Needs subtropes moved off: Immortality

I could see it being either an index or a highish-level supertrope where all the examples go in the subtropes. Could go either way and, now that I think about it, the page would actually look basically the same no matter which option we went with.

Actually, yeah, supertrope sounds much better, since it would still function just fine as an index...I mean, look at Applied Phlebotinum. Works pretty well there.

Rhymes with "Protracted."

Supertrope-index hybrids for the win.

SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)

Supertrope+Index gets my vote.

"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."

I'm leaning towards that one as well. Do we need a crowner to be official, here?

Do we have a trope for "when you die, your mind/soul gets downloaded to a new body/clone?" I'm seeing that variant a lot in Ressurective Immortality, and my Google Fu is weak and not turning up a subtrope.

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

Hmm... Heart Drive appears to be related to that. If it doesn't exist I'll make it,when I'm not backed with my other YKTT Ws...

"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."

Not that I know of. Other than Brain Uploading, which is similar, but not quite what we're looking for.

ccoa,

I figure that we might as well. If a mod thinks it is alright to make the switch, then he or she can step in and lock the crowner, but I feel like merges typically require crowners, so I made one here.

Earlier you mentioned how some of the tropes on This Index Will Live Forever do not really fit Immortality as a supertrope. I apologize if I am overlooking something obvious, but would you mind explaining that a bit more?

"irhgT nm0w tehre might b ea lotof th1nmgs i dont udarstannd, ubt oim ujst goinjg to keepfollowing this pazth i belieove iN !!!!!1 d

Speaking of Brain Uploading, what about The Virus / The Corruption when it's a sentient entity, when it's basically From a Single Cell except the cells are people.

An interesting case is the title antagonist in The Thing, where each Thing can multiply if even a single cell infects a living or dead organism and copy the organism completely. However, each Thing is also its own individual entity, meaning that every cell of the Thing will fight to save itself (even if it's just a hair or a fingernail) and even attack other infected creatures.

^^Well, things like Immortality Immorality and Who Wants to Live Forever? aren't types of immortality, they're tropes about reactions to immortality. They wouldn't fit under a general Immortality supertrope.

^Yes, that would indeed be a type of immortal being. Are there enough examples of that to be a new trope?

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

Crowner hooked.

I've certainly seen it plenty of times, but at the moment not in anything I can recall offhand. The Thing is probably the most well-known example in the West.

@ccoa: Pretty good on the YKTTWs. If you still want a new name for "Vampiric Immortality" / "Life Drinker", I would suggest "Faux Immortality" or "Imperfect Immortality".

Also, I think we should keep "Regenerative" and "Resurrection/Reincarnation" types. From a Single Cell and Back from the Dead aren't really written specifically for immortality. We should also probably have a "Conditional Immortality".

edited 12th Jan '12 11:18:33 AM by shiro_okami

Too vague. That could be one of about a dozen tropes.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

For ressurective, I was planning to YKTTW Body Backup Drive (or a less clever name, but I think it's cute), which seems to be the most common variant of Ressurective Immortality that isn't already a different trope.

From a Single Cell does say in the very first sentence that the character is unkillable.

EDIT: YKTTW'd Body Backup Drive. While making it, I noticed there are a lot of examples of "character dies and is immediately reborn" and "character dies and immediately respawns." Those could potentially be another subtrope or subtropes.

edited 12th Jan '12 12:33:30 PM by ccoa

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

I don't mean to nitpick, but the description for Body Backup Drive is not the same thing as a resurrection. Resurrection is generally when the person comes Back from the Dead in the same body. Body Backup Drive is more like instant reincarnation.

Unless you want to use it for both resurrection and reincarnation, which is fine.

EDIT: Actually, resurrection would be a lot closer to regenerative immortality, so I guess it doesn't matter anyway.

edited 16th Jan '12 2:29:52 PM by shiro_okami

Type IV is going to need its own trope I think Immortality in the fact they have an Auto Life basically cast on them but can still die via old age and such is rare but I have seen it before.

III will need another one too.

Nvm ninjaed.

edited 15th Jan '12 2:08:45 PM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!

^^I was simply making a trope for the one that seemed to have the most examples under Ressurective that weren't another type of Immortality (such as From a Single Cell). As I said. More than once.

What that page lists as Ressurective Immortality is simply too broad to be very tropable by itself. There may still be subtropes in it, though, and in fact I noted two more in my last post.

edited 16th Jan '12 3:16:33 PM by ccoa

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

Okay, YKTTW'd Immortality By Rebirth (alternatively, Phoenix Immortality) and Ressurective Immortality.

I think that covers all the Immortality subtropes we didn't previously have. I think the crowner has stabilized, too, so I'll see if we can get that called.

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

Crowner called.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

I don't like merging From a Single Cell with Regenerative Immortality. The main example of the latter that I'm familiar with, the Greek gods, are unaging and unkillable can also regenerate injuries, but there's no story of any of them being reduced to a single cell and then growing back into a humanoid form, or spreading like an ooze.

Likewise, ressurrection and brain-downloading/uploading are different.

For Vampiric Immortality, I think Life-Leecher or Life-Drinker would be a better name, or at least redirect.

edited 18th Jan '12 11:30:51 AM by ArcadesSabboth

Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.

If they can't be killed by an injury because of a Healing Factor (regardless of severity), it's already From a Single Cell. If they just have a healing factor, it's Healing Factor. There's no merging or redefining going on at all with this trope, so I don't know where you got that idea.

Your second point has already been addressed (multiple times). No one ever suggested that they were the same.

The third has already been decided in YKTTW to go with Life Drinker as the main title, although the floor is still open there for a better title.

---

In YKTTW, it's been brought up that Immortality By Rebirth is very similar to Reincarnation and Back from the Dead, and Resurrective Immortality is covered by Back from the Dead.

We need to decide how we will handle the overlap.

edited 18th Jan '12 11:42:25 AM by ccoa

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

It is entirely possible, of course, that we can just simply not create those subtropes that are ridiculously similar to existing tropes. We don't have to split off a new trope just because the original description listed it as "Type X Immortality".

Rhymes with "Protracted."

Yes, that is indeed a possibility (I believe I said so in both YKTT Ws). However, if we do that, we need to make sure that the existing tropes completely cover what we need them to.

Waiting on a TRS slot? Finishing off one of these cleaning efforts will usually open one up.

Back from the Dead and Reincarnation strike me as covering the event, while Ressurrective Immortality and Reincarnating Immortality are about a guarantee that it'll happen, repeatedly, every time the character dies.

Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.

Agreed. There's a difference between an event that happens once and knowing it will always happen.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick