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I'm fairly sure "Powerwise Only" means that it is not Adaptational Wimp. Adaptational Wimp, though the description is oddly worded in places, does not seem to permit non-absolute examples. Superman in this case appears to be the same in most ways, just not as powerful. Thus, he is not an adaptational wimp, as this is not an absolute case.
(Side note, I believe that is a misuse of Up To Eleven, so even if the example ends up remaining, that should probably be removed)
I agree that his comic book counterpart has always been Strong as They Need to Be, so he's a hard character to make an Adaptational Wimp entry for. I feel like he'd have to be significantly weaker to apply.
Adaptational Superpower Change might be more fitting.
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
No, a minor power decrease does not make an Adaptational Wimp. And it's especially hard to judge DCAU Superman in this regard because he never showcases the real extent of his powers. We only get a glimpse of his true strength when he delivers his "World of Cardboard" Speech in the finale, which retroactively paints his previous struggles as him trying to not lose control of his powers whenever he used them.
Quoting from the trope page: "this is not about characters who suffered a minor power decrease or had their most badass moment cut from the adaptation. It is when their usefulness, agency, and contribution to the plot is significantly reduced."
It sounds like the powered-down Superman is still useful, shows agency and contributes to the plot. So he's not an adaptational wimp.
Plus isn't he still one of the most powerful characters in the setting? If an Adaptational Wimp remains the strongest guy around, what does that make everybody else?
Even if you make a case for AW by bringing up Superman's appearances in the early episodes of Justice League, the finale of Justice League Unlimited retroactively justifies them as Superman attempting not to lose control of his powers.
^^The way I understand the trope definition, if he’s still the strongest guy around, he can’t be an AW.
Like I said before, this debate has been going on for years now and I'm officially sick and tired of it. So, do we have a consensus?
Looks like it, everyone seems to back it not being AW.
Well, I'm deleting it then, and just so we're clear, I never want to see this debate get brought up again.
Much of the problem here is that AW (and mirroring it, Adaptational Badass) is itself interpreted in at least three different ways by tropers: being physically weaker or less skilled, being more cowardly, or having less impact on the plot (this last one can be difficult to pin down if the plot is also changed a lot). Mina Harker from The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen is a case in point: in the film she has vampire powers, but shows far less initiative and leadership than in the comics, and in many ways it is braver to fight without superpowers. So she has a case either way.
However I feel here that AW doesn't apply because Adaptational Superpower Change would cover it, and even that isn't clear-cut since the comics are quite loose about it.
Stories don't tell us monsters exist; we knew that already. They show us that monsters can be trademarked and milked for years.
I personally believe that the DCAU Superman undergoes this trope since the writers deliberately did this.
^ This discussion was settled nearly three years ago, and the OP said they didn't want the debate brought up again. What was the point of bumping this query?
I'm sorry. It is just that someone named Estvyk created a new Adaptational Wimp entry and posted it on DCAU Superman's page, and I believe that he made some pretty good points in his entry.
Edited by Thetropemaster101
It's already been decided by prior consensus that it doesn't count. It needs to be removed and the person who added it needs to be messaged.
Indeed. Leave a comment linking to this ATT if necessary. If new entries in the franchise bring up new points, then another thread can be started. I'll close this.
The debate about whether or not DCAU: Superman's page is an Adaptational Wimp has been going on for a few years now and I'm sick and tired of the AW being removed and re-added to DCAU Superman's page over and over and over again. Since I just want this debate to end and move on with my life, let's fix this mess once and for all.
The current AW entry in Superman's page says "Powerwise only. Here Superman is basically the same characterwise as his mainstream comicbook counterpart and they both are the Big Good of their respective worlds. It's just that this Superman isn't nearly as strong as the comic version as he needs an air supply while traveling for long periods of time in space or a ship for interstellar distances,strains a bit when he has handle extremely heavy things like buildings or tanks, and could be badly hurt by a standard nuke hitting him. Comic Superman is The Needless, can fly faster than light while traveling between galaxies, can move entire planets, and tank a supernova while only receiving a minor concussion. (This isn't even silver-age feats but modern Superman feats in the comics. Silver-age Superman's power was so absurdly high that he could do things like break the barriers between universes, dimensions, and time.) The first season of Justice League especially subjects Superman to The Worf Effect to allow other leaguers to take the spotlight."
I removed it because being an AW means that a character's effectiveness, agency and contributions to the story are lessened, not their raw power. This entry argues for AW because Superman isn't nearly as powerful as his comic book counterpart, even though A) comic book Superman hasn't been around longer than DCAU Superman, meaning he had a longer time to develop his powers and skils and B) Superman's powers in the comics are pretty damn all over the place, so finding a baseline about his powers in the comics is borderline impossible. Troper princevalleyyent says that I'm objectively wrong about AW and that I should read the trope. Well, I did, that's why I'm here.
This discussion has been going on
for some
time now
and I just want it to end. What do you think?