During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Gentle Laborer
Writeup for Bishop, place him next to the King and before Rook.
- Kamen Rider Kiva: Bishop, the Swallowtail Fangire, is King's calm, psychopathic right-hand man. A firm believer in the superiority of Fangires, Bishop informed the King of his wife's love for a human, resulting in Maya having her powers taken away from her. Trying to force Mio into embracing her fate as the new Queen, Bishop burns a Fangire in front of her when she refuses to kill him for having loved a human, later telling her that she must kill her Love Interest if she wants to be a true Queen. Under Taiga's orders, Bishop uses his powers to awaken Wataru's Fangire blood, almost making him murder his own friends. Seeing Mio as a failure, Bishop assassinates her and pins the blame on Wataru, fully intending on leaving him depressed. Proudly confessing his crimes to Taiga, Bishop is kicked out of the Checkmate Four and uses a magical crystal ball to drain the souls of multiple people. Planning on bringing the previous King back, Bishop revives the defeated Fangires and orders them to murder every human they come across, sacrificing his own soul to complete the ritual just so he could become one with the King and "destroy everything".
edited 16th Jun '18 2:25:58 PM by TheMadCr0w
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Alright, I got 45, and I'm working on them now so I can do Visual Novels tomorrow. Any more will likely go next week.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Mordo and Bishop.
New proposal!
What's the work?
Amon Saga- Tsuki no Miko is a manga by Ken Ishikawa concerning a warrior named Amon who descends from the moon to hunt down the wicked demon Princess Kaguya and demons like her....a short series, but the villain to discuss is not Kaguya (who has some redeeming qualities), but her monstrous son Momotaro.
Who is Momotaro?
A hulking beast of a man, Momotaro, AKA: Yotendoji was supposedly born from a peach as like the hero Momotaro of legends. Here? Momotaro is a very twisted demon who leads Kaguya's armies. We first learn of him when Momotaro, fearing the power of shapeshifters, betrayed their village and had them exterminated, with few surviving including Amon's later ally Okemaru. In chapter 4...Momotaro makes his debut with corpses around him as he feasts on the roasted limbs of dead women.
Then he finds an arrowhead in one of the limbs. When one of the women who was forced to cook begs for mercy, Momotaro laughs it off as no big deal...and stuffs the arrowhead in her mouth, makes her chew it and crushes her head while laughing ...he then reveals he's preparing for Kaguya's arrival with a host of demonic siblings preparing to be born. Momotaro orders Amon and Okenmaru's deaths, gleefully predicting the end of the world. He then rides into a village, declaring that it's time for a banquet and having noblewomen gathered up. He seizes one for a taste, eats her alive and declares her 'too oily' for the feast...he then orders the children seized and cooked for the feast. When one farmer begs for him to spare the kids, Momotaro stomps his head into dust, and tells the kids they're going to 'play tag'....losers get eaten.
Thankfully, Amon arrives and sends one of Momotaro's goons flying at him. Momotaro, rather than just dodge, crushes the man in midair.. In the ensuing fight, Amon defeats and impales Momotaro, prompting the villagers to hack him to pieces in revenge.
Heinous standard?
Besides Kaguya? Worst in story and he's crueler and more sadistic than she is. Pass here.
Mitigating Qualities?
Kaguya shows redeeming traits, such as a strange love for Amon while Momotaro is just...a big, spoiled brat who loves hurting others. He's wantonly cruel and while his purpose is to guard the other 'siblings' in their peach-like eggs, he's evil well outside of that. He's not disloyal to Kaguya but their relationship is more servant and master without any seeming genuine love there. Besides that? No, Momotaro is just a monster.
Conclusion?
A keeper, IMO.
Goku Black
Momotaro
Oh wow the good guy is named Amon. That's a new one on this thread. ![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
edited 16th Jun '18 2:42:04 PM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Lizzid people!
In regards to that Bernkastel quote, that did come from the visual novel. Personally, I like that quote.
Wild Child
Momotaro.
Gentle Laborer
Momotaro.
Kjhorn
Momotaro
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Momotaro.
Austin: Cool. I think we'll use that unless anyone finds one that works better.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Momotaro. Weirdest Adaptational Villainy ever.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Oh, I dunno about that. That "honor" may go to the version of Batman in Catwoman: Guardian of Gotham.
Momotaro.
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Catching up:
to Bishop,Baron Mordo and Momotaro (Tf did i just read )
Btw, guys...
On the Monster.Web Original page:
- Bring Him Home: Alfred is an 1867 factory owner who utilizes child labor under the harshest condition. The young children are underfed and their fingers are bloodied from working on the machines. All of them are kept in chains and the protagonist, Henry, says that Alfred had hundreds of children kidnapped, including Henry's son, Harry. Henry joins a group of rebels to take them all back. Once Alfred gets word of this, he sends for a sadistic assassin from a group known as the Pinkertons stop them from getting the children. The Pinkerton is directly responsible for viciously beating a group of the rebels to death with a baseball bat. Once Alfred hears gunshots in the factory when some of the rebels get past the Pinkerton, he hides in behind his desk and immediately tries to surrender out of fear when one of them, Jack, corners him. Alfred was nothing more than a selfish, greedy bastard willing to do anything for money.
It's a shitty story with no plot, no rhyme or logic and violates multiple rules of ours. Can we cut?
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
If you want then go ahead
Goku Black
Cut away. Something did feel off when it was being approved any way.
I mean, it's one of those "trash written by someone wholly talentless who has no idea how to write a story" that's just pointless plotless gorn. One thing we decided we don't want or need.
Kjhorn
Sure cut it.
Kevin Dewey Horn
Call me... Del Noir...
Momotaro. Cut away.
Cut, I remember there was a trend of minimal-story internet works popping up for a while the poster kept insisting had obvious keepers yet a glance at said "stories" revealed they literally existed to make the villain in question look bad, often with a trashy grimdark ending.
Speaking of which, I brought up cutting the song version of the Wonderland Dream? A lot supported the cut but nothing came of it... can we settle that now?
edited 16th Jun '18 3:51:57 PM by 43110
Kjhorn
I'm ok with cutting it.
Kevin Dewey Horn
Alfred should definitely be cut. I was actually thinking of bringing him up as a cut myself. The story is really barebones and Alfred only appears in a couple sentences to beg for mercy, he's more plot device than character. I also still agree about cutting the Wonderland Dream.
edited 16th Jun '18 3:59:25 PM by TommyFresh
To Momotaro
Alright, I've not read the trilogy, but I think each is the Big Bad of a separate book. I don't think Doom would really work with Skull either. I edited that. (Edit: What Overlord said![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]")
).
edited 16th Jun '18 2:18:58 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts