During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Gentle Laborer
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
To the previous candidates except for Thanos and Saibot.
I have to ask, why on earth are there so many no votes for Thanos when no one is arguing for his inclusion? The most I've seen is a couple of comments saying his 2014 incarnation "comes closer" to it. (FWIW I think people are overselling the difference anyway but that's completely off-topic). I mean, there's nothing wrong with it, it just seems a little weird to me.
(One of the reasons I don't vote often in this thread is that there's usually a solid consensus on any character being discussed by the time I've read it, BTW).
Edited by nrjxll on May 10th 2019 at 4:09:07 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Short-Term Projects herald
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
to Noob-Saibot.
Not heinous enough and I still believe his moral agency is compromised. Just look at the other MK characters who became Revenants. Suddenly all the former heroes were on-board with Shinnok’s and Quan Chi’s plan of invading Earthrealm. And the moment Sub-Zero, Jax and Scorpion – who was a Revenant far longer than any other character – became humans again, they became a lot nicer and helped the good guys defending Earthrealm. Yes Noob is a Wraith and not a Revenant but it’s clearly established that being an undead corrupts you.
Goku Black
Also would this quote work from Mercy Thompson?
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Stagg
Delores.
King Olmec
... Pizarro.
I think it's handily to say that I'm Peruvian. I'm glad to have a version ot him counting.
And yeah. This certainly isn't Historical Villain Upgrade.
My only regret is not having see the series myself. Lighty, I can at least write a single line of his entry.
Edited by KazuyaProta on May 10th 2019 at 6:19:10 AM
Watch me destroying my country
The Draftsman of Doom
the previous 4 candidates. If I haven't said it already Bi Han.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 10th 2019 at 7:24:46 AM
Your friendly neighbourhood Spider-Man.
Ok, let's see... to Franklin, Greg Toblerone, Razaak, Gruul, Mordraneth, Pizarro and Menator (I used to watch that show as a kid... boy, have I forgotten a lot about it), Stagg and Winters.
Bi-han doesn't sound heinous enough.
Oh, and absolutely to MCU!Thanos, now and ever, in any form.
"The Juice is Loose."
Yes to Pizarro, Menator, Stagg and Winters.
Edited by Bullman on May 10th 2019 at 6:35:11 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Cross-wired freak
to everyone I missed
The MILF Virus
To everyone. The one that catches my attention the most is Stagg, never thought he would make the cut.
By the way, do you think trying to kill your own daughter is a unique heinousness standard? Because there's a person in my mind from Yakuza that's most evil crime is going all out in trying to kill his own kid who's less then 10 years old. Nobody else in the series as far as I am concern actually did this.
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Depends what his other crimes are. That may be enough to push him into CM territory, but by itself isn't enough.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
The MILF Virus
How about causing a Yakuza war and killing numerous innocent people in the cross fire just to get a whole lot of money stolen from him which he planned to use to take control over the Yakuza syndicate in his region and to kill his illegitimate daughter and her mother to keep his reputation clean?
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Hmm, that sounds fairly standard for the series, but trying to kill his own young daughter may push him into CM territory.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
A friend also argued that the alternate Thanos only wanted to wipe out everyone on Earth this time, but he was using comic context.
I’m actually gonna go against the grain and change to a tentative to alternate Thanos. He seems to learn everything that the present Nebula knows which would probably include sacrificing Gamorra and this time being okay with it, even though it’s not explicitly spelled out. He also is more about protecting his own pride and ego this time with his motivations. This is just how I feel though and it’s fine if no one else does.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 10th 2019 at 6:46:38 AM
Lizzid people!
Stagg.
Edited by AustinDR on May 10th 2019 at 6:34:38 AM
Enthusiastic yes to Winter
The Draftsman of Doom
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
He wasn't even effortposted. Nor should he be. For all the bad he does, he has redeeming qualities.
Thanos, I mean.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 10th 2019 at 11:55:57 AM
Your friendly neighbourhood Spider-Man.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
BTW, Stagg's voiced by Philip "Mr. White" Proctor.
Will the Cities duo go to AniManga or Western Animation?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lizzid people!
Uh...Age did suggest Stagg a few pages back. That was the only EP I read yesterday.
Edited by AustinDR on May 10th 2019 at 6:47:25 AM
Frankly I thought the bigger issue with alternate Thanos might be that his actions are influenced too much by learning about the present/regular one.
@Sky Was that directed to me? Yeah, I know there was no EP and a vote either way is not really called for. That vote is just how I feel now and is allowed to change later if I so desire.
@ACW: I'd say Anime if we have to choose one, but perhaps crossposted.
Might have a villain from a certain Nic Cage film between the rest of the Final Fantasy baddies (Zanbar, Ulraakah, Nazek, and so forth)
Edited by Lightysnake on May 10th 2019 at 6:53:49 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Crossposting works for me. Pizarro and the other dude are both from the original series, right?
Huh, I wonder which Cage movie we haven't covered.
How many FF baddies are left to effortpost?
Edited by ACW on May 10th 2019 at 9:57:26 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
Winters
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."