Misused: Eldritch Abomination

(A previous Repair Shop thread is here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1332301640054027500 but is about redirects, not examples)

This page is rapidly devaluing the description "eldritch" with examples of monsters that are too comprehensible. For example, Pride from FMA: Brotherhood is just a shadowy tentacle monster/tentacle-y shadow monster full of eyes. Those are common morifs in eldritch things, but Pride is too well-explained to be considered incomprehensible. The explanations are a spoiler, but Pride is explained. Same with the other homunculi. Gluttony's stomach is an infinite pocket dimension? That breaks geometry, but it does so in a very simply-defined way that's easy to grasp (or, at least, only as impossible to grasp as the completely mundane infiniteness of the universe). The justification for "Father" is based almost entirely on his appearance.

The pokemon examples are listed as just being "delightfully creepy", which is, I would hope, not the definition of "eldritch" we're going for. Then it just lists the Physical Gods of the pokemon 'verse. Dialga and Palkia's movie fight caused some Negative Space Wedgie, but it was Negative Space Wedgie that was 1) very easily explained by the human characters so the children in the audience will comprehend what's going on, and 2) solved by a little boy just telling the alleged "Eldritch Abominations" to knock it off and clean up their mess (they do).

Arceus still qualifies as eldritch due to its baffling egg-making Mind Screw ritual (which is up to interpretation, but may have involved re-creating the universe from the ground up to get to a universe that's identical in every way to the previous one, except with one more egg, and any mindset by which that's the best way to produce offspring is an incomprehensible one to me). Giratina is the Dimension Lord to an Eldritch Location and has to shift to A Form You'reMoreComfortableWith to exist in the normal world, so it gets a pass, too. For some reason, Unown — the most eldritch thing in the setting — was not even mentioned on the page until I added it just now.

These are only two of the problem examples on this page, and I figured I shouldn't unilaterally start taking a hatchet to such a huge directory's bad examples.

edited 3rd Nov '16 9:41:44 PM by Pig_catapult

There was a previous thread and crowner here.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

The word "eldritch" doesn't mean "incomprehensible" or "unexplained." It means "otherworldly," with connotations of "weird," "spooky" and "uncanny."

There are certainly Pokemon that could be described as such.

That's only half the definition. The other half is "abomination", (a thing or person deemed abominable)

Abominable: "Worthy of, or causing, abhorrence, as a thing of evil omen; odious in the utmost degree; very hateful; detestable; loathsome; execrable"; "unequivocally detestable"

There may be Pokemon that aren't popular, but I don't know of any that are "loathesome" or "unequivocally detestable". They may be Eldritch by its most general definitions, but they are not Abominations. So they aren't Eldritch Abominations

edited 20th Nov '16 7:48:11 AM by Madrugada

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.

Quite possibly. I haven't watched Pokemon for years, so I'm not sure how much hate the newer villain mons attract. I was only responding to the claim of devaluing "eldritch."

Now I have a question: Where should benevolent or neutral eldritch beings go to (trope wise)? Such things do exist, right?

We don't need justice when we can forgive. We don't need tolerance when we can love.

Well, there's Giratina, a Physical God-tier Pokemon that by its own in-universe description and exhibited traits does more or less fulfill the "abomination" part of Eldritch Abomination (though probably a Lovecraft Lite version, considering the Lighter and Softer nature of the setting due to the franchise being mainly aimed at children).

edited 25th Nov '16 4:04:41 PM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

Dear Getta...

If God being listed on these pages as an example isn't a mistake, then temperament isn't a factor. Cthulhu does not stop being Cthulhu when you have tea with him.

Eldritch Abomination + Gentle Giant is the trope overlap, there.

I hope this was helpful for you.

I'm not sure Lovecraft's own creations, at least as portrayed in popular culture, would fit the OP's definition of "eldritch". At this point, Cthulhu's pretty comprehensible.

In regards to Pokemon, I think there's a case to be made for some of the commented out Abominations.

• Kyurem is a personification of absence that takes the form of a shriveled dragon (fitting the eldritch part) and it is rumored to eat people and is one of the few Pokemon to physically threaten the player character, fitting the abominable requirement.
• Darkrai is a living shadow who's mere presence can cause people to end an eternal nightmare, a textbook eldritch quality. In addition, Darkrai is shown to be feared as an abomination in the anime, Pokémon Ranger: Shadows of Almia and Pokémon Mystery Dungeon.

Also, I'd like to note that there is a sub-trope for the benign Eldritch Abomination, the misleadingly named Did You Just Have Tea With Cthulhu.

There was a line in a much older version that went something like, "The key to it being this trope and not Our Monsters Are Weird is incomprehensibility. If giant squid from the stars descended upon Earth every full moon, they're not this. We may not like the giant locusts, but we'd have seen enough of them to know what we're fighting."

Prepare to joust, buzzard bait.

I assume the above description is no longer on the page for a reason, probably to distinguish this trope from You Cannot Grasp the True Form. If this trope did strictly require examples to meet the above description, MorganWick is right in that even Cthulhu would not be considered an Eldritch Abomination.

edited 11th Dec '16 4:13:48 PM by DustSnitch

I think part of the issue with this trope is that we don't have a "freaky being" trope other than the Cosmic Horror item. One of the key aspects of items like Cthulhu, Yog-Sothoth and the like is that they are non-communicative balls of freakiness whose motives, actions and mindset are incomprehensible. But a lot of the examples are merely freaky in one way or another.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman

I think Our Monsters Are Weird covers lesser weirdness.

And You Cannot Grasp the True Form for greater weirdness.

Something to keep in mind is that if our definition of the term doesn't match the one used elsewhere (if there is one), then we will continue to see incessant misuse. And in this case, I think there definitely is a definition used elsewhere, even if it's somewhat vague.

Speaking words of fandom: let it squee, let it squee.

I've noticed a lot of decay for this, where the trope will be used for anything that has a slightly weird or unusual appearance, but often are quite mundane beyond that. They don't feature the whole "Do not fit reality" "Cause Madness by seeing them" "Cannot be understood" aspect the first paragraph emphasizes. It's become a synonym on the wiki for either "Is really powerful" "Is not from this world" "Is really powerful"

Some examples of misuse from the wicks:

• Asterix: You actually never seen "The Beast", and it's never presented anything more than a fearsom beast that lives in a cave from which no one returns.
• Characters.Avatar The Last Airbender Team Avatar: It's mentioned that Aang "has the powers of an eldritch abomination". He ... doesn't? He has 4 types of bending, and reincarnation along with the ability to channel his past life coz he's merged with a spirit. It's all well explained. And even BEFORE Ravaa was introduced, there was nothing Eldritch Abomination about Aang.
  • In various pages of the Franchise, Koh is described as an Eldritch Abomination. He's not. He's a spirit. That steals faces.
• Batman: Supporting Cast: Bat-Mite is described this way. He really isn't. He's Omnipotent and a reality warper, but he's not impossible to understand. He's rather child-like and simple.
• Characters/Borderlands: The Destroyer is listed simply because he comes from another dimension. which he does. and he's a giant mount of flesh with an eye and tentacles. But he's never presented as unknowable or anything the sort. In fact his nature as basically nothing more than a random monster full of tentacles is mocked in the sequels.
• Disney/Fantasia: Chernabog is listed. He's really just a demon isn't he? The rest of his tropes treat him as such. Not as some unknowable creature from beyond.

Just a few examples I remembered off the top of my head.

As far as things like the destroyer go where there's clearly a Cosmic Horror influence on their design, albeit in a Lovecraft Lite fashion, I think there should be a seperate trope for that; distinct from monsters are weird in the sense that it covers creatures with designs and attributes that draw inspiration from cosmic horror without embracing the "unknowable and incomprehensible" parts of the trope and essentially to the Eldritch Abomination trope what Lovecraft Lite is to the Cosmic Horror trope.

I don't think Our Monsters Are Weird necessarily covers it, because something can be weird without being evocative of Lovecraft in its design or using Cosmic Horror elements.

edited 11th Feb '17 5:21:44 PM by CaptainCapsase