Complete Monster Cleanup

There is one keeper I want removed from the list. Ploy from the movie 'Alone'. Here is her entry:

• Alone (2007): Ploy is Pim's evil twin sister. Having usurped her sister's place after killing her, Ploy spends years posing as Pim and deceiving the man she married, Wee, with whom she is obsessed. After spending years living in Korea, Ploy and her husband return to their homeland in Thailand when her mother becomes ill, where Ploy begins to be haunted by the ghost of his dead twin sister. In order to prevent her secret from surfacing, Ploy murders her own sick mother in the hospital by turning off her oxygen, but not before Wee finds out the truth and decides to abandon her forever. Disgusted, Ploy tortures Wee by taking advantage of his diabetes problem; throws the head of the house dog, which she ran over, onto his lap; kills the housekeeper so she doesn't interfere with Ploy's plans; and sets the house on fire when she realizes that Wee has escaped.

I am not sure by what standard we judge horror villains, but Ploy's crimes are:

• Accidentally murdering her sister (I will elaborate more on why it is accidental below)

• Killing her own mother

• Killing the housekeeper of her mother

• Trying to kill her feancee, Wee and stabbing him with an injection while he is tied up

In short, two successful kills that were intentional, one death caused by accident after angrily lashing out and one attempted murder. The fact a lot of those are people close to her might push her, but I am not sure.

However, the main reason why I am making this removal is because Ploy feels remorse over her sister's death.

We see several flashbacks from their childhood that show them being affectionate to one another, promising they would never separate (because they are Siamese twins) and we see one scene where a group of kids mock them for being different which causes Pim to cry and Ploy gets angry and throws a rock at one of the kids.

Wee as a young boy starts being attracted towards Pim which causes Ploy to be jealous of her sister and the two of them have arguments about it. After one such argument, Pim calls Ploy "a burden" and demands that they should separate. This causes Ploy to get angry, saying "I am not a burden" and chokes her sister, but after she realizes that her sister is dead, Ploy freaks out and starts calling her name, trying to shake her awake and crying. Considering that Ploy killed her sister in a fit of anger after the latter called her "a burden" and her reaction after she realizes Pim is dead, it seems like she didn't even intend to kill Pim, but lashed out angrily at her a lost control in her rage.

In the present, there are many hints that Ploy still feels bad about this. At the prospect of returning home, Ploy bitterly states to her fiancee that her sister would still be alive if not for her. After returning to her old house, she sees a piano and a couple of child clothes and she has fond flashbacks about how the two with her sister used to play together. It's even heavily implied that some of the things she sees throughout the film are not actually the ghost of her dead sister who is seeking revenge, but rather hallucinations caused by her own guilt which manifests itself in the present (even though it's also hinted that some of the things she sees are actually true because on one occasion her fiancee also sees some blood stains appearing on the bed which immediately disappear as soon as he gets out from under the bed, but there are other moments like when she thinks that her belly is being torn apart and her clothes are soaked in blood, but the nurse who is right next to her doesn't see anything like that and those visions disappear as soon as the nurse talks to her). There are also other subtle hints throughout the film that she feels remorse.

Edited by WatTambor on Dec 10th 2022 at 7:51:48 PM

I’m just gonna say I lean more towards cutting Lo Bu because it does seem like there is a bit TOO much ambiguity here.

Edited by MasterN on Dec 10th 2022 at 8:28:28 AM

When laid out, I'm fine going with a no to Ploy

STAR: Is that dude in all of Fangton or just the first novel?

Cut Ploy.

Bullman: You know, I'm not sure a policy's ever been established for that. I think we've just been using majority rules. ( No need to remove the question; it's a good one).

Edited by ACW on Dec 10th 2022 at 11:31:38 AM

Cut ploy.

Does a rewrite need the same amount of votes as a new entry? I forgot what the discussion was there.

Edited by Bullman on Dec 10th 2022 at 10:31:54 AM

Just the first book - he’s killed at the end of it

Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Dec 10th 2022 at 11:31:06 AM

@ACW: My original writeup for Illega works better. More concise, less natter.

Cut Ploy; Sorry, unsure there Bull, I know we've been pretty informal about them but I think the five upvotes is ''technically' what we're to use.

Alright, cool. I personally don't mind, but as the troper, we'll go with the original.

Edited by ACW on Dec 10th 2022 at 11:34:07 AM

Lighty, I prepped something about Wednesday myself last night. You want any help?

Based on what I read in both cases, to keeping Amin and to keeping Gray.

Completely agree that Namor easily does enough, but is ABSOLUTELY NOT this.

I may have missed something, but we have a new discussion dates page to see who got what? I prepped a rewrite for the H40 Blumhouse Michael Myers to include the events of Halloween Ends.

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Dec 10th 2022 at 8:54:42 AM

Cut Ploy

Happily, Future. Take it to DM

Sounds good. Also reached out in PM about Black Adam since you got that on reservation too.

Reached out to Austin on Michael and awaiting a response.

Your rewrite is good Bull. Just replace the word "corporate" with "cooperate" though.

Even though its been two weeks as of 12/7 since Glass Onion got its one week only release on 11/23, we're clearing waiting until 1/6 for actual discussion since 12/23 is its official Netflix release though. Or am I mistaken?

SIGH. Feels good to be back.

Leaning on Lo being kept.

I think 12/7 is fine, since it was released in theaters earlier.

Hi, was never on CM much but I'll give this another go.

Thus far, Entity 01, Gein, Gray, Amin and Ploy seem like cuts. It's a tough choice, but I'll say a keep to Lo Bu. If there was an established desire to protect his people I think he'd be a cut but I think he's okay to stay.

Aside from that the Kamoshida and Dark Lord rewrites look good, as do all of the ones which were pending.

Even if we keep Lo Bu (and we still don't have evidence he lacks altruistic qualities), the entry still needs a rewrite. For example, Make an Example of Them is not in play here; he's out there to kill Jogos Nhai peoples, not "making an example".

I'm all for Future doing the Myers rewrite. Not much to really discuss: Michael still keeps and actually dies this time (though he'll probably be back twenty years later). Corey does not count.

@Agent

I think you can talk about Arrowfell and such.

I admit I find myself agree that "Make an example of them" is a little...not-fitting for such a thing.

I'll support a Lo Bu rewrite if that's the case.

Keep Lo Bu and give him a re-write

Cut Gray and Ploy

Edited by G-Editor on Dec 10th 2022 at 9:02:09 AM

Speaking about rewrites and ASOIAF, I talked with 43 during the time the threads were closed and we might need to make some changes on the ASOIAF Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard pages about how they are structured.

There are a couple of animated videos called Histories and Lore which are canon to the Game of Thrones show and which were used to get some of the candidates to qualify and in them the show version of Maegor commits enough crimes to keep and has no redeeming qualities. However, his crimes are too similar to his book counterpart's to justify a separate entry.

From the way the ASOIAF CM page is currently structured, it looks like only book Maegor keeps while his counterpart from the show canon doesn't qualify. Me and 43 discussed that maybe we could put a title which says "Book and show canon" or something like that where we would put Maegor's entry? Also, we will probably need to specify the crimes that are exclusive to the book canon because some of them are omitted from the show canon (cutting off Wat the Hewer's limbs, killing Tyanna and having one of his nephews tortured to death are exclusive to the books), but despite this, the version from the show canon still does enough to stand out.

Aside from that, we should IMO change the title of the "Game of Thrones" folder to "Game of Thrones and Histories & Lore" or something like that because those videos were used to make some of the characters qualify and they wouldn't qualify without them (like Aerys who otherwise doesn't have enough personality in the show or Euron because we get more info on what he did during his past as a pirate).

Edited by WatTambor on Dec 10th 2022 at 10:11:59 PM

Cut Ploy

I'm not sure Lo Bu, I'm abstaining for now and I'll think about him, but if he stays he should get a rewrite.

Anyway, RWBY: Arrowfell, has multiple guys in it, one who has some potential but I don't think he ultimately passes the bar.

The plot of the game is that there these mysterious orbs that seem to be attracting Grimm and causing chaos. Turns out it's all a big conspiracy to oust General Ironwood.

The members of the conspiracy are:

• Amoncio Glass, who's an Arms Dealer help distribute the orbs and supply the bad guys with weapons, but that and attack Team RWBY with a mech he does nothing as he's just a distributor. Also he's not taken very seriously, being played a cartoonish smug coward.
• Hanlon Fifestone, a Mantle union leader who is the one fueling the orbs, since his semblance allows him extract fear and stuff it into stuff. All he's shown doing is extracting one person's fear and then gets beaten up in his boss fight, and extracting isn't pleasant but doesn't seem to cause actual damage, plus he seems to genuinely think that this whole conspiracy will help Mantle.
• There's Team BRIR, who aren't actually a member of the conspiracy, they're a team tasked with guarding a classified military fort that the Big Bad is robbing for the orbs, and he tricks them into thinking Team RWBY are the actual thieves. They all care about each other and help Team RWBY after they realize the truth.
• Lt.Col. Olive Harper served as the inside man in the Atlas military, but she thought they were genuinely going to help people, and and when she realizes they're not she leaves the conspiracy and gives Team RWBY some skill points to help them stop it.
• Finally there's the Big Bad behind the conspiracy, Bram Thornmane. Once a member of the Atleasian military he wanted to become an Ace-Op for the glory it would give him but was rejected by Ironwood. Thornamane set a guardian program to protect outlying villages, but that was only so he be praised as a hero. He arranged this whole conspiracy to attract Grimm attacks across Mantle and the villages to make Ironwood look incompetent and he could come in and be heralded as a hero for stopping the attacks. Dude has nothing redeeming, he's just an egomaniac who has a really petty reason for the whole thing, but I don't think he quite passes the bar, since his plan is just involve some Grimm attacks. Cinder, Watts and Tyrian all cause much larger Grimm attacks that threaten entire cities, the Crown has mass-brainwashing, Adam leads large scale terrorist attacks and ultimately plans to enslave humanity to the faunus. All of them have larger scale plans with much more cruel ways to implement them. If someone else wants to make an argument for him I'll listen, but I skeptical he's heinous enough, and I highly doubt he'll ever appear again.

Oh yeah. Corey absolutely is not this at all.

Current:

• 2018 film & Kills: Michael Myers, forty years after his original killing spree, escapes from a crashed prison bus, killing several people, including a young boy, just to retrieve his mask. Beginning a new spree, Michael breaks into several homes to butcher their residents throughout the night, as well as the friends of Laurie's granddaughter, Allyson. After stomping his psychiatrist's head in and killing Allyson's father, Michael is left to burn by Laurie, Allyson, and Karen. Surviving that, Michael escalates his killing spree by slaughtering responding firefighters and the mob formed by Tommy Doyle; killing Tommy himself; makes Allyson watch as he brutalizes and kills her boyfriend, before murdering her mother Karen. With at least thirty kills in the span of a night, Michael would prop their bodies as morbid decorations and show that age has not slowed his brutality.

Only two additions and they're very obvious:

• 2018 film, Kills & Ends: Michael Myers, forty years after his original killing spree, escapes from a crashed prison bus, killing several people, including a young boy, just to retrieve his mask. Beginning a new spree, Michael breaks into several homes to butcher their residents throughout the night, as well as the friends of Laurie's granddaughter, Allyson. After stomping his psychiatrist's head in and killing Allyson's father, Michael is left to burn by Laurie, Allyson, and Karen. Surviving that, Michael escalates his killing spree by slaughtering responding firefighters and the mob formed by Tommy Doyle; killing Tommy himself; makes Allyson watch as he brutalizes and kills her boyfriend, before murdering her mother Karen. Then four years later, Michael manipulates town pariah Corey Cunningham into committing a whole new killing spree for him before then disposing of Corey once he's strong enough to go after Laurie one final time. With at least thirty kills in the span of a night, Michael would prop their bodies as morbid decorations and show that age has not slowed his brutality.

Thanks Austin!