Eldritch Abominations. Does Christianity Do Them Better?

As we all know, H. P. Lovecraft is considered to be the grandfather of Cosmic Horror. With his Cthulhu Mythos containing such unspeakable horrors such as the Great Old Ones and Outer Gods, which defy human comprehension and bring terror upon those who disturb them.

So who could possibly top Lovecraft? It might just be The Bible itself. Surprised, huh?

Well, according to TV Tropes' page on eldritch horrors in mythology and religion, God is described as being beyond human comprehension and existing outside of space and time itself. Not to mention, God's real name is said to bring insanity if pronounced properly.

The Man Upstairs isn't the only one in there, angels are described as being very Lovecraftian in appearance. What with the Cherubim having four heads and being covered in eyes. Hell, even Satan, the living embodiment of evil itself, is pretty eldritch in nature. He's not a red-skinned demon with a pitchfork and horns, he's about as much as a Lovecraftian horror as the angels. The Bible doesn't even describe his TRUE form.

So what do you think? Did the Bible did Lovecraft BEFORE Lovecraft? Possibly even better?

Lovecraftian stories, for the most part, are dealing with the utter helplessness of humanity, that we are nothing, just a little speck of blue dust in the universe full of cold, uncaring void. That's the bottom line.

Bible, and Abrahamaic religion in general, basically telling that, yes, we maybe seen as insequential in this vast universe, but that's not all. We are telling to, basically, care to each other, help others, and not bring harm to others, to fulfil your life. Oh, and Praise Him, but you can't basically truly Praise Him if you didn't do things mentioned above.

Eldritch Abomination, yes. A good deal of such described beings are basically "what if gods were real" or "what would aliens really be like" in the context of a man who thinks human morality of little consequence to anything in the universe other than humanity itself, which is but a small part of it. But the availability of the word "eldritch" itself is an indicator that strange nigh incomprehensible beings have been part of human story telling and propaganda long before one HP tried his hand at it.

Cosmic Horror Story? No, as humanity is ultimately something special according to the Bible and precious to God, even if he does have a disturbing habit of ordering certain section of humanity to slaughter others. Religious Horror yes, but that's a different genre than Lovecraft's. Cosmic horror story and eldritch abomination can be used independent of one another. The reboot of Lost in Space plays on cosmic horror but has no eldritch abominations. Johnny the Homicidal Maniac has an eldritch abomination driving the plot but is not a cosmic horror story.

Basically, the Biblical God is in some ways the anti-Lovecraftian abomination. He's incomprehensible and beyond human understanding, yes, but while Lovecraft's Old Ones are characterized by their utter apathy towards mankind, and by how their morality system is alien to us, the Abrahamic God's entire thing is his overwhelming concern for mankind, to the point that guiding and helping mankind is his entire reason to exist (as evidenced by the life of Jesus Christ) and his morality system is at least somewhat discernible to us (thus things like the 10 commandments).

So the Abrahamic God is both a prime example of a lovecraftian abomination and the anti-thesis of the concept.

This is totally untrue. The Israelites knew and said God's name all the time. God's name was written in the original Hebrew Scriptures, so it would have been said when recited. The Jews stopped only because of a silly misunderstanding of the third commandment.

The Bible describes him as a seven-headed dragon. His true form is, if not that, likely that of a simple angel.

So by "Christianity" are we talking a straight read of the Bible, or the religion. Those are two very different things.

Yes, the Bible itself contains some descriptions of some beings and entities. They would have been extremely odd to imagine in the 1600s, and I suspect that's why the next point comes up...

The religion has taken some concrete descriptions and... warped them. It's amusing to imagine that the entities themselves are responsible - while they can't change the literal word of God (as the Bible can be held as), they're allowed to change how humans interpret it.

So yes, under that specific argument, "Christianity" as a system of beliefs is one way to create a better abomination.

Now, of course, we run into a problem: the argument is largely identical to saying "Christianity-influenced Western Culture is superior at creating better abominations." There are some problems with this that I shouldn't have to point out, and it is with this in mind that I can't agree with it.

Remember, the first thing an angel says is usually "Do not be afraid"

I didn't mean to imply that at all. I was just debating on whether Christanity had more frighting monsters than Lovecraft or not.

Depends on what you mean by frightening. The Sun is pretty frightening. It's a giant uncontrolled nuclear reaction that will one day consume the world. Black holes are scary. You can't really see them and anything that goes in never comes back out.

However,neither of those things keep (most) people up at night.

So it's really a matter of potential damage vs probability that they're a threat. For Lovecraft, we never know when some ancient god is going to decide Earth looks tasty. For the Seraphrim, they're actively trying to protect and guide humanity.

I get your point.

From my point of view Nyarlathotep makes Satan look like a complete pussy.

But not in our lifetime.

I'm not familiar with HP Lovecraft, so how does Nyarlothotep make Satan seem like a pussy (not that that is hard to do, while he is scary he does have limits on his power).

It's complicated but the gist of it is that if his boss ever wakes up the universe as we know it will disappear.

Basically what Satan does, but in a much more cruel and sadistic manner. Worse in the fact is while Satan does it out of spite, Nyarlathotep does it purely for his own amusement.

Can't spite also be for one's own evil amusement?

Well, Satan has discernible motives, maybe. To some people the unknown factor is scarier. That, well there are things put in place to keep Satan in check, like the aforementioned Seraphim, Cherubim, Ophanim, Michael. There are things to stop the Great Old Ones and Outer Gods too but they don't actually care about stopping them from messing with humanity in particular, so long as the rest of the universe at large is still there.

Satan and his minions are restrained by the power of goodness. Nyarlathotep and his minions are restrained....

...by nothing. They will win. It is foretold.

Isn't it foretold by the Great Old Ones and contradicted by the Elder Gods. Isn't that the conflict? Two factions of monsters bickering over their different stances on the Outer Gods, united in common apathy toward humanity? Nyarlthotep's genuine malice a unique trait?

The whole Great Old Ones vs Elder Gods thing was mostly motivated by Derleth trying to impose some sense of good vs evil on the whole mythos. Though Nyarly is unique in his/her/its active malice and sadistic glee. For the most part the Elder Gods are indifferent to the suffering of mortals, assuming they even notice us at all.

The bible is more of an inversion of Lovecraft.

In the Bible, humans really are Cthulhu-we're the "children" of an incredibly powerful Elder Abomination. And not only are we not doomed, our victory over actually malovelent/apathetic abominations is a foregone conclusion.

Basically, YHWH is Satan's Cthulhu.

edited 25th Nov '15 11:30:13 AM by Protagonist506

Not a Christian myself, but I've borrowed for my own work's Eldritch Abomination from Christian depictions of Satan, both directly and by way of C. S. Lewis^note to name but one example, I must remember to officially thank him for The Island Where Dreams Come True, a fascinatingly terrifying concept I've borrowed with modifications and J. R. R. Tolkien's Morgoth^note to whom I am indebted, along with Terry Pratchett's take on the Fair Folk, for the concept of Creative Sterility and an obsession with corruption.

The fact is — and I owe Gault for pointing this out to me — the despairing cosmicism of Lovecraft has been greatly blunted by the compelling humanism of Sagan. More and more, people are understanding and making peace with how tiny and fragile our place in the universe is, and how easily it could all be extinguished. Which means that Lovecraft, while still a more creative and dynamic writer that pop culture gives him credit for, has suffered some in his tales' aging.

But what if Sagan is wrong, and there is something that cares about us tiny little apes? That cares enough to hate us utterly? We know, abstractly, our species could be swatted like a man might unthinkingly swat a fly. Instead, though, there may be something out there, as petty as it is mighty, acting to spite a Creator it hates (or perhaps because there is nothing to challenge it) that would prefer to pluck our wings, watch us crawl for a time, then finally drop us in a bowl of water to see us struggle and drown.

edited 27th Nov '15 4:15:41 PM by KillerClowns

On a same note as above, the Bible justifies some of its Lovecraft Lite elements fairly well-for example, YHWH modeled humanity after himself. This means that God would seem relatively "human". Or rather, humans and God are both very strange, but we're the same type of strange, so we can relate to each other.

You know how some people give Satan a Lovecraftian makeover? What do you think of that?

Can you link us to an example?

I've used that very turn of phrase for Giygas. Done right, it works. It really does work.

EDIT: To clarify, in gleefully spoiler-y detail: Giygas is the game's Final Boss, an Eldritch Abomination referred to as the manifestation of all evil. It is at once virtually mindless and in abject self-inflicted agony, but unspeakably powerful nevertheless. And to top it all off, only the use of Paula's "prayer" ability can defeat it — it simply ignores conventional attacks by its mortal foes. Sound familiar?

edited 29th Nov '15 8:04:28 PM by KillerClowns