Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?
This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.
Are they bad enough?
A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:
- Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
- The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
- The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)
Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:42:49 AM
- What’s the Work?
- Who is he? What has he done?
When the UEG army occupied the city of Laglane, the economic and industrial hub of the colony world of Rondolina. General Crayambo, led his massive army to the outskirts of Laglane, allowing his presence to terrify the citizens, in order to weaken their will to resist. However the city of Laglane had no military force to speak of. The mayor of the City, tired to talk to General Crayambo multiple hoping to end the siege peacefully, but Crayambo rejected him out of stubbornness making it impossible for any peace talks to progress. However his worst act was when he committed the Bloody Night Massacre, his forces invaded the city. While the citizens formed vigilante squads to repel the soldiers, they did little to stop what would happen. Crayambo told his men they has complete authority to take whatever measures they found necessary to root out and destroy any Anti-Earth Movement members they thought were hiding. The UEG soldiers looted and murdered everything in sight and with the full support of their superiors such as Crayambo.
The earth soldiers had many citizen disemboweled so that any jewels or other treasures that they may have swallowed could be claimed by them. In the city the elderly had their jaws cut from their faces so soldiers could claim their gold teeth, women had their ears and fingers sliced off so the Earth soldiers could claim their jewelry. More than 900,000 civilians had been killed, and more than 15,000,000 credits worth of property had been stolen. Crayambo and the UEG even blamed the Anti-Earth Movement of committing the massacre in order to eliminate support for the movement, and claimed the civilian death count was an exaggeration. An additional 350,000 deaths would happen due to the continued occupation of Rondolina until they were liberated by the Anti-Earth Movement.
His actions would also lead to the destruction of the United Earth Government due to the Anti-Earth Movement no longer holding back against their enemies and launch a full scale assault on earth leading to the deaths of most of their population.
- Freudian Excuse? Redeeming Qualities?
- Heinous Standard?
Final Verdict? I would say he is a definite yes.
Edited by Phantom25 on Dec 14th 2023 at 7:18:50 AM
Lemme think there... he gets barely any characterization in the historical overview and I don't recall how much was him and how much was the soldiers running amok going Rape, Pillage, and Burn. Rudolf and August both get clear crimes to their name in the historical sense and at the lower level he still has to compete with the likes of Falk and the Free Planet all out assault and attempting to extend the war between the Empire and FP or Lynch and the mass attack on a whole planet or leaving millions of people to be taken by the Empire's camps.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'll give a yes to Frollo I guess.
As for ![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
, isn't the standard rather high for that work? Even fewer resources may not be enough when most of the current keepers have, what, thousands at a minimum (OVA!Castrop)? With most having at least millions, and a few (Goldenbaum and probably Braunschweig) reaching into the billions?
Braunschweig is in the millions, Rudolf the billions but I'm still unsure.
Also calling the YuYu Hakusho live action that dropped today.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Ruby, Grantham, and Nightmare Man.
Nemeth.
Aamon.
I can take it or leave it with Minus One!Godzilla myself. On one hand I don’t think the intended tragedy of the monster translates enough onscreen. On the other hand, I always felt like even a villainous version of Godzilla being a CM would be feel out of place, considering his usual portrayals of even his antagonistic incarnations.
Edited by Beast on Dec 14th 2023 at 10:21:36 AM
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Lizzid people!
Reserving Night Swim.
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_down_emote.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
to General Crayambo based on ACW and 43110's arguments. Holy shit these old media are insane lol.
The Moron
Do you really need to say something like that for every candidate you vote on? Cause, like, we get it.
No to Crayambo
Hey guys, I’m back, did you miss me? Well, ladies and gentlemen, I promised a whole lot of proposals and I did not lie, so here it is:
What is the work? The Ultraman. I’m sorry, there’s actually a star in between the two letters of the title, but for the life of me I certainly don’t know how to replicate it, so you will just have to accept the title as is, which is just “The Ultraman.” You can correct me if I am dead wrong. Anyway, in traditional format of the Ultraman series, the story involves a young pilot who miraculously learns that he has been chosen by the series’s Ultraman: Joneus, and fights aliens and monsters after letting him possess his body and learns more about the secrets of the Ultras.
Who are the people? To start, this anime has one already established monster, and his name is Heller. And now he will have a friend, and he works directly under him in the first place. The guy I will propose will be Roygar, who is Heller’s second-in-command.
What atrocities did he/she/they do? Roygar is the one who does most of the grunt work for Heller and thus is the main reason as for him becoming such a notorious name for the cosmos. Despite ostensibly acting like a dignified, honorable warrior and admiral, complete with his own set of politeness to back up his claims, he is repeatedly shown to be nothing short of a sadistic warmonger who would destroy all in his way for the sake of Heller, of whom he shares a hypocritical, fanatical loyalty to. For starters, he was the one who had invaded and sacked countless planets all in the name of Heller, using any survivors of his conquests solely to torturously brainwash as his disposable soldiers of which he carelessly sends into battle with Ultraman. He was also the one who had captured and brainwashed several monsters, most of whom were not even directly malicious, and sent them to attack Ultraman Joneus just so that he could crush the hopes of Planet Earth, of which he had been planning to invade next. More, he kidnapped and manipulated an alien toddler boy and his pet monster into mercilessly attacking Joneus and destroying properties, threatening to destroy their world if they do not comply or succeed in killing Joneus, before betraying and brainwashing the poor creature as soon as said boy realizes that Joneus is not the true enemy. To further twist the knife, he even told his goons to shoot the poor kid while he was defenseless. Sure, Ultraman was still able to stop the monster, but Roygar’s actions still did way too much damage for both sides and ultimately resulted in both the boy and the monster’s violent deaths. Not just resorting to brainwashing and forcing the compliance of these aliens, Roygar had also manipulated several other aliens, including stray soldiers and monsters left behind from previous battles with Joneus, into throwing away their lives for a chance at finally striking a fatal blow at Joneus and getting their revenge. He also took pleasure in invading the planet of U-40, intending on repeating his actions as his ultimate display of loyalty and gratitude to Heller. Kidnapping Amia, he prepared to brutally torture her, before instead strapping her to a rocket to deliver to Heller and then allowed himself to burn to death in his own ship’s explosion. Even that wasn’t as honorable a way to go, as he spent his last moments smugly gloating to Joneus and his allies that Heller would make her suffer for standing against him and the glory of his empire.
Redeeming/mitigating/sympathetic factors? Absolutely nothing even remotely resembling redemptive factors on Roygar’s end. Roygar is no better despite him pretending to be a sophisticated, aristocratic person even at the face of his crimes and his own demise. Sure, he pets Monkey instead of outright killing him, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that he actually cares about him and desires to protect or adopt him; as shown when he at one point fuses the poor animal with one of his own brainwashed monsters just to hurt the SDS and Joneus further. Think about Ernst Stavo Blofeld, you see him with a cat and you don’t see him abuse the creature at any point in his roles, but he nevertheless counts as a monster. Now why do you think that is? Well, I’ll tell you: because of his crimes and personality, not at all due to the fact that he abuses his pet cat. The point being that both use these animals solely to satisfy their ego and superiority complexes and not at all out of genuine curiosity and desire to keep these animals as personal pets. Case in point, he pretends to be polite, but that’s just it: pretending. He only uses the act to accentuate his own manipulative tendencies and make himself seem superior to his enemies. Again, how many of these guys exactly fit these descriptions? That said, he is just a sadistic monster with any altruistic or redemptive qualities that he claims to have being entirely false and weak above all else.
What makes him/her/them stand out? The Ultraman is a goofy, cheery, episodic, and simple anime series with loads of mindless, sympathetic, or redeemed villains and monsters that appear all over the show, not to mention no definitive villains to see until much later in the series, with any alleged “leaders” being just generic goons with no names or characters and often very quickly being eliminated by Ultraman during their one episode as they meet and fight. Therefore, not a lot of time to display any characterization of any sorts. Also, the one types of villains that actually show up for more time than usual are first off generic again, but also sympathetic, amoral, mindless, misguided, and some even have peaceful redemption moments. Therefore, it takes an especially high standard for any more of said villains or even be properly called monsters of these kinds. I can perfectly understand if you doubt that there are any more monstrous people besides the already mentioned Heller. However, Roygar, just like his boss, is proven to be more than capable of fitting the necessary heinous standard required to fit in the articles. To name, Roygar never showed any comical, redeeming, amoral, and sympathetic qualities of any minds in literally any of the appearances he has made, and his actions are played dead seriously and are both treated with shock, horror, and revulsion by especially the heroes along with everyone else he encountered. Now what better way to explain why he deserve his addition? Why don’t we use historical tyrants to explain his actions, as they have many parallels with some of the worst people in history anyway? Okay so, since Heller is the show’s version of Hitler, even being literally two letters away from matching the very same name, Roygar would essentially be the show’s version of Heinrich Himmler; like him, Roygar pretends to be dignified and polite while gleefully committing all of his atrocities, does most of the dirty work for the megalomaniac in charge, utilized a fanatical rhetoric to simultaneously justify his actions, indulge in his own vices, and to enlarge his own ego all at the same time, forcibly conscripted countless people into his armies and carelessly used them for cannon fodder, was willing to tear apart families, children, and even animals to make their soldiers, authorized brainwashing and experiments to create mindless drones, and most importantly, defiantly committed suicide solely to mock his enemies and make himself look like the better man at the very end even though evidence obviously suggest otherwise.
Treated with fear? Easy, no one likes Roygar at all, not even Ultraman himself, who shares this particular kind of hatred with Heller himself. Even the aforementioned kid he enslaved is terrified of Roygar, and by the time he managed to stand up to him, he knew that he would not live to tell the tale solely because he knew fully how ruthless Roygar is. Even his suicide only showed to prove how despicable Roygar is with his taunting over Heller capturing Amia via rocket, and Ultraman obviously making no attempt to stop his suicide or save him. The only other time Ultraman willingly did such a thing is with Heller himself.
Conclusion? Know that literally everything I said about them is the truth, and should more than qualify as to them adding to the list of monsters. Ultimately, Roygar is just as bad as Heller in spite of his demeanor, if not more so due to him being the one who does all his dirty work anyway.
Edited by Neeku-Nekku-Nakuru-Nikua on Dec 14th 2023 at 12:23:23 PM
Goku Black
Could you break that up with a few pargaphs. The size is okay but the paragraphs are so long it's hard to tell what's happening
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
What is the work? The Ultraman. I’m sorry, there’s actually a star in between the two letters of the title, but for the life of me I certainly don’t know how to replicate it, so you will just have to accept the title as is, which is just “The Ultraman.” You can correct me if I am dead wrong. Anyway, in traditional format of the Ultraman series, the story involves a young pilot who miraculously learns that he has been chosen by the series’s Ultraman: Joneus, and fights aliens and monsters after letting him possess his body and learns more about the secrets of the Ultras.
Who are the people? To start, this anime has one already established monster, and his name is Heller. And now he will have a friend, and he works directly under him in the first place. The guy I will propose will be Roygar, who is Heller’s second-in-command.
What atrocities did he/she/they do? Roygar is the one who does most of the grunt work for Heller and thus is the main reason as for him becoming such a notorious name for the cosmos. For starters, he was the one who had invaded and sacked countless planets all in the name of Heller, using any survivors of his conquests solely to torturously brainwash as his disposable soldiers of which he carelessly sends into battle with Ultraman; he would do this to other survivors and monsters who he didn’t brainwash. He then sent them to attack Ultraman Joneus just so that he could crush the hopes of Planet Earth, of which he had been planning to invade next, even though he knew they would inevitably die. More, he kidnapped and manipulated an alien toddler boy and his pet monster into mercilessly attacking Joneus and destroying properties, threatening to destroy their world if they do not comply or succeed in killing Joneus, before betraying and brainwashing the poor creature as soon as said boy realizes that Joneus is not the true enemy. To further twist the knife, he even told his goons to shoot the poor kid while he was defenseless. Sure, Ultraman was still able to stop the monster, but Roygar’s actions still resulted in both the boy and the monster’s violent deaths. He also took pleasure in invading the planet of U-40, intending on repeating his actions just to get his own revenge. Kidnapping Amia, he prepared to brutally torture her, before instead strapping her to a rocket to deliver to Heller and then allowed himself to burn to death in his own ship’s explosion. Even that wasn’t as honorable a way to go, as he spent his last moments smugly gloating to Joneus and his allies that Heller would make her suffer for standing against him and the glory of his empire.
Redeeming/mitigating/sympathetic factors? Absolutely nothing even remotely resembling redemptive factors on Roygar’s end. Roygar is no better despite him pretending to be a sophisticated, aristocratic person even at the face of his crimes and his own demise. Sure, he pets Monkey instead of outright killing him, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that he actually cares about him and desires to protect or adopt him; as shown when he at one point fuses the poor animal with one of his own brainwashed monsters just to hurt the SDS and Joneus further. Think about Ernst Stavo Blofeld, you see him with a cat and you don’t see him abuse the creature in any way at any point in his roles, but he nevertheless counts as a monster. Now why do you think that is? Well, I’ll tell you: because of his crimes and personality, not at all due to the fact that he abuses his pet cat. The point being that both use these animals solely to satisfy their ego and superiority complexes and not at all out of genuine curiosity and desire to keep these animals as personal pets. Case in point, he pretends to be polite, but that’s just it: pretending. He only uses the act to accentuate his own manipulative tendencies and make himself seem superior to his enemies.
What makes him/her/them stand out? The Ultraman is a goofy, cheery, episodic, and simple anime series with loads of mindless, sympathetic, or redeemed villains and monsters that appear all over the show, not to mention no definitive villains to see until much later in the series, with any alleged “leaders” being just generic or not even directly malicious goons with no names or characteristics, and often very quickly being eliminated by Ultraman during their one episode as they meet and fight. Therefore, it takes an especially high standard for any more of said villains or even be properly called monsters of these kinds. I can perfectly understand if you doubt that there are any more monstrous people besides the already mentioned Heller. However, Roygar, just like his boss, never showed any comical, redeeming, amoral, and sympathetic qualities of any minds in literally any of the appearances he has made, and his actions are played dead seriously and are both treated with shock, horror, and revulsion by especially the heroes along with everyone else he encountered. Now what better way to explain why he deserve his addition? Why don’t we use historical tyrants to explain his actions, as they have many parallels with some of the worst people in history anyway? Okay so, since Heller is the show’s version of Hitler, even being literally two letters away from matching the very same name, Roygar would essentially be the show’s version of Heinrich Himmler; like him, Roygar pretends to be dignified and polite while gleefully committing all of his atrocities, does most of the dirty work for the megalomaniac in charge, utilized a fanatical rhetoric to simultaneously justify his actions, indulge in his own vices, and to enlarge his own ego all at the same time, forcibly conscripted countless people into his armies and carelessly used them for cannon fodder, was willing to tear apart families, children, and even animals to make their soldiers, authorized brainwashing and experiments to create mindless drones, and most importantly, defiantly committed suicide solely to mock his enemies and make himself look like the better man at the very end even though evidence obviously suggest otherwise.
Treated with fear? Easy, no one likes Roygar at all, not even Ultraman himself, who shares this particular kind of hatred with Heller himself. Even the aforementioned kid he enslaved is terrified of Roygar, and by the time he managed to stand up to him, he knew that he would not live to tell the tale solely because he knew fully how ruthless Roygar is. Even his suicide only showed to prove how despicable Roygar is with his taunting over Heller capturing Amia via rocket, and Ultraman obviously making no attempt to stop his suicide or save him. The only other time Ultraman willingly did such a thing is with Heller himself.
Conclusion? Know that literally everything I said about them is the truth, and should more than qualify as to them adding to the list of monsters. Ultimately, Roygar is just as bad as Heller in spite of his demeanor, if not more so due to him being the one who does all his dirty work anyway.
Is that better? A lot of other stuff I can’t edit off, because they are too important and properly explains why Roygar is a monster.
Edited by Neeku-Nekku-Nakuru-Nikua on Dec 14th 2023 at 1:25:53 AM
Showtime!
why did you post that twice?
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Because one guy asked me to condense the paragraph. Did I make a mistake?
Showtime!
Yeah, edit your post instead of reposting
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Oh, I am sorry. Would you like me to do that now? If so, can you please tell me how?
Edited by Neeku-Nekku-Nakuru-Nikua on Dec 14th 2023 at 12:51:39 PM
Showtime!
Well, there's no point now because there's always going to be a second post
... same way you edited this post
Edited by Libraryseraph on Dec 14th 2023 at 3:56:59 PM
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Oh. I won’t get blocked for this right? I didn’t mean to mess up like this. I can still do better next time right? And you will still consider my proposal if so? 
Edited by Neeku-Nekku-Nakuru-Nikua on Dec 14th 2023 at 12:54:29 PM
Not the Eye
to Crayambo
Ryogar sounds bad enough, but mention of him wanting to invade planet as show of loyalty and gratitude to his boss gives me pause. Could you elaborate on that?
Edited by EmperorGeode on Dec 14th 2023 at 12:58:41 PM
Okay, while Roygar is indeed loyal to Heller, it is not genuine loyalty or friendship but solely due to combined megalomania and fanaticism, and there were times that he privately admitted that he did not enjoy working for Heller because he saw him as weak of will. A few granted, but enough to warrant his questioning of his loyalty to Heller. Remember, was Himmler genuinely loyal to Hitler or was he merely taking advantage of his own fanaticism and totalitarian views by working for him? That answer is the same for Roygar, just like that.
Not familiar with Legend of the Galactic Heroes myself, so I'm thrusting 43110's judgment and Abstain for now.
Welcome back Neeku. I recommend you delete one of the two EPs.
As for the candidate: There's this sentence that sounds like he doesn't count.
"He also took pleasure in invading the planet of U-40, intending on repeating his actions as his ultimate display of loyalty and gratitude to Heller."
Edit: Okay looks like he doesn't care for his boss, so I'm changing my vote for Roygar to .
The argument that he isn’t loyal because the person he’s based one wasn’t is pretty weak. Roygar may be inspired by Himmler but he isn't Himmler. The reason why I still upvoted him is because Roygar himself calls Heller weak-willed and hates working for him.
Edited by NTG on Dec 14th 2023 at 1:11:40 AM
May I edit the page regarding that, because that’s not true?
Showtime!
Neeku, please stop comparing characters from a children's anime to Himmler. It's really jarring
Also, I'd like to hear more about this redeeming feature. Who did Heller? Are they around to ask?
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Well I don’t honestly know who did Heller, because he was actually already there long before I showed up, I swear. Take a look there if you don’t believe me.
Well it is still a kids show, so they can't really show such a graphic and realistic depiction of a massacre, I haven't watched it but from what's been told the implications are strong enough to know alot of people died