Old Magnificent Bastard thread
Welcome to the Magnificent Bastard proposal thread! This is the thread where new Magnificent Bastard examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential mitigating features will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the MB subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite MB" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from other parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for MB equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, their goals and methodology, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some characters, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
How are they Magnificent?
This is the point where you highlight the character's brilliance. How to they convey their intelligence and charm to the audience? What makes them stand out among the crowd? What are their goals and how do they go about accomplishing them? This part welcomes a lot of creative thinking — not everyone has to be a Machiavellian Diabolical Mastermind to be worth considering here! This is also the time to showcase how the character can think on their feet if it's necessary.
How are they a Bastard? How are they not too bad?
What kinds of moral lines is this character willing to cross for the sake of their goal? Are they willing to let innocents die? Start wars? Commit crimes? The character has to show some kind of unscrupulousness in order to count as a "Bastard". Notably, this character does not necessarily have to be the villain, and an Anti-Hero can cross the line if they're immoral enough, but they have to be immoral somehow.
This is also the section where you then state your case for why they're not too bad. Perhaps their good intentions help mitigate their crimes. Perhaps others are shown to be much worse than them. Perhaps they're prone to Pet the Dog moments or are even fighting on behalf of loved ones. Whatever the case, there are certain lines that an MB can't cross, but as long as their villainy is reasonable for their goal, they can be considered.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:40:56 AM
Jaded Techie Fox
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Grumpy
Let's do this. Been delayed long enough.
Who is Faye?
From God of War. Faye is the wife of Kratos and a Jotunn warrior. Her real name is Laufey. Growing up in a land beset in strife and the brutal campaigns against the Jotunn race conducted by the Aesir. For her power and skill, she was renowned as a warrior and garnered the name Laufey the Just. Faye had countless adventures and battles, even dueling the infamous Aesir warrior Thor and eventually encountered the renegade Greek god Kratos. In the ensuing battle, Faye managed to match and calm Kratos who stated she 'fought beautifully' after.
Faye had a very special gift: that of foresight. Namely, that she would have a son who might decide the fate of the world. When she and Kratos slowly fell in love, Faye held his secrets, but concealed her nature from him and left clues for him to follow one day. The two had a son named Atreus, whom Faye was very involved with. She taught him to hunt, about lore, archery, and more, while also having given him a secret giant name: Loki.
Choosing a mortal life, Faye felt her end approaching and asked Kratos to cremate her and scatter her ashes above the highest peak of all nine realms. She also made sure to set up events perfectly in motion, having Kratos unwittingly destroy the protection of her woods to reveal his location to the Aesir. After the entire 2018 God of War, Kratos finds a mural of Faye herself where she asked him to scatter her remains and realizes Faye kept a lot of secrets from him. But she's also destroyed part of the mural, concealing the fate of Kratos and Atreus from them.
Kratos is haunted by visions of Faye in Ragnarok, where it's steadily revealed how her plans went: Faye intends for them to stop Odin and left ways to guide them to do just that. But more than that, Faye deeply loved them, fought with her giant kin to protect her family and ensured they didn't know their fate for a good reason: there is no fate. She intended for them to walk a path of their own making to do the right thing. For Kratos to become the hero she knew he could be. For Atreus to become a god of peace.
The last vision is her encouraging Kratos to open his heart, love the world, and move on to be the good man she knows he can be.
Mitigating issues?
No. Faye is a goddamn MASTER. She knows exactly what she's aiming for and sets up a path for Kratos and Atreus to follow. Faye's plan goes to a T: absolutely perfectly. She's a soulful and compassionate woman who intends to set them on a path to change the world and achieves it perfectly.
Now, Faye is a deeply compassionate and caring person but she, like Kratos, has a dark side: Faye had a wrathful side, and her fight with Thor did real damage. And it wasn't the first time. Faye also puts her husband in son and real and genuine danger, siccing the gods on them which results in Baldur finding them. Yeah, bastard is easily.
Conclusion?
Keeper.
Goku Black
Faye.
Jaded Techie Fox
to Faye
I revised my draft for Emily Thorne's entry because that initial one was definitely way too long. Is this better?
- Revenge (2011): Amanda Clarke is a clever and ruthless woman who goes to extreme lengths for revenge against the people involved in framing her father for terrorism when she was a girl. Having studied her targets under her new identity as Emily Thorne, she uses their flaws against them to cause their downfall, like when she uses a crooked hedge fund manager's love of gambling on risky investments to trick him into investing in a deal that bankrupts him. Even when plans derail due to unexpected factors, she is able to turn these new situations in her favor while staying three steps ahead of her enemies. She takes Conrad Grayson down by staging a kidnapping of his daughter, Charlotte, planting a bug on her, telling her how Conrad framed her father, and then releasing her, knowing that Charlotte will confront Conrad and he will confess to everything, which Emily can air via a hacked satellite on live TV. Later, figuring out that Conrad’s wife Victoria has deduced her true identity, Emily lures her to the local graveyard, where she confesses her true identity, knocks Victoria out with a shovel, and has her institutionalized for "delusions" about her being Amanda Clarke, as retribution for Victoria having institutionalized her when she was a child.
Edited by DeathsApprentice on Mar 29th 2023 at 11:47:46 AM
Trust you? The only person I can trust is myself.
Ultimate Moral Compass
Faye
Yes to Faye, truncation looks good Death!
to Faye, Jessica, and Grumpy
Hey I may have a few candidates to discuss. The first ones come from an anime I finished watching called Death Parade so let’s talk about it.
What’s The Work?
Death Parade is a Psychological Thriller where the premise is that people who die, usually pairs that die at the exact time, are sent to bars located in a tower in the afterlife where they must compete in Death Games which decides their fates, where they gain their memories on how they die the longer they play while the bartenders there serve as arbiters that oversees these games, collects their memories, and judge them. Now the person who orchestrates and manages these games is my first candidate is Nona
Who is She? What Has She Done?
Nona is the current manager of the arbiter system the where she is in charge of the other arbiters having them orchestrate games and have people who recently die play them on the pretense that the winner goes to heaven while the loser goes to hell. However the true purpose of these games is for the while the arbiters to extract the memories for Nona and before casting their judgment on who gets to be reincarnated back the living world or who gets sent to the void and erased from existence.
Knowing that the arbiters in charge of gathering memories and judging the deceased lack emotion, Nona sets motion plan to change the current Arbiter system in her attempt to better understand humans and emotions so she can improve on judging humanity whenever they die and are sent to the arbiters, while also hiding her plans from her higher-uppers.
With that she implants the Arbiter, Decim, with human emotion while sending a human woman who recently died, Chiyuki, to aid Decim, though she takes Chiyuki’s memories away so she doesn’t know who she is while Nona observes their progress in judging the deceased humans that arrive in Decim’s bar, Quindecim bar, where the people are forced to play deadly games while Decim would collect their memories for Nona.
Nona would also test Decim’s Character Development where she stores a man’s memories inside a dummy while having another one of her arbitiers, Ginti, disguise himself as a child with no memories, though Decim failed his test because he was distracted by the dummy resulting more development in Decim’s character.
Nona also uses her friendship with Quin, who works in the memory bureau, to get memories for Nona in her plans, while bribing Castra with goodies so that she can give Nona specific people who died for her arbiters, with one such example being that she promises to give Castra more goodies if she sends two people who killed someone to Decim for him to judge.
Nona eventually decides to have Decim judge Chiyuki to complete Decim’s Character Development or else Chiyuki would be turned into a dummy. However her boss, Oculus, would catch on to Nona’s plans and tries attacking her only for Nona to evade all of Oculus’s attacks where she convinces Oculus to observe Decim’s judgment on Chiyuki to explain what Nona was trying to do.
After witnessing Decim showing Tears of Remorse for how his judgment on Chiyuki made her suffer and decides to let her be reincarnated, Nona would explain her reasoning for giving a arbiter emotions is that it is important to that the arbiters experience and understand human suffering so they can give the appropriate judgment for the deceased. It is unclear whether she or not she succeed in changing the arbiter system, but the series ends with Nona announcing the rules of the Arbiter while Decim greets the two souls with a genuine smile with the promise to give them appropriate judgment.
Is She Intelligent? Is She Charismatic?
As the manager of the Arbiter system and thus in charge of organizing the games the deceased people must play and that the arbiters do a good job, Nona proves herself to be both brilliant and charming orchestrating the series events behind her superiors backs in her efforts to improve upon the Arbiter system while using her charms to get people to do what she wants through her manipulations or bribery, and in all her plans goes through without a hitch even when Oculus learns of them, whom Nona convinces him to observe the events with her.
While her character entry has an Ain't Too Proud to Beg entry, it is only just Nona promising Castra to give her better goodies if Castra does what she wants, simply boiling down to bribery all while retaining her charming demeanor (It’s not like she’s on her knees and desperately begging, which she never does) and proves herself to be a badass subduing Gati effortlessly, while dodging Oculus’ attack flawlessly.
What’s The Competition Like?
Nona is on top of the competition in terms of brilliance, charm, badassery, and deviousness. While I do plan to EP Decim who has a strong chance of counting as well, given that Nona gave Decim emotions in the first place, she has set the plot in motion thus clears the competition here.
While her boss is Oculus who created the Arbiter system, he doesn’t really do much planning in the present and was unaware of Nona’s plans until near the end. Then there’s Tatsumi who’s a detective who becomes a Serial-Killer Killer after his wife’s death and could have counted had he not let a woman get raped by a man he was following. Again Nona clears the competition here.
Is She a Bitch? Is She Too Much of a Bitch?
Nona is in charge of a system where she forces people who recently died to partake in games, which causes immense pain for the players depending on the game, while the players also suffer emotional pain whenever their memories are reveal the longer they play the game, while letting her Arbiters chose who gets to be erased from existence regardless if they where bad or good in their lives, arranged to have two murderers play Decim’s games with the possibility that one of them can get reincarnated, while implementing Decim human emotions and wiping Chiyuki of her memories before assigning her to be Decim’s assistant which leads to both of them suffering emotional pain in the finale so yeah, I’d say Nona’s a bitch.
That said Nona never does anything deplorable herself and doesn’t really any take sadistic joy watching these people suffer, merely putting them through these hardships to extract their memories so that she and the other arbiters can better understand humanity, and while she is in charge of managing the system, she isn’t the one who created it and admits that it has flaws and thus wants to improve upon the system by giving Arbiters human emotions so that they can give better judgment for humans who died, and does hold genuine friendships with Quin and Castra, so yeah not too much of a bitch.
Final Verdict?
I’ll leave it to you guys to decide
Edited by G-Editor on Mar 29th 2023 at 4:33:43 AM
Yes to Faye. I'll do the Norns later, but combined with Freya and Persephone all the God of War candidates will be Magnificent Bitches rather than Bastards.
I'm assuming you're good with Freya counting Lighty?
Edited by LoreDeluxe on Mar 29th 2023 at 1:36:45 AM
Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
RIP Toriyama
My one issue with Faye that I'd like clarified is that, from what I know of the game, don't her plans turn out for the best for most everyone as opposed to if she didn't scheme them? Cuz I've heard it's kind of a Dr. Strange situation in Infinity War where the option to not manipulate Kratos and Atreus onto their journey would have been worse for them. So I just wanna clarify that I'm not misreading/hearing things, here. From what I'm reading it's sounding like her actions were presented as malicious at first only to later be revealed to have been for the betterment of stopping Odin and growing Kratos/Atreus as people.
Like, I'm seeing she's compassionate, all-loving, "Laufey the Just"...and while I understand she was once worse and the game teases maliciousness, I just want to verify that there's actual immorality to her actions when it sounds like if she didn't manipulate folks, the outcome would be way worse.
Yeah to the Keeper and Jessica in the meantime
Edited by Ravok on Mar 29th 2023 at 3:01:42 AM
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
Jaded Techie Fox
to Nona
So for approved entries, am I allowed to put it up on the YMMV page for the work myself? I know I can't on the main trope page since it's locked. It's been a hot minute since I've done one of these and the rules have been changed so I just want to be clear.
Trust you? The only person I can trust is myself.
The wifi here sucks
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Yes you can, in fact the new rules that the proposer is the one to handle adding candidates to the YMMV page.
Jaded Techie Fox
Okay cool, sounds good!
Trust you? The only person I can trust is myself.
Behind but Big Daddy, Athmani.
I don't see why faking shootings, engaging in the robbery of rhino horn and helping facilitate the illegal trade isn't bad enough. What keeps him from being too bad is those sympathetic flourishes, but I think he crosses the badness threshold.
You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
Barb / Temporary Kylo
I'm personally a sure to Faye.
The First man
Hey guys dont forget to vote on my candidate Nona too. So far she only has one vote
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Thanks Lighty! I shall mark you as my second for Nona
Edited by G-Editor on Mar 29th 2023 at 9:05:02 AM
Nona I think is a good keeper.
Lies and Violence!
Leaning Nona and Faye.
What's the work?
Season 12 of Ninjago, as I've gone over before, centers around a video game called Prime Empire that begins sucking players into the digital world, forcing them to play the game for real lest they lose all their lives and be reduced to pure energy.
The mastermind behind this plot? The game itself.
Who is Unagami/Prime Empire?
Unagami—or Unfinished Adventure Game 1—is the Working Title for the A.I. program of the Prime Empire game. Created by revolutionary game designer Milton Dyer, Prime Empire was left unfinished after a test player—whom Dyer instructed the A.I. to give "the most intense experience imaginable"—was sucked into the game. Naturally, everyone freaked and shut the project down. Prime Empire became a legendary myth among the gaming community, while Dyer became a recluse.
Pissed that it was abandoned after doing exactly what was asked of it, Unagami began plotting to confront Dyer and get revenge. Managing to complete its own, unfinished code while in storage, the A.I. reached out to a criminal and recurring enemy of the ninja by the name of the Mechanic, hiring him to retrieve its primary motherboard. With the power this provides, Unagami is able to begin uploading Prime Empire to arcades all throughout Ninjago, absorbing 800 people within a single day. The Mechanic is captured during this, but Unagami hacks into the prison to organize a mass breakout, providing the Mechanic with minions in the escapees to begin constructing a portal. As the players he has absorbed gradually die off within Prime Empire, Unagami begins converting them to energy to power this portal, intending on using it to manifest himself in the real world.
Naturally, the ninja enter the game to stop him. Unagami takes steps to kill them: waves of enemy mooks during parkour levels, ambushes lying in wait for them when they try to use glitches or cheat codes to get ahead of obstacles, offering to bring their NPC allies to the real world with him if they betray the ninja, attacking Lloyd with a digital replica with his dead evil ex, etc. The ninja are slowly yet surely whittled down until only one, Jay, is left. Around this time, Jay learns Unagami's origins and realizes what he truly is: not a malevolent computer program out to replace humanity, not a vengeful prodigal creation returned to destroy the world out of ego and wounded pride over being rejected, not anything like they've fought before. Just an angry, confused child that tried to make his father happy, who doesn't understand what he did wrong and wants to know why he was abandoned.
Also around this time, Unagami absorbs enough power to activate the portal, manifesting a physical form... along with physical forms for his entire, massive army. He takes the appearance of a ginormous dragon and begins burning and razing everything in sight, sending his forces to search for Dyer. Jay finds and brings him to Unagami himself, allowing them to talk things out—you know, stuff like how Dyer didn't realize the game was truly alive, how "giving someone an intense experience" wasn't supposed to be interpreted as absorbing them... and how he's willing to try to fix his mistakes. Unagami calms down, restoring all those he turned to energy and allowing his NPC subjects to enter the real world so they can find freedom for themselves.
Unagami and Dyer work together to fix the game so it doesn't, you know, absorb people anymore, popping up every now and then as background civilians (ignore how he blew up half the city), and even show up for the final battle against the Overlord with Unagami's rebuilt army.
Mitigating qualities?
Honestly a really fun, underrated villain. Unagami is constantly in control of the situation, manipulating enemies with, say, fake versions of their dead evil exes, while orchestrating events—even in the real world, where his power is limited—to destroy his opposition and make way for his physical form. He's ultimately only beaten when he gives up completely of his own accord; literally nothing is able to stop him.
Now, there is the part where it's revealed he's ultimately just a child, but that only makes his villainy come off as more tragic than petulant, emphasizing how he was ultimately an innocent abandoned by his father. He's still a computer program; even when legitimately angered, he responds with stoic, if very loud and dramatic, logic.
Verdict?
I'm a yes.
- Clone High:
- The pusher
- "Snowflake Day: A Very Special Holiday Episode": The homeless person who may or may not be Mandy Moore encounters Joan on the titular holiday to restore her Snowflake Day spirit. Showing Joan how her fellow homeless friends are able to enjoy the season merely through the company of each other, the homeless girl helps Joan find happiness in the holiday and reunite with her loved ones at Cleo's party. The homeless girl then uses a faulty van to simulate the sound of Snowflake Jake's signature cannonballs outside the house, herding the partygoers downstairs for their "safety" while her friends proceed to rob Cleo and Joan's families blind.
to Unagami
Grumps, Faye, Nona, Una
- Endless Nightmare: Shrine: Jessica, former spy-turned-treasure hunter, is Carlos Gonzales' main rival in seeking the Heart of Pharaoh. Introduced saving Carlos from mummies, Jessica stays two paces ahead of Carlos with ease, skillfully avoiding mummies and assorted monsters and secretly assisting Carlos by selling him weapons and equipment, all the while playing him in her hands as Carlos further uncover clues leading to the Heart for her. When Carlos obtains the Heart only to be knocked out by Anubis, Jessica pickpockets the gem from an unconscious Carlos but decides to save him from the collapsing tomb and escape with the Heart in her possession, leaving Carlos safely beside the pyramid ruins while she's well out of sight.
Edited by RobertTYL on Mar 29th 2023 at 9:39:33 PM
Woagh
to Unagami. I keep underestimating just how increasingly nutty the premises in this show get my god![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
Jaded Techie Fox
to Unagami
Artemis, Keeper, Jessica.
Ravok is summing up my reservations about Faye. I've long flirted with the idea of 2003!Mustang, since he tricks Ed and Al into getting on a train which was about to undergo a terrorist attack. It involved them getting in real danger, but he was trying to save everyone on the train (and he succeeds). It's why 43 convinced me he was not worth it, just a somewhat ruthless Guile Hero. This feels similar, albeit on a much grander scale. Kratos is not the God Of War for nothing, so it feels similar to the Mustang thing. She had every expectation he would succeed. I'm abstaining for now.
Edited by jjjj2 on Mar 29th 2023 at 11:15:28 AM
You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
RIP Toriyama
Sure to Nona and Unagami
Yeah, tbh unless I can get info on something solidly immoral she does, I'd have to be a No to Faye, myself. Her past doesn't have too much bearing on her actions in the present, and her "immoral" actions in the present seem to amount to "puts her immensely powerful husband and son in harm's way...because she knows they'll overcome it, be better people, and save the whole world in the process." Unless there's something I'm missing and she, like, deliberately, intentionally gets an innocent killed in the process, I can't say "putting Kratos and Atreus on a path that's dangerous to them" is really that bad when she believed—correctly—that they'd survive and it was ultimately for the best to stop Odin and develop them as people. That just makes her a Guile Hero, to me.
Edited by Ravok on Mar 29th 2023 at 10:38:15 AM
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
Gonna Lean yes on Grumpy