Cleanup. Yes, again.: Getting Crap Past The Radar

I know that there are a couple of threads on the topic of cleaning up this article. A few times already, people have gone through it to clean it up. Sadly, it needs it again, and with a bit more attention paid to the main article itself.

There are two major problems with it. One, as mentioned in other areas, is that some people have absurdly dirty minds and see innuendo everywhere, even if it isn't there. It almost reminds me of socialist theories on media criticism, except that instead of always seeing a class struggle, the tropers in question always see sex.

The other is that I think some people don't quite understand where the radar sorts things. Here's two examples from the video game section:

• In Bionic Commando, not only is the villain at the end obviously Adolf Hitler (who calls you a "damn fool"), but when you kill him you get a close-up portrait of his head graphically exploding. Amazingly considering this is a Nintendo game from the heavily censored 1980's.

Ignoring subsequent Natter, this is a solid example - it lists the censorship mores that it theoretically should have applied (1980's-era Nintendo, who ordinarily were strict about removing blood and cursing, and who generally heavily enforced No Swastikas) and how the game got around it.

• Blaz Blue Continuum Shift... where to begin. Perhaps the ESRB just didn't review the console version, since the story mode seems to love this. Heavy cursing (to the point that only the F bomb and racial slurs are the only things not heard), EXCELLENT use of Calling Your Attacks to censor out one particular conversation (similar to the first game's GIGANTIC TAGER!!! to the point that the same character is speaking), and more than enough suggestive humor to keep you laughing for awhile. Thing is, it's only a T rated game.

Putting aside an excessive use of capitalization, this is a poor example. The fact is, all of the examples given are acceptable in a game rated T (which, comparatively, is a PG-13 edging into an R). That didn't get anything past the radar - all of that appropriately fits into a T rating. It's not like there's tons of gore, nudity, depicted sex, F-bombs, real life slurs, or any of the markers the ESRB looks for when granting an M rating.

My suggestiong is twofold. One, interested tropers (such as myself) will go in and remove the Not An Example examples. Two, we rewrite the trope page to add more specificity. I'll offer up my own example here, and let Wiki Magic handle the rest:

Please note that ratings and intended audience must be kept in mind. Something intended for an audience of five-year olds received much more stringent attention from censors than something for teenagers - what qualifies as Getting Crap Past The Radar in the former work may be simply accepted at face value in the latter. Consequently, please keep the Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgment in mind when adding examples.

For further clarification, we might also want to put on subpages what ratings, if any, mean (such as noting that the ESRB's E, PEGI's 3+, and CERO's A are roughly equivalent, although the latter is wider than the other two). While regular cleanup of the Radar pages may be inevitable, I think this could both cut down on the frequency plus give stronger guidelines as to what needs cleanup.

edited 18th Oct '10 8:21:05 AM by 32_Footsteps

Would it be prudent to make it a namespace and kill all examples on the page?

it IS a namespace.

I knew it was a namespace. I just think we should nuke the examples.

Ugh... yeah, I've tried cleaning up some of the worse ones before, but they just grew back even worse- Spongebob Squarepants, for instance...

I'm definitely for "get rid of stuff like 'The Radar must've been asleep! Just look at all the swearing in this T rated game' and 'Hey, this guy said 'crap' in a kids show!'"

EDIT: Re nuking the mainspace examples- against. The page was originally split because it was too long to add examples, not because of anything else. Plus, most of the bad examples aren't on it, but the actual show pages.

edited 18th Oct '10 9:26:27 AM by Wulf

It was actually because of problems with the Spongebob Squarepants examples (after both combing through the examples and previous discussions of cleaning up the trope) that led me to reach the conclusion that the description involved was not specific enough for what the trope actually involves.

I would prefer to use the term "surgery" rather than nuke. It's a valid trope that clearly describes part of the creative process (or its output, in some cases). We talk about nuking too much, and we'll end up with yet another locked trope because people couldn't be sensible about it. We should strive to avoid that.

I think a critical, jaundiced eye is required to add something to the pages. It needs more than an adolescent take on Freud to get on the page (sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, after all). It might even need some amount of explanation to show what the radar is.

If there are no objections, I'll begin a cleanup and add a paragraph about noting specifying what counts as under the radar later this evening.

With reference to including descriptions of the various classifications: we do have a page of them, but it's a bit difficult to read.

edited 21st Oct '10 1:55:24 AM by halfmillennium

^^^^^ I for one agree with this.

I think we need a bit of discussion on what does or does not need to go on the page, as well. I started trying to clean up some, and I'm noticing a lot of things like Curse Cut Short or just plain Parental Bonuses in the form of old movie references. I'm not sure whether or not to leave Curse Cut Short, and some of the movie references are definitely not for kids, but at the same time, not really trying to get snuck in.

Hmm... if you ask me "Getting Crap Past The Radar" would be referencing or showing things that are not appropriate for who the show is aiming for. For instance, saying "crap" in a TV-Y show would be Getting Crap Past The Radar. Saying it on a TV-PG show wouldn't. Alluring to sex, but not outright talking about it on a TV-PG show wouldn't really be Getting Crap Past The Radar. It's really more on a case by case basis.

For instance, saying "crap" in a TV-Y show would be Getting Crap Past The Radar. Saying it on a TV-PG show wouldn't.

The thing about that is, I don't think 'they said crap' in this show is this trope, ever. If you just come right out and say it, it's not really 'getting it past the radar'. More importantly, it's not even a swear word. Also, I'm pretty sure a lot of the shows on the list are Y-7, most definitely old enough to hear 'crap' once or twice.

Maybe the fact that we're using such a mild term in the title is why people are applying it to such mild things? I mean, crap is hardly a curse word these days. Renaming it to Getting Shit Past The Radar while it add vulgarity to the title also helps show that this really isn't for the minor stuff.

"Maybe the fact that we're using such a mild term in the title is why people are applying it to such mild things?" - shimaspawn

Not necessarily. If we used a term like "garbage" it would be even milder than the word "crap" (which is really the sense in which the word is applied) but would help get the point across. Though something more descriptive like "vulgarity" would help; but then it would be too restrictive, since it's not necessarily about vulgarity.

Come to think of it, this trope could use a more precise definition anyway. o.o

EDIT: As for the following Simpsons example:

◦In one episode a sign reads "Sneed's Feed and Seed" and in smaller letters "formerly Chuck's."

... how is that supposed to be Getting Crap Past the Radar at all?

edited 22nd Oct '10 12:00:19 PM by neoYTPism

"If you just come right out and say it, it's not really 'getting it past the radar'. More importantly, it's not even a swear word." Yes, but it is not an age appropriate word for TV-Y and the radars, if they caught it, would likely ask it be removed.

In one episode a sign reads "Sneed's Feed and Seed" and in smaller letters "formerly Chuck's."

... how is that supposed to be Getting Crap Past The Radar at all?

Change "Feed" and "Seed" so they start with the same letters but still rhyme with the old name.

edited 22nd Oct '10 12:13:51 PM by AndrewJ

^ And I still say that's a case of Innocent Innuendo, because there's no reason to believe that the store wasn't previously Chuck's Feed and Seed. There's only a joke if the viewer's mind is in the gutter.

Bit of a thread necro, I know, but I took a whack at de-nattering some of the main page, particularly the first person stuff that shouldn't be on any main page outside of quotes (which is why I didn't nuke the "I" in the Jeepers Media entry, as it's apparently a phrase used by JM themselves).

On the "Chuck's" joke, isn't that more Parental Bonus? Getting Crap Past the Radar is when the intended audience for the show is supposed to be able to figure it out.

I don't see how it can be a Parental Bonus, considering The Simpsons is a show for adults. If anything, Genius Bonus would be appropriate here.

Hmm, how about Stealth Pun then?

I think Stealth Pun works. I mean, that's pretty stealthy. I didn't get it until just now either.

I still don't get it >_>

I'll try to remove some of the sillier stuff later and see if I can get a more precise definition hammered out.

Sneed's Feed and Seed ... Chuck's Fuck and Suck

edited 5th Dec '10 4:21:19 PM by rodneyAnonymous

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