Is Jerkass Facade worth restarting?

Inspired by a talk in another thread.

The trope called "Jerkass Facade" was cut and apparently assimilated to Hidden Heart of Gold. But someone pointed out that it brings problems of its own, namely that the "facade" may be done for reasons other than hiding a heart of gold.

I'm thinking of:

• Sour Outside, Sad Inside: someone puts a jerk front to hide their insecurities, sorrow and misery.
• Never Be Hurt Again: someone puts a jerk front (among other means) to protect themselves from being wronged again.
• Cruel to Be Kind: someone puts a jerk front because it'll somehow help someone else. Same as Tough Love, Stern Teacher and possibly Drill Sergeant Nasty.
• Zero-Approval Gambit: Someone puts a jerk (or even evil) front so other people would either break their ties with him or even antagonize him as part of his plan.

At worst, JF could be a disambig or an index. At best, it could be a supertrope page.

Thoughts?

I like the idea of an disambig list for the nuances but it should be named differently to avoid potholing.

Seconded.

For the name, how about Feigned Callousness Tropes? Too long?

Edited by DBZfan102 on Aug 29th 2020 at 9:38:15 AM

I don't mind that.

Disambig sounds like a good idea.

I like the idea. A disambig page or an index would be better than the current redirect.

Edited by XFllo on Sep 1st 2020 at 12:18:36 PM

Anything happening with this idea?

Would Jerkass Façade redirect to Feigned Callousness Tropes or whatever? Or itself be a disambig?

Probably the former, to avoid confusion as eroock has stated.

I'd like someone to start the TLP draft for me. :P

But still, I want to know whether there could be examples of "Jerkass Facade" that don't fall into its subtropes. If there are enough of them, JF can be a proper supertrope.

Break His Heart to Save Him is another subtrope, btw

It's entirely possible. We should probably wait for more input.

Edited by DBZfan102 on Sep 15th 2020 at 3:56:57 PM

Bringing back the trope sounds a bit dubious to me.

My suggestion would be that if there really are some super-trope examples that genuinely don't have an existing trope, you don't bring back Jerkass Façade. All you'll be doing is undoing the previous clean-up decisions and restarting all the misuse and potholing that was going on before.

You'd be creating something from scratch in the TLP and with, I would hope, an entirely different name. In other words, it would be something that's genuinely new and genuinely focussed on the examples that are slipping through the cracks, and not just 'Jerkass Facade restarted'.

I'd suggest collecting all the tropes first as if you're going for a disambig page. It'll be the sorting of those that will help identify whether any examples exist that genuinely don't fit in any existing trope and what the pattern of those left-over examples may take. But you need to know what the existing tropes are first, so it's best to begin there.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Sep 18th 2020 at 3:23:38 PM

Well, yes, that is what we've been discussing. It's probably best to make sure there are enough examples to justify it being a super-trope, to begin with. Otherwise it could be an index. But since it'll be on the Main namespace, someone's going to have to launch it, either way.

Do you have any suggestions for more subtropes, Wyldchyld? Or some examples that aren't categorized in any of the subtropes?

I'm gonna add

• Peer-Pressured Bully: someone puts a jerk front because his/her clique mates do the same

I think it's a good example but the description could use a tweak. How 'bout:

• Peer-Pressured Bully: Someone acts like a jerk because their clique-mates encourage it.

I do recall there was controversy in the thread where very similar points were brought up, but only after the dewicking had already started (having trouble finding the thread right now). At the time I thought this had merits but the concerns were overruled because the thread had already made a decision.

Normally it is bad juju to use the TLP to undo TRS work but there may be grounds in this particular case.

I think usually we "salt the ground" when it is determined to be impossible to remake, such as by making PRLC. Often, we have "Cut, but open for later editors to make a better version" instead.

Yeah, there's a reason the Trope Idea Salvage Yard has been adopted by TRS lately. If an idea can be salvaged, the least we can do is try.

Recognising trope relationships is not one of my strong points, so I don't know if the following could be classified as 'sub-tropes' (especially Beneath the Mask, which seems more like a super-trope), but here are some tropes I think could have a Jerkass Façade filter applied to them.

• Beneath the Mask: someone puts on a front to fit in with society and hide a less socially acceptable reality.
• Conflicting Loyalty: The character behaves like a jerk to everyone to hide how much his clashing loyalties are hurting him.
• Enemy Within: Terrified of what they could do to others should the evil within take over, they act like a jerk to drive people away for their own safety.
• Inferiority Superiority Complex: A character projects arrogance and ego to hide how lacking in self-belief and self-worth they really are.
• On the Rebound: A character rubs their new relationship in everyone's faces (especially their ex) to hide how devastated the break-up left them.
• Stepford Snarker: A person who hides their true self through sarcasm so rude or cutting that they're regarded as a jerk.
• Undercover When Alone: When the character is putting on the facade for the audience.

Beneath the Mask is a supertrope, yeah.

Out of those, the only proper subtropes seems to be Stepford Snarker and Inferiority Superiority Complex (I've mentioned the latter too). The others (other than BTM) are tropes that just benefit from someone putting a jerk front.

I thought that would be the case, but figured there was no harm mentioning them — at least I'd learn more about trope relationships that way.