Needs Help (New crowner 30 December 2020): Acceptable Targets

Bump?

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

That might work, though maybe we should wait for more input.

(Honestly, I kind of regret making the crowner for this thread due to all the confusion that came up after it was called.)

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Which NRLEP subpage would be appropriate for Acceptable Targets and its subtropes? NoRealLife.Too Controversial, I think?

I'm back!

Sounds good.

I'd like to apologize for all this.

So can we start cleaning up examples then? We can start with the RL examples and figure out IU examples later.

UPDATE: Per ATT, I'm bringing to remove RL examples. Does this mean we should cut it from YMMV?

Questions about the following:

• YMMV.Mobile Suit Gundam SEED: Misogynistic and racist Muruta Azrael is the show's only Hate Sink and runs a discrimination-based terrorist organization.
• My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic (IDW) Issue 46 to 47: Politicians, particularly of the self-made and self-serving variety.

Are these non-IU due to being "fictional representation of an RL group" (misogynists, racists, terrorists politicians)? OR IU as "fictional group (...) used as a stand-in for an RL one"?

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Sep 8th 2020 at 5:07:31 AM

I always thought this trope was for things like the church scene in Kingsman: The Secret Service (i.e. if it was any other kind of religious group getting massacred the film would have received more backlash).

The five best Superman writers are Dan Jurgens, Jeph Loeb, Geoff Johns, Kurt Busiek, and Peter J. Tomasi.

From YMMV.Phantom Strider:

• Millenials tend to get frequently targeted in some of his videos.

I used to watch his stuff religiously and haven't seen a single jab against millenials. If anything, it's quite the opposite, he himself is in his early thirties and always treats younger people's opinions respectfully, even if he doesn't agree.

If anything, he rather makes fun at "executives" who try to pander to "the youths". Cut it.

I'd like to apologize for all this.

Can't, just wanted to point this out.

Bump again. Have the pages been cleaned for non-In-Universe examples? Also, as the pages have been made IUEO, they have been removed from YMMV.

I'm back!

None of us even knows what "in universe" means in this context.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Even though I made the crowner, I'm also not sure how to handle this, since I was just adding options based on what was suggested elsewhere in the thread. I know I suggested it myself in the 2017 thread (though I completely forgot I did until I looked at it again this year); I was new to ATT and the forums, and I feel that my wiki and forum skills have improved significantly since three years ago, and stuff I said then won't necessarily apply today.

(That said, I kind of regret making the crowner.)

Edited by GastonRabbit on Nov 25th 2020 at 3:37:15 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

I actually found an in-universe example listed on the main work page on Shortpacked!:

• Acceptable Hobby Targets: In-Universe. For Malaya, it seems every hobby is something worthy of total derision. At one point, she put the moves on Leslie, seemingly without being aware she's a die-hard sci-fi fan.

And number 3 in Synchronicity's post is how I often see Acceptable Targets used on YMMV pages.

Edited by ccorb on Nov 26th 2020 at 9:33:39 AM

Rock'n'roll never dies!

I'd say 3 is the best fit as well. And it poses the simplest fix of moving such to main as that the work portrays them that way an objective fact (save for Once Acceptable Targets who nature would keep it YMMV). Take That! is different in it's a one off moment while AC is a consistent portrayal.

Any problems with that?

Another thing I should do is take Unacceptable Targets and Once Acceptable Targets to TRS. I've seen the former used as "This show made fun of someone with PTSD, And That's Terrible".

Also by doing a check of a few wicks of Once Acceptable Targets, it seems like people are using it to list Values Dissonance for works that are less than 20 years old.

Edited by ccorb on Nov 27th 2020 at 8:24:47 AM

Rock'n'roll never dies!

I think I may have already said this a while back, but reason I didn't put Once Acceptable Targets and Unacceptable Targets on the crowner is because they didn't have wick checks in the opening post, so I felt that it made more sense to restrict it to the categories that were looked at in the opening post's wick checks.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

We can't decide what In-Universe means for this trope. It is simply too broad.

I'm back!

I almost wonder if we should just rerun the crowner without IUEO as an option.

I was thinking of running a crowner about removing from In-Universe Examples Only. Here are the types of examples we would need to consider:

• Examples where a work treats a fictional group as an acceptable target.
• Examples where a work treats a Real Life group as an acceptable target.
• Examples where a character treats a fictional group as an acceptable target.
• Examples where a character treats a Real Life group as an acceptable target.

I will presume that No Real Life Examples, Please! will mean no examples where a real person treats a group as an acceptable target.

I'm back!

Another option would be to redirect to Take That! or disambiguate between Author Tract and Take That!

Rock'n'roll never dies!

I think that would be a good idea. Personally, I think it should still be objective, and it seems like nobody has a problem with the NRLEP status (but correct me if I'm wrong on that), and it's just the IUEO part that's been causing confusion.

I've never understood why it was YMMV (since it's about how the targets are treated by the works themselves), and if the 2017 thread is anything to go by, it's only YMMV because a whopping two people said it should be, and I'm guessing that was from when there was a dedicated thread for making pages YMMV (like the still-open thread for making pages Trivia) instead of requiring TRS. I think the lack of discussion before making Acceptable Targets YMMV is analogous to how Fan Nickname was made Trivia (instead of YMMV) due to a brief discussion with questionable reasoning, in contrast to recent discussion about how Fan Nickname should be moved from Trivia to Audience Reactions.

Edit: I should probably clarify that I don't know where the discussion that made Acceptable Targets YMMV took place (i.e., which thread on which part of the forums), or when it took place, so I can't link to it (otherwise I would have provided a link).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 29th 2020 at 1:01:21 PM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Perhaps a crowner to determine what IUEO would mean in this context? I don't know, this is gonna be really complicated.

Maybe we should have a crowner to decide whether it should be IUEO in the first place, and if the crowner is in favor of keeping it IUEO, then we could have another crowner to decide what counts as in-universe.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

I don't think a crowner would help there. It's not like we have a lot of things we're deciding between. Nobody seems to have any idea what UIEO could possibly mean here.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness