Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgment - Violations, misuse, and other issues

Sinfest gets us in trouble all the time, but anything specific on mind?

Edited by Amonimus on Dec 10th 2022 at 3:41:26 PM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

I didn't see anything too bad on that page last time I checked it.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

This comes to mind.

• The sudden shift to the anti-woke era, despite the woke mob using the same "extreme cancel culture and political correctness is good to fight the rightist patriarchy" rhetoric and tactics, seems to stem from Tats being harped on too much by feminists on forums and social media who up until he revealed his anti trans and sex worker rhetoric, were largely on his side until feminist discourse in the mid to late 2010's shifted to remove swerfs and terfs from their ranks. It doesn't help that the woke mob parrots the comments that were publicly directed against him once feminists called out his own brand of feminism for being outdated and bigoted to the two aforementioned groups. Tats clearly did not take being accused of being a reactionary too well when his Sisterhood stories had been attempting to steer the comic left leaning.

I think this entry I'm confused about because I can't tell if woke mob here refers to the in-universe villains or actual critics of the author.

Edited by SkylaNoivern on Dec 10th 2022 at 12:44:24 PM

I mean, based on what I've heard, the following does sound accurate, but could be written in a less inflammatory way, I suppose.

• Anvilicious: Pretty much anything do with the Patriarchy and Xanthe. Pointed out on this strip. Whether or not he's right or if it is victim blaming (as it says in the title) is yet to be established.
  • The May 2018 arc focusing on Prostitution and sex work. Presenting the subject as a Zombie Survival story is at least clever, but the sheer level of "Sex work is evil, m'kay," just smacks of "and this is what I hate this week."
  • The anti-prostitution stories evolved into a broader anvil about woke culture. The morals preached range from "Antifa bad" to "look at these uggo trannies." Tat seemed to be building up intersectionality and the associated political correctness as an authoritarian menace, which ran into problems in January 2021, when supporters of Donald Trump attacked the U.S. Capitol, requiring Tat to reboot the arc. As of June 2021, the anti-woke saga has leaned further into more general American conservative messages above radical feminist ones... But not before lionizing the "QAnon Shaman" in his strips.
  • A pre-Patriarchy example, the Drinking the Kool-Aid strip featuring Barack Obama and its moral of "Don't vote for Obama, he'll ruin America!" reeks of It Will Never Catch On.
  • As of 2021, Tat is now pushing anti-vaccination messages with a similar level of subtlety as the rest of the comic.

Feels good, don't it?

I feel like at this point the whole comic is an Author Tract, so having an Anvilicious example may not even be necessary. He's not delivering heavy-handed aesops, he's writing a story to push his social views, same as people like Jack Chick.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 10th 2022 at 7:53:01 AM

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Are we supposed to remove it then?

Feels good, don't it?

I don't actually know. I'm leaning towards a cut, but it is an audience reaction and I guess it's theoretically possible for an Author Tract to not be anvilicious? Maybe?

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

If we are keeping it, should we reword it in a less inflammatory manner?

Feels good, don't it?

Probably. If the problems flare up again, we may need to lock the page, but for now rewording it is all we need.

I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.

I'll see if I can rewrite it later, unless someone else wants to beat me to the punch.

Feels good, don't it?

Screw it, not only am I rewriting it, I'm trimming and condensing it.

Feel free to provide input.

• Anvilicious: Since the early 2010s, Sinfest has been decidedly less subtle in how it platforms the author's views, especially regarding the author's "Trans & Sex Worker Exclusionary Radical Feminist" views, but also regarding the author's negative emotions towards political correctness. In May 2018, the author used Zombies as an allegory for prostitution and sex work, before eventually evolving the story into a wider potshot at political correctness in general, lampooning the Trans demographic in particular. In 2021, the author negatively compared vaccination to organized religion.

Edit: If anyone has any objections to the above replacement entry, comment by 2pm Toronto time, or forever hold your peace.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 11th 2022 at 1:31:27 PM

Feels good, don't it?

I'm fine with it.

I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.

Thanks, Burke. Since nobody else objects, I'll add it to the page.

Feels good, don't it?

Round 2:

• Strawman Has a Point:
  • Unwittingly or not, Slick does point out one of many complaints people have about the Sisterhood in this strip; namely, that Monique's characterization has drastically changed since their introduction.
  • In "Victim Blaming" Slick (clumsily) points out that if you say things to rile people up, they're going to get riled up. If he'd just suggested making the same points but in a more nuanced fashion, rather than an Anvilicious one, it might have gotten through.
  • Despite Squig getting Third Wave Feminism completely wrong, he does point out that many women see the sisterhood's decrying of femme traits and open sexuality as oppression to be outdated. The point of the movement is to allow women to be able to wear and act however they feel like without being labelled as a slut or being victim-blamed or say, someone depicting a female politician as a pig in drag.
  • This strip portraying all who miss old 'Nique does point out she has lost her old playfulness.
  • Slick sings cheerfully about misogyny, and then overreacts to a protest sign carried by Violet (one of the Sisterhood) and calls her a hater. The problem is that Violet earlier cheered out for the death of all men, making Slick coincidentally accurate in his overreaction.
  • The Devil is completely correct in his accusation that the Sisterhood sabotaged the Fembots factory and that the Fembots were perfectly safe consumer products before that.
  • While self-destructing a walking weapon when she began to refuse orders was pretty harsh, it was easily the lesser evil given the track record of these robots when left to their own devices. The civilian model was irrational and ill-tempered, so imagine what a military model with the same personality could do. Of course, depending on your viewpoint they may not be so irrational and ill-tempered, but this discussion and others closely related to it are better off discussed on other sites. In terms of ethics, they represent another argument altogether.
  • A non-Sisterhood related strip shows the Dragon in a confrontation with Sam in his mecha over a polluting factory, which he was planning on destroying. The narrative tries to depict Sam as a hypocrite by saying he's the one who is the real threat, due to the pollution caused by the factory. However, dragon's planned actions do count as eco-terrorism, due to the fact that he was going to destroy private property with innocent workers in it.

Do these entries also need to be made less…*ahem* infernal?

Feels good, don't it?

Wait, what's wrong with them?

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

I think these questions would go really easily if pointed what specifically is inflamatory and a rewite suggestion right away.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

I don't know what, if anything, needs to be changed, TBH. I'm asking for help determining if there are any ROCEJ violations.

Edit: Let's take the convo here.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 11th 2022 at 5:26:55 AM

Feels good, don't it?

From WMG.You Tube:

• Notice how updates that replace one thing at YouTube with another or remove something outright get announcements beforehand, whereas fixes and updates where something is added without removing something else (such as custom thumbnails for everybody who signs up from that point onward) are put in quietly. I think this is because the staff at YouTube are just as unhappy as the users when certain changes are made, and the announcements are actually warnings ahead of time, when they hope that user outcry will cause the upper management at Google to change their minds.
  • It makes so much sense.

This a joke WMG parodying the Book Ends trope.

• You say it's a joke, but really, this is the best possible last video on YouTube.

That, and the Federal Trade Commission wouldn't stop bugging them about COPPA, and because Google forgot YouTube Kids exists.

• It sure didn't work. The AVGN is still on board and You Tube Poop has not slowed down.

[YouTube] will Make a new series to assemble the popular YouTubers for a tv series

---

Is any of this kosher?

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 14th 2022 at 11:44:15 AM

Feels good, don't it?

Thinking no more than the entirety of WMG.Real Life.

Edited by Amonimus on Dec 14th 2022 at 7:45:40 PM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

First and third WMG in particular for the 'Tube sounds pretty complainy, in my opinion.

RL WMG also needs a deep clean, but I digress.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 14th 2022 at 2:15:12 PM

Feels good, don't it?

WMG.Real Life is a weird one because the whole Real Life area is basically JFF and meant to be completely tongue-in-cheek. None of it is meant to be a serious theory about reality (or at least, that's the excuse)

While a few of the YT ones are harmless, others are definitely there just to complain about the site.

Edited by WarJay77 on Dec 14th 2022 at 2:17:24 PM

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

I will cut the following as complaining:

• Notice how updates that replace one thing at YouTube with another or remove something outright get announcements beforehand, whereas fixes and updates where something is added without removing something else (such as custom thumbnails for everybody who signs up from that point onward) are put in quietly. I think this is because the staff at YouTube are just as unhappy as the users when certain changes are made, and the announcements are actually warnings ahead of time, when they hope that user outcry will cause the upper management at Google to change their minds.
  • It makes so much sense.

That, and the Federal Trade Commission wouldn't stop bugging them about COPPA, and because Google forgot YouTube Kids exists.

• It sure didn't work. The AVGN is still on board and You Tube Poop has not slowed down.

Feels good, don't it?

x5 Something similar exists on Nebula.tv (though not with all YouTubers creating a single video together), which is a paid subscription service featuring popular educational YouTubers and Nebula.tv is owned by Curiosity Stream.

Edited by Nen_desharu on Dec 14th 2022 at 9:45:24 AM

Kirby is awesome.

Er, what similar thing exists?

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

(x3) I'm leaning on cutting those for complaining.