During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Chatwill
So in regards to the writeup for Scar from the play, this line I think could be cut as it doesn't exactly add to his villainy: "During the musical, Scar became more and more paranoid as time went by and he also felt that he was being tormented by his older brother even in death".
Edited by zcooper95 on Jul 17th 2018 at 5:45:05 AM
To Chatwill.
If Majora's been brought up so many times, wouldn't it fit to put him on Never Again?
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Sandaru and Chatwill
Just leaning on abstain but ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
towards Ishii
Yes to Sugita, Sandaru and Chatwill.
I'm fine with Majora going up on the NA list.
Yes to Chatwill, and now...
What's the work?
Blood fter Midnight is a short story o Fiction Press by our very own Therealjackieboy about report Bryan Cyon in 2039. Down on his luck and sent after a scoop, Bryan uncovers a murder...which seems to be the work of a serial killer, as it's the third such body missing its right arm...and things get a bit odd when he uncovers it might be a group effort. So...let's talk about the big bad. Kelvin
Who is Kelvin?
Kelvin is a cult leader, who leads a group dedicated to the cult of a demon known as Shadoth. Now, Kelvin lures in followers with luddite philosophy, preying on the distrust of new technology and its replacing the jobs of his people...so, demonic worship is the key to this, no? Now, initiating the killings, Kelvin learns Bryan is getting too close to the truth with his friend Vivian Potch, so he proceeds to lead his followers to attack the hospital when Bryan is there, massacring the people there and killing Vivian to taunt Bryan with her decapitated head. Introducing himself, and explaining things...Shadoth is contained by the power of one's right arm...and he has WAY more than three vicitms. In fact, Shadoth's altar is filled with dozens of right arms, each from a killing. With only one more arm needed, Kelvin slices off Bryan's and adds it to the collection. Kelvin then adds to his followers that....he doesn't quite really care about helping them and they can rot when he summons Shadoth to make himself the most feared person alive. ...and proceeds to execute all his followers. Unfortunately? Evil Is Not a Toy and Shadoth, once summoned, proceeds to eliminate Kelvin as well, before killing Bryan and commencing mass destruction.
Mitigating Qualities?
Nope, nothing. Kelvin is the most heinous person in story and vaults pass the baseline. He;s a manipulative, controlling dick who's a Serial Killer to summon a demon and wreak horrific destruction to make himself feared and powerful, with a lot of sadism behind it. He doesn't believe a word of his own rhetoric and makes that painfully clear.
easy keeper.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Chatwill and Kelvin
Edited by Bullman on Jul 17th 2018 at 5:13:49 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Chatwill and Kelvin. I'm also fine with Majora going on the Never Again list.
Chatwill and Kelvin.
I guess Majora can go to the Never Again List. While we’re at it should we add Ganondorf to the list as well?
Chatwell and Kelvin.
V
Chaltwell and Kelvin.
I saw this writeup on Heat
- Complete Monster: Waingro is a Psycho for Hire initially brought in as a newcomer to Neil McCauley's team to assist in an armored truck robbery. During the job, Waingro murders one of the guards for looking at him funny, necessitating the deaths of the other two guards to eliminate witnesses. His cohorts, disgusted by his actions, try to kill him, only for Waingro to escape and begin working for their enemy, Roger Van Zant. Waingro and Van Zant tip off the police in the middle of the crew's newest job, resulting in a massive shootout in the streets of LA. Waingro got this information by holding Trejo's wife hostage, only to viciously murder her afterwards, then mortally wound Trejo and leave him for dead. Waingro is also a Serial Killer who solicits underage prostitutes then bashes their skulls in.
This is generally a very good writeup, but I do think that the end is quite anticlimactic. Being a brutal Serial Killer of prostitutes is by far the worst thing about Waingro, and yet the writeup only briefly mentions it at the end. It was a while I watched the film, but could anyone who seen it more recently do a minor rewrite where the writeup focuses more on these brutal serial homicides?
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Shouldn't it be at the top atleast? Especially if it's barely mentioned
Edited by MenInGreyToBlak on Jul 17th 2018 at 2:47:53 PM
It's barely mentioned because the film barely mentions it. It's just thrown in there for one scene to make sure you know "Blimey, this chap's evil!"
Eh, keep the writeup as is. The movie really doesn't make a big deal about it and frankly the film could've done without it.
Yes to Kelvin and I'd also advocate we keep Wingro as is, the film uses him being a Serial Killer as a throwaway line and treats it as an add-on to his monstrosity, so I think having it at the end is fine.
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
to Kelvin.... And offtopic but I finished Houshin Engi manga...IMO it is one of teh
most underrated manga that i read as for now IMO 
...Though i rather keep Jyoka's writeup as it is and I agree with Lighty that the 2018 version of Jyoka, while still bad, ia a compressed version of herself so yeah
Edited by FriedWarthog on Jul 17th 2018 at 8:41:29 AM
I never got the impression Majora was even aware he was doing anything wrong. He just seemed like a demonic bratty little kid breaking toys to me.
Edited by HamburgerTime on Jul 17th 2018 at 8:55:42 AM
I think in that case, Fried, I'm fine hearing it out. If we know enough to know he's a killer and see the pattern of murder, I'd likely be good.
Chatwill
Kelvin. Again, I love it when One Of Us has a CM in a story to to their name.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Kelvin.
Congratulations Jackie.
Trust me. If my life plans goes well. We would have to use a folder for them (unless the minimun number becomes more than 10).
Chatwill
Edited by KazuyaProta on Jul 17th 2018 at 9:12:01 AM
Watch me destroying my country
By the way, I hear Shinryu finally got his in the recent Dissidia installment. Any updates there? I can't recall us discussing it, though I haven't played it myself so I was curious.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Shinryu's entry was updated with info from the new Dissidia shortly after it's release.
Edited by TommyFresh on Jul 17th 2018 at 7:17:07 AM
Derp, well, shows what I can remember.
Gentle Laborer
Chatwill and Kelvin
@Kazua
Me ? I tend to write a lot of my villains as CM's. I try to go three dimensional or sympathetic/humanized villains here and there without going to much in DILP territory. Let's just say if I actually posted my stories or got my works published I'd have monsters out the wazoo.
Edited by Beast on Jul 17th 2018 at 8:04:49 AM
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Another EP... I've been looking into some films from Canadian director and we've got a keep.
What's the setting?
Trapped is a 1982 thriller film, American-Canadian, revolving around a bunch of college students who drive up to Tennessee to go hiking... naturally, bad stuff ensues. The neck of the woods they find themselves in? Is home to a community of rednecks who operate under a firm fundamentalist law: protect them and theirs no matter what and make retribution painful and exact. The leader of this community is Henry Chatwill, a control freak redneck who the college students see torture a man to death... and then he sees them too.
Who is Chatwill? What has he done?
Chatwill (played by Henry Silva — my third keep to have been played by such, actually, and I imagine the guy still has a lot more) is a shotgun-toting hillbilly, Disproportionate Retribution on legs, who keeps a ruthless hold on his community through violence and fear. Chatwill has a tendency to beat anyone who questions his "law" half-to-death, intimidating everyone into obedience. Including his country-bumpkin wife, who he physically abuses every other scene or so... when Chatwill finds her with another man? Chatwill beats them both into a bloody pulp before dragging the lover out, painfully covering him in scalding hot tar, feathering him, running him out into the woods and terrorizing, and beating him to death. When the four kids see and try and report this? They learn this isn't the first incident with Chatwill having murdered another person a while ago for a similar transgression, lying about it to his people and bullying the town sheriff — his little brother — into keeping quiet.
Chatwill finds the kids, gathering them all up and deciding to murder all of them to keep word from leaking out and giving the man he appoints to kill them free reign to rape one of them. The kids are freed by one of the merciful rednecks, and Chatwill murders him in response, breaking his neck with the butt of his gun and capturing three of the kids. To lure the escapee, Roger, out, Chatwill brings them all back to his community and gleefully shouts out to Roger he's going to rape one of the girls, giving Roger incentive to seek help from the others who are utterly sickened by Chatwill who's now threatening to start murder all of them to cow them into submission. When one of Roger's friends from the outside comes, with literally no idea about what the situation is, Chatwill runs him down with his car and kills him. There's a chase around Chatwill's moonshine still (because of course he's a moonshiner), Chatwill tries to run Roger over with his truck and murder him with an axe, Roger douses him in boiling tar, sets him on fire, and leaves him to explode in his own alcohol refinery. Happy ending.
Any mitigating factors?
Mmm, no... Chatwill's one of those "preacher" types who initially says everything he does is under the "law" that supposedly protects his community, with a do-unto-others mentality about him. It's revealed by him, though? This is literally just to serve his own purposes. Chatwill has no problem killing his own and violating his own tenants so long as he's in charge.
Aside from that? Jack crap.
Conclusion?
Keep.
Thoughts?
Edited by Scraggle on Jul 17th 2018 at 5:35:14 AM