I mainly fix indentation issues
You would need a wick check for that.
Valdo
i'm at the combination she and it
definitely do a wick check first. that said, i wasn't even aware this trope was supposed to involve a rivalry instead of just being the relationship dynamic of two guys and their platonic girl best friend, so that's probably enough of a case for Trope Decay already.
Edited by NoUsername on May 21st 2023 at 5:33:04 AM
What would have been the archived discussion
got lost or purged at some point, but there I brought up how the title made me think of a common team construction for protagonists, while also presenting a revealing interpretation for what the trope actually was. On that note, here's the oldest Internet Archive copy of the page.
Edited by MorganWick on May 23rd 2023 at 2:21:45 AM
i'm at the combination she and it
it was originally a video game trope?! that's fascinating! did someone just see sora/riku/kairi and assume that was a common dynamic?
It doesn't help that it has a very non-indicative name.
Related to this, there is also Three Amigos, which is also about a two guys - one girl character dynamic, specifically in a high school setting... and yet it's named after a work starring three adult men.
According to the Archived Discussion, Three Amigos wasn't supposed to be named after the film, but the limitations of the custom title tool means it's impossible for it not to be a reference under the current name, and even if it weren't for the film the name would make it sound broader than it is.
It doesn't help that the page quote is from Legend of the Three Caballeros, which also stars three adult men... birds. Either way, it doesn't fit the trope.
Editing to mention that on the page, it looks like a lot of entries are just listing character names, or might be missing some of the requirements.
Editing again to note that I'm working on a wick check because I suspect it's a ZCE magnet and the description is full of Weasel Words. Morgan, where is the post about custom title limits? I can't see it.
Edited by VerySunshine on May 26th 2023 at 7:27:07 AM
The bit about custom titles is my analysis/observation/conclusion; only "not being named after the film" is in the Archived Discussion. Custom titles apply to all pages with the same name regardless of whether they actually refer to the same thing, so a custom title that's intended to properly punctuate the name of the film gets applied to the trope, even if that's not how the trope name is intended to be rendered. (And I'm pretty sure the trope predates the custom title system and might even predate its ptitle predecessor.)
I'll keep an eye out for that during my wick check.
Three Amigos just says they usually are high school or middle school aged, it doesn't say it's a requirement. While Two Guys and a Girl is a more specific dynamic than Three Amigos even if it's misused, I'm not sure why we need Two Girls and a Guy as a trope when it feels like it's just the same as Three Amigos.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
IIRC ~War Jay 77 actually did her own wick check on Three Amigos, though I can't remember why she didn't bring it in—I think she didn't have a particular solution in mind?
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Oh, snap I did didn't I?
Sandbox.Three Amigos Wick Check
I feel like I just couldn't think of a solution. If anyone wants to TRS it with this check, have at it.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
TBH I have no idea what solution I'd come up with either, so I don't blame you.
(she/her)
I see more valid examples in the on page examples so I think we might able to save this with a rename. Picking a good won't be easy though...
Macron's notes
I fix my examples all the time
Merging with Power Trio is an option. Can I put it in the queue?
Edited by ElRise on May 28th 2023 at 8:52:37 PM
Graffiti Wall
I was thinking either merge, rewrite definition, or split.
At issue: Poor Description, People Sit on Chairs
This trope has been in Trope Repair Shop many times.
2010: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=4mx1eqolr3w3osae2cwyglld Concern about it being too close to Power Trio. Closed due to lack of activity.
2012: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1296948011052820100 Concern about it sharing a name with a film. This one had plenty of discussion, but it stalled.
2016: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1454924718040925400 Closed due to "shares a name with a work" no longer being a valid reason for a rename.
2017: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1498924941080565800 Closed due to "shares a name with a work" no longer being a valid reason for a rename and not having evidence.
In all of these cases, concerns have been raised that the name does not fit the trope, and is causing confusion. The name does fit the trope description as it is currently written because the description is so full of weasel words that it's too ambiguous to be useful.
The description states that Three Amigos is a Power Trio with the protagonist, a best friend of the same gender, and a best friend of the other gender. They are usually in middle school or high school. The two best friends are usually opposites in some way, like wealthy vs poor, jock vs slacker, or being different races.
The next paragraph notes that romance will always occur (emphasis in the original), but they'll all still be friends by the end. The next notes that the trio are frequently secret keepers. The last few paragraphs discuss how the trope relates to other friend group tropes.
The film Three Amigos is about three adult men. The current quote is from Legend of the Three Caballeros, which is also about three adult male birds. However, the trope description's constant use of weasel words implies that adults are allowed. The only definite requirements in the description are "there are three friends, and romance is explored between the three of them." The current image is Harry, Ron, and Hermione from Harry Potter laughing together.
The laconic is "The Hero has two friends of different genders." Since there are so few definite requirements in the original description, the removal of the romance element is telling. It's also not currently in any romance indexes, which it should be if romance is supposed to be a major part of the trope. If it's not, then the only requirements are too vague.
Edited by VerySunshine on May 29th 2023 at 12:12:00 PM
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Whoever wants to put in the queue could, and since "merge" was brought up twice it seems like you both have similar ideas.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
TBH that's a solid OP—just mention the wick check, and you could queue it up yourself Very Sunshine.
I'm on mobile until the end of the day, so if anyone else wants to get to it first, go ahead.
Posted the entry!
RJ Savoy
I've come across an entry for Two Girls and a Guy that I see as misuse (their dynamic is more two surrogate parents and a daughter, and they are secondary characters) but maybe it will have to wait until we decide if this related concept is at all tropeworthy.
Stories don't tell us monsters exist; we knew that already. They show us that monsters can be trademarked and milked for years.
The description of Two Guys and a Girl makes it clear it's supposed to be about the specific dynamic of two male and one female character that are initially friends but drift apart over time, with the guys becoming rivals to each other and the girl being in the middle and often being the object which they fight over. But most of the uses on the page at least (I haven't done a wick check) seems to be just any trio of characters that have two male characters and a female one. Do you think it would be a good idea to TRS and rename this to make it more clear what it's supposed to be about?