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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
#179301: Aug 21st 2019 at 4:38:34 AM

[tup]Solon, Thales, Jimmy, Pratt
[tdown]Zodiac

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#179302: Aug 21st 2019 at 4:58:37 AM

No to the Zodiac Killer, retaining my no for Brixton. Yes to Pratt.

Edited by Scraggle on Aug 21st 2019 at 6:08:25 AM

KingofNightmares Since: Sep, 2016 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#179303: Aug 21st 2019 at 5:05:26 AM

[tdown] Zodiac

[tup] Everyone else

Edited by KingofNightmares on Aug 21st 2019 at 5:06:24 AM

—signature not found—
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#179305: Aug 21st 2019 at 5:36:11 AM

I'm more lenient about keeping Brixton given Age's comments.

Bullman "The Juice is Loose." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"The Juice is Loose."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#179307: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:23:16 AM

Same. But I will reserve the right to revisit him when I see the film in a few months. I have zero desire to do so right now in theaters.

Yes to Pratt and Clown Face's, nay to Zodiac.

  • Dominator: the Lord Desecrator is a treacherous usurper in hell pursuing his former subordinate Dominator for a key that will allow him access to other worlds to conquer. Inspiring a cult to commit mass sacrifice in his name, Desecrator is also the sire of the half-demon Hellkatt, who he wastes no time in trying to murder as 'useless' to him. When summoned, Desecrator goes on a killing spree across the world, burning entire cities and attempts to devour earth itself, hoping to spread the pain of hell all through the cosmos.
  • Black Tiger: 'The Boss' is a human trafficker, along with hired mercenary Black Jaguar. With the prohibition of slavery, the Boss turns to Natives to profit, killing through their villages and taking the women and young girls to sell as sex slaves. Black Jaguar eagerly assists in this endeavor, killing a multitude of innocent US Marshals, while being a client of the girls himself. After he betrays and guns down heroine Black Tiger, Black Jaguar is interrupted attempting to rape a slave, when Black Tiger comes to save the slaves, prompting the duo to decide to burn a native village to the ground in retribution. Even when caught, Black Jaguar betrays and murders the boss to pass himself off as having infiltrated the Boss's operation- an excuse that fools Black Tiger for not even a second.
  • Batman: Karl Branneck is one half of a duo known as the Dumpster Killer, and the more dominant of the pair compared to the sycophantic Vito. Karl chooses well-off women, hunting them down, before torturing them, raping them and killing them painfully before leaving their remains in dumpsters for others to find. Provoking Batman's attention after a friend of Bruce Wayne's is murdered, Karl obtains ten victims before growing worried about media attention and murders Vito. After being acquitted, Karl plans to resume his rape, torture and murder spree, targeting two more women, only to fall into the trap of a victim's sister, and dies cursing women in general, showing that in Gotham, one does not need a costume or powers to be pure evil.
  • The Fury: Ben Childress is the supposed friend of the hero Peter, but is in truth a devious sociopath who runs the PSI program to find psychic children to turn into weapons. Childress proceeds to murder their families and abduct the children, torturing them and conditioning them to break them down and leave nothing but psychic assassins for him, gaslighting them relentlessly and destroying anything close to them. When Peter survives and tries to save his son Robin, Childress tries to have him killed and even engineers a confrontation between them before plotting to take the heroine Gillian and mold her into his new weapon by the end.
  • The Hard Way: Wesson is the chief enforcer for Drug Lord Pinero. A man who claims he loves killing for the satisfaction is brings him, Wesson is introduced slaughtering a company of soldiers, and torturing the leader before executing him. Wesson happily kills any in the nearby villages who resist before trying to murder the heroes, or to abduct and torture any member of the squad he can. When the fighting comes to a village by the end, Wesson shows no remorse in having civilian homes fired upon to kill his opponents.
  • Fire Emblem: 3 Houses
    • Thales is the chief member of 'Those Who Slither in the Dark,' and a ruthless schemer dedicated to achieving the power of the gods. Approving ghastly experiments on multitudes of innocents to destroy their minds, Thales initiated a massacre of nobles to blame an innocent land, resulting in the near genocide of its people, while manipulating the war of the Flame Emperor in order to tear the country apart and destroy its people. Having his own forces kill those they can to revive the monstrous Nemesis and unleash him on the world, Thales even spitefully tries to nuke his own base and the last stronghold of his people to kill the heroes upon defeat.
    • Solon, Thales's mad scientist, is responsible for horrendous experiments on many innocent people, even children, to destroy them and twist them into monstrosities. Having murdered and replaced kind librarian Tomas to infiltrate the church of Seiros, Solon helps to manipulate the war, and is responsible for driving the people of Remire Village insane to see them rip one another apart, just for the sick satisfaction of it.

Edited by Lightysnake on Aug 21st 2019 at 6:24:28 AM

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#179308: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:34:36 AM

Fire Emblem duo go at the end of the page?

Also, someone please gimme a good pothole for Colonel Stuart besides Big Bad.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#179310: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:44:21 AM

Maybe I'll just use NSWIE for Stuart.

Also, for that manga one, okay if I do this?

"The Boss" and Black Jaguar are Human Traffickers.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
VeryVileVillian (Apprentice)
#179311: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:49:16 AM

For Stuart, we can pothole him with something close to military crazy soldier guy.

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#179312: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:50:44 AM

So.._ I was just looking at the in game enemy descriptions for Metal Wolf Chaos and apparently Hawk's big missile wouldn't just destroy America but "shatter the planet" itself.

Should Hawk's entry be ipdated with this? Cause oh boy does it really add to his cartoony madness.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#179313: Aug 21st 2019 at 6:58:59 AM

[tup] to Thales, Trapper, and Jim, and switching back to a [tup] on Brixton (though I will watch the movie eventually, so that could change).

[tdown] to the Zodiac Killer (funny, I was thinking about him earlier, though I haven't seen the film).

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#179314: Aug 21st 2019 at 7:01:17 AM

Colonel Kilgore for Stuart ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
VeryVileVillian (Apprentice)
#179315: Aug 21st 2019 at 7:03:49 AM

[up]Either that or Sociopatic Soldier.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#179316: Aug 21st 2019 at 7:20:54 AM

Sociopathic Soldier works.

I've GOT TO stop procrastinating and get to playing Metal Wolf Chaos.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
MinisterOfSinister From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye! from In the Hall of the Mountain King Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: What is this thing you call love?
From 'Ell's 'eart Oi stab at ye!
#179317: Aug 21st 2019 at 7:21:50 AM

[tdown] To Brixton. I'd say that times a billion if I could. I think he doesn't do enough to count and/or seems genuinely committed to Eteon's cause. I think he's completely overshadowed by the other Big Bads of the series; the only thing he has different is being a cyborg.

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#179318: Aug 21st 2019 at 8:15:37 AM

[tup] to Jim and Trapper. Abstain on Zodiac.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#179319: Aug 21st 2019 at 8:18:09 AM

Is it Desecrater or Desecrator? I've seen both. Lighty, if you still have the film...what do the credits say?

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#179322: Aug 21st 2019 at 8:31:45 AM

[tup]James "Jimmy" Auger

[tup] Jim Pratt

...Ha!

Edited by KazuyaProta on Aug 21st 2019 at 10:32:56 AM

Watch me destroying my country
KingofNightmares Since: Sep, 2016 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#179323: Aug 21st 2019 at 9:08:01 AM

The writeup for Sakaki has something I'd like to bring up

  • Sakaki was merely annoying and overzealous at first, but later revelations removed any kind of sympathy fans might have had for him. Specifically, the revelation that he had been manipulating and controlling AIDA behind the scenes, and that his ultimate goal was to use AIDA as mass mind control over all of humanity. But the biggest blow against him was his treatment of Atoli, who had long been one of his strongest supporters. Turns out he had met her on a suicide website, preyed on her fears about being alone and considered worthless, effectively brainwashed her into depending on him, and then Mind Raped her to bring out the power of her Epitaph. When all of his plans fail and he gets infected with AIDA himself, he then spends the first half of the final volume putting together a sadistic tournament for the sole purpose of making Haseo and the rest suffer (harming quite a few others in the process), and laughing at the pain he's causing.

The writeup uses italics near the end as emphasis. Is this allowed in writeups?

—signature not found—
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#179324: Aug 21st 2019 at 9:15:06 AM

In general, that's usually frowned upon.

Honestly though, the writeup itself...isn't great.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
KoopaKid17 Since: Dec, 2011
#179325: Aug 21st 2019 at 10:07:26 AM

For the Sonic the Hedgehog subsection, one detail has to be changed. Its entry for the SatAM version of Robotnik depicts Sonic as Charlie's son. Sonic is actually Charlie's nephew, and he refers to him as "Uncle Chuck".


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