants dibs ?
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Thanks. That means a lot.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 23rd 2019 at 11:07:17 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
The Draftsman of Doom
Switching to abstain on Gideon.
Rawr.
I called dibs on Meta Runner! I am super excited for it!
Also regarding Gideon. Unfortunatley gonna switch to abstain. Don't feel bad for realizing something's off with your candidate - happened to me once or twice - usually when I'm mid writing an EP.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Shoot, I was considering on calling dibs on that. Ah well, good luck! :)
Thanks! Glad to someone on this forum shared my excitement! 
Beast, wanna collab there?
And I'm very glad we have so many eager new guys! Don't worry, just keep at it. It can tke time to learn all the ropes.
Hoo boy. Being someone who absolutely fucking loves Scott Pilgrim, Gideon is hard. On the one hand, he does not explicitly sexually abuse any of the women and the heinous standard stuff is a bit of an issue. On the other hand, he is entirely willing to use Mind Rape on his foes, is a Hero Killer who's way past his MEH by the time the story starts, and is a misogynistic bastard who keeps women locked up in captivity. He does never try to Take Over the World, but his motives are pretty goddamn evil.
Also, it bears mention, when Scott delves into Ramona's mind, Gideon has her in a leash and a collar, the implications being very heavy. Whilst it's clearly metaphorical of his dominance of her and how abusive he is, the way he acts and thinks does have some more heavy implications of, if not outright sexual abuse, the feeling and intent of it. It's a bit of a trippy sequence, but it does change things for me. EDIT: And seeing as this wasn't mentioned very much in the original EP, Gideon in Ramona's mind is pictured in a very Bondage Is Bad manner, with rape implied but more-or-less not named so as to avoid completely wrecking the series tone. This is actually deciding for me. It'd be a no otherwise.
Also, Gideon's MO is rather unique for the series. I say abstain, leaning weakly yea to one of my favorite Hate Sink characters, GGG.
Speaking of double checking, Khashoggi from We Will Rock You may not have a place here. He's a remorseless, sadistic monster, and most of his humor comes from straight-manning the villains, but on the other hand, upon a reread of the script? Khash is damn funny at times, and has some legitimate jokes to him, even if most of them are So Unfunny, It's Funny. (Notably, his one-liner before he executes Brit is "It's time to hit you, baby, one more time.") Also, I was erroneous in stating that Khash murders the Bohemians. In tone and plot, he kills them, but it's actually slightly worse: He rips their souls out of their bodies, resulting in Death of Personality. In conclusion, I believe I was erroneous in stating he was entirely serious. I feel like a real dumbass now.
Edited by Riley1sCool on Jan 23rd 2019 at 8:39:57 AM
Saying nay to Zola and gonna have to switch for the same for Gideon. I think I downvoted Khash when he was first brought up and I’ll maintain that with Riley’s further comment.
@Lighty: Sure to the collab, I just gotta see when it premeires as my school year and TV acess pretty much reduces me to having to binge watch my shows after the seasons are over one my school year is done.
@Riley: If the tied turns back into Gideon's favour, I gotta say that's helluva saving throw right there.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
@Bullman Yeah, what Lighty said though. We all do have stumblings especially me.
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Yeah, in general, mistakes happen, don't worry about it too much.
Gentle Laborer
@Riley the only reason why i didn't mention the Bondage Is Bad was because that sequence was way too trippy for me. Still kinda important to understand his character tho.
Hm... you say he made his billions by using Mind Rape? And locked his girlfriends in their own heads for years? I'm gonna say that's bad enough. ![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
maintained.
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Khosh, though.
For me it was the new implication of him mind controlling the whole world... just about everything else to do with Gideon looks like it got fully hashed out back here.
Haven't read the graphic novels or seen the movie (more likely to see the movie first), but to Gideon.
Happy Birthday to my mom!
Gonna try to nail down five candidates by the end of next week.
In the meantime, I was discussing this with miraculous and a few others recently, so I’m gonna give the horse CPR one last time to see if I can get it to breathe and if I can’t, then I'm burying it: I found info pertaining to Speed 2 that may be crucial to Gieger's thoughts on passengers still being on the ship: Gieger at one point hears a couple of the passengers asking about why the evacuation stopped and might have seen the group of them too. He turns and walks in the other direction so as to not be seen. This tells me that he only let the evacuation happen as a courtesy and not as good will. He also mentions that he felt he should have been taken care of better than he was after receiving a fatal illness, but again, he’s gonna let innocents get killed just to get his revenge. The people evacuated are also invalidated by the oil tanker workers and the people in the port town being put in danger too. It's also shown that his program wasn't fully operational and the evacuation wasn't just a diversion to buy time, but it also cleared the halls so he could clear the vault. He threatens to throw Annie out of the plane BEFORE she pushes out his bag of jewels, but he still abuses her before and after, so nothing good there. I’m gonna change my vote back to a tentative . Here's the link to the EP for anyone who wants to change their vote: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=6vic3f9h1cy5qivsenw8llok&page=5678
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jan 24th 2019 at 12:46:23 PM
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
You left this message already in that post you made before with that note attached to it. Stop beating the damn horse already.
Edited by Tyk5919 on Jan 24th 2019 at 3:52:59 PM
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
@Tyk I added new info and slightly updated the EP too.
Hi, I want to propose that All For One from My Hero Academia be added as a Complete Monster entry. And here are my reasons and examples of his heinous deeds.
(And no, I am not naming these examples in alphabetic order or else it would take to long.)
Faux Affably Evil: All For One acts in a polite and calm manner on the outside, but once he go into battle and fights with All-Might, it's clear he's a psychopath bent on manipulating others and making their lives a living hell. Especially his relationship with Shigaraki. See below for more on that.
Manipulative Bastard: This is basically his bread and butter besides being an arsenal of Quirks. He is the one behind the League of Villains' founding and the one who placed his disciple Shigaraki in charge of it, and most likely Kurogiri as his advisor and support. He found a young Shigaraki, real name Tenko Shimura, and took him in to groom him into becoming his successor and to hate All-Might, all just to screw with him because Shigaraki is the grandson of his mentor Nana Shimura, which after hearing this revelation, makes All-Might feel as if he is disgracing his mentor's legacy by hurting her flesh and blood. And while it looks like he treats Shigaraki in a fatherly manner and advises him and even protected him from capture, he's only doing this to make sure that there will always be an All For One and has clearly being indoctrinated the boy for years, filling his head with lies and deceptions. His fight with All-Might leads to him losing One For All and creating a power vacuum which leads to more Villains surface and for Endeavour, a Jerkass and greedy Hero, becoming No. 1. He preaches and acts like All-Might wronged him and his allies, but it's clear he's full of shit, especially after his motives are revealed.
Hero Killer: He has killed hundreds if not thousands of Heroes, including all of the previous seven One For All users. It's clear he enjoys doing so as well.
Mad Scientist: He is responsible for creating the Nomus by having the League of Villains abduct civilians and experiments on them, turning them into horrid vile monsters with their brains exposed and gives them multiple Quirks to make them formidable killing machines. The first Nomu was designed specifically to counter and overpower All-Might using a combination of shock absorption to redirect blows back and regeneration in case any of his attacks do cause major damage, not to mention even after everything All-Might did to him, he's still alive without a scratch.
Sadist: He clearly gets kicks out of the suffering and discord he creates, especially when mocking All-Might about Nana Shimura's death and the revelation that Shigaraki is her grandson. Then there is his method of trying to kill All-Might. He used shockwaves to weaken him then used a combination of Quirks on his right arm to create an attack that were specifically combined to kill him. It's clear he's thought this through and will enjoy it.
Power Parasite: He steals people's Quirks, gaining their powers while leaving them a Quirkless weakling. Considering the state that Ragdoll was in when the Pro Heroes find, it looks to be a really painful and traumatic process. Granted, she was unconscious and in stasis, but afterwards, it's clear it traumatized her.
Smug Super: He's one of the two [[Physical God: Physical Gods]], before All-Might loses One For All, in the series and brags and boasts a bit about how powerful he is towards All-Might. He does of course have the power to back it up, it doesn't change how much of an asshole he is when speaking about his power.
Knight of Cerebus: His first full appearance onscreen, and not those teasers of him sitting in his chair hooked up to tubes and IV fluids, has him wipe the floor with several Pro Heroes, showing just how much of a badass and powerful Villain he is. The thing that cements his status as one of these is the minute he appears Midoriya and his friends, in the process of trying to rescue Bakugo, can't even look at him, and even then they feel an intense and malevolent force from All For One that makes them see their own deaths. You have to be a truly pure evil guy just to be able to make people wish for death when in your presence.
The Dreaded: As above states, his mere presence is enough to make the weak willed see their own deaths. This quote from All-Might sums up how much of an evil bastard All For One is.
"The Reason You Suck" Speech: The one he gives to All-Might after the quote above is downright chilling and shows just how much of a monster he is.
For the Evulz: His motivations for everything he has done. All For One's life-goal was basically to become the antithesis of everything that is good, making him probably the closest thing the series as to an Ultimate Evil. His reason for wanting to mold Shigaraki into a successor are due to fact that because All-Might crippled him, he became weaker and therefore wants to make sure that there will always be the personification of evil in this world by passing down his knowledge and most likely his Quirk.
Anyway, these are my reasons why All For One should be classified as a Complete Monster. I hope this convinces you admins or creators.
