During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Ultimate Moral Compass
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Iblison
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Ey, congrats man!
CM And Karma Houdini Crossovers
Got this sandbox set up. Let me know if there are any issues before putting it in the Monster Sandboxes
Goku Black
Oh for Shark?
Wayne does come back btw. And is arrested.
For some weird reason. His entry only covers his first appearance.
Edit: Okay the fact I'm spotting characters that like die is maybe not the best sign this was a good idea.
Edited by miraculous on Aug 31st 2022 at 4:56:56 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Professor Gigachad
Since it looks like this Shadow Queen will be approved I am thinking of making the Mario Fan Works page now since this now makes 14, 12 of which are filling the Fan Works page. If I do it now it will stall us some time until we need to make that Sonic, FNAF and Zelda Fan Works page and then have to find a new image and quote for the Fan Games page and a new image (again) for the Fan Works page.
The only question is if I should name it Mario Fan Works (for simplicity) or Super Mario Bros. Fan Works (since it's the name of the franchise).
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
Yea to Shadow Queen and Iblison and glad to hear Wet. I’ve gotta ask following mir’s note if the sandbox is needed? Many of these seem to pop up from momentary interest and are soon forgotten, rife with inaccuracies and just left. Theoretically we could list CM as an intersection with almost any trope… I know there was a “CM with FE” project for awhile that got scrapped after the creator conceded it was going to lead to complaining. Do we think we may have jumped the gun a bit here?
Personally I’d go franchise title.
Edited by 43110 on Aug 31st 2022 at 10:24:50 AM
Dino Attack RPG doesn’t have a YMMV page despite having three C Ms.
Is only ACW allowed to add them or can I make a YMMV page and copy-paste the entries?
Showtime!
Anyone can make a YMMV page and adding the approved entries to a YMMV page can be done by anyone
Problem is that I can’t copy and paste the potholes as well since the page is locked.
Should I just create the YMMV page and add the potholes later?
Edited by NattesNovgrel on Aug 31st 2022 at 9:44:35 AM
The Draftsman of Doom
Nat: Perhaps you could copy the entries from Sandbox.Monster Fan Works.
Yes to Prophet, BTW.
Edited by SkyCat32 on Aug 31st 2022 at 10:45:58 AM
Feels good, don't it?
Thanks, you two. I’ll wait for the sandbox to unlock and copy the entries.
Edited by NattesNovgrel on Aug 31st 2022 at 9:48:28 AM
The Moron
You can also click the "more" dropdown menu at the top, click "page source", and copy and paste it from there without waiting for the page to unlock
Professor Gigachad
Um so guys I have a bit of a concern with Dino Attack RPG checking the YMMV page it brings up this.
If the whole YMMV page was deleted for Auto-Erotic Troping I am very worried that these entries might have been added by someone in the roleplay. Looking at previous discussions it seems these were grandfathered in which makes my concern even bigger.
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Aug 31st 2022 at 8:08:38 AM
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
Professor Gigachad
Um so guys even worse the original person who evaluated all of these admits on his own troper page he is the host of this RPG.
Yeah guys we need to cut these right away. It's not even an argument because keeping these up would violate wiki policy.
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Aug 31st 2022 at 8:27:33 AM
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
I mean, let's face it - I've argued in the abstract for the possibility of people reading a roleplay that weren't involved in it (since that's a thing I actually do), but in practice any roleplay's YMMV page is going to be entirely the result of Auto-Erotic Troping. It's why some mods want to get rid of the whole namespace. This is not exactly a shock.
Shadow Queen and Iblison.
I got a vanishingly quick Marvel villain, vanishingly quick because that's kind of how he was...
What has Protocol done?
Introduced in the 90s New Warriors series, Protocol was one of their big bads, a Diabolical Mastermind with a terrorist organization called Undertow. What earns him his place here?
Well, this was released riiiiight after a little thing called the Rwandan Genocide. And the writers...uh, bless them and whatever they were thinking with this writing choice, but they decided the quickest way to make Protocol evil was to make him prey on Rwandan refugees. Protocol steals medicine meant for hundreds of sick and dying Rwandan children for a cheap profit. Then he one-ups himself by just flat-out massacring a refugee camp full of seven-hundred innocents.
Protocol spends the rest of the series pursuing nebulous plots of power, where we learn every soldier of his is a tortured slave kept in line with implants—"we have invaded your mind, raped your soul." He tries to snatch one of the heroes for this nasty purpose, but fails, and the series is canned an issue later. He's never even been referenced since.
Wonder why.
Any mitigating factors?
Nah. New Warriors fought some nasties, but even place this guy in a higher standard like, say, 616 Punisher or Ghost Rider, he still stands out. Ignoring how cheap it is to have a random comic book villain profit off a a genocide while that genocide is happening in real life—comic book-vile, real world-vile, he hits both standards.
Conclusion?
Keeper.
Professor Gigachad
Protocol.
So can I just cut the Dino Attack villains right now for violating wiki policy or do you guys want me to wait for votes? If its the latter can I please get some votes?
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
Ultimate Moral Compass
A vanishingly quick to the vanishingly quick Protocol
Goku Black
Protocol
Barb / Temporary Kylo
What does 'host' mean in this situation? Did they help with the RPG's story or help write the characters themselves?
to Protocol
Imperfect Disgrace
Protocol.
Edited by Misry6 on Sep 1st 2022 at 1:47:43 AM
Just an empty void…
Professor Gigachad
From what I am telling it seems host in this context means like he is the one who created and directed the entire RPG with other people being involved as well. Like I feel like that is way too much of a direct involvement for this to be passable.
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
Protocal
Throwing my thoughts on Ordeaux26's concern here.
If it's against wiki policy, I don't know why we'd need to vote on that. Because if you did vote to keep them you'd be literally going against wiki policy.
Although I guess a counterpoint against that is that we could vote to see if we consider it too much involvement.
If they did have so much involvement that they created and directed the thing, that sounds like they essentially made it. I'll give a cut if we do decide to vote on it.
Edited by Flowman on Sep 1st 2022 at 2:25:01 PM
Goku Black
Honestly considering the guy who made the ymmv page admitted to it and cut it. I think its safe to do the same now.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
In other news, I'm out the hospital now!
Oh, Mr. Kennedy, you entertain me. To show my appreciation, I will help you awaken from your world of clichés.