DC Movies

He wanted to become the Final Boss...

Well he did start his acting career as the final boss in Mummy Returns, complete with sweet PS2 graphics.

Edited by GrandmasterKiramidHead on Mar 31st 2024 at 11:27:33 AM

That was fresh. XD

First poster for Joker 2. Trailer is next week.

Bumping with news from Deadline: Craig Gillespie (Cruella, I, Tonya) is in talks to direct the Supergirl movie.

https://deadline.com/2024/04/supergirl-craig-gillespie-1235875238/

Edited by BigBadShadow25 on Apr 3rd 2024 at 3:31:02 PM

So, I tried to do an experiment and watch both cuts of Justice League. I discovered something. While I find both bad, I found Wheadon's version slightly worse due to him constantly adding needless jokes. His type of snark didn't fit those characters. Also, it feels odd to cut the good stuff from the Snyder's version (mainly the Cyborg stuff) and replace it with jokes that don't land and add needless characters (the Russian family). I tried to give it a fair shot, but I felt like it went on forever even compared to Snyder's 4 hour long cut.

Edited by Bullman on Apr 5th 2024 at 3:27:58 AM

Yeah, the Josstice League is definitely a baby and bathwater situation. I personally would be more likely to watch Josstice League over the Snyder Cut (but realistically, I don't think I'm ever going to turn either of them on again) since it's shorter and I think I'd get more out of its Snark Bait than the Snyder Cut which, while it's objectively better, still feels So Okay, It's Average to me.

Dan Olson's initial vlog on Josstice League hit it on the head, someone went through and cut out everything that wasn't a joke, including some good stuff.

... and the worst of the Snyder Cut was added in reshoots. Seriously, I still can't wrap my head around adding Leto unless it was a Theres No Such Thing As Bad Publicity scenario.

... actually, now that I think about it, the Scandinavian singing scene is probably the single funniest thing in either version, intentional or not.

I liked Justice League 2017 and have no desire to watch ZSJL, which is perhaps unfair.

I feel about 2017 the same way I do about Star Trek Beyond in that's not actually good good, but it's trying a heck of a lot more than it's predecessors and for that I'm willing to cut it a lot of slack.

Like the Justice League in 2017 is just wholesome, they're nice to each other, they're mutually supportive, they're not the grimdark poo faced dicks from the previous films. That counts for me. I've heard Synder always intended JL to lighter and softer and I may be admiring things that originated with him here but after MoS and BvS I don't really trust him on that.

And then there's my favourite DCEU scene ever which Bruce's very laconic peptalk to Flash and I know that's not in the ZSJL.

There's definitely some misplaced Joss style humour, though the only one that really stands out as jarring in my memory is the cut to Batman after Superman's revival and that he introduces the title in the exact same was as he did in The Avengers. I can't really blame Joss because he was jobbing director on that and I think all he did was exactly was the execs wanted, it wasn't his artistic vision here.

I regard it as solid, mediocre to good but actually trying for the tone I wanted.

I disagree personally. I found that scene dumb honestly and just seems like a way to try to ape Ironman and Spider-Man's MCU dynamic. But it falls flat when you remember him taking out Boomerang in Suicide Squad.

I mean I feel like it falls flat. They are too wholesome. Like they all basically have the same jokey personality, and no one stands out. Like take Cyborg in the Wheadon cut and he is just to quippy for someone in his situation which is why Snyder's take of exploring his angst and explaining him becoming more hopeful. The league is also supportive of each other in Snyder's version but without rewriting the characters in the film.

I also think that him having Barry fall on Diana's breasts, having Cyborg say Bo-yah, and Batman repeatedly joke about Aquaman's powers were misplaced. Plus, even then it doesn't fit these versions of the characters specifically and it makes the jokes seem more out of place then they would in other versions of the League.

I also don't think I can give Wheadon the benefit of the doubt and blame the execs, when his on-set behavior to being told that it wasn't working was awful.

Again, I don't like either, but Wheadon's version is just slightly worse in my opinion,

Edited by Bullman on Apr 5th 2024 at 4:40:15 AM

Whedon's cut of the film is... in an awkward place. I don't think it's bad, but it's not really stand out to me. It has very much a "We have the Avengers at home" kind of energy to it, in that it feels like it's trying to capture the spirit of that film and feeling lesser because of it.

There are parts I like in it that weren't in the Snyder cut. I particularly like how Superman was written in Whedon's version, as it feels the closest the entire DCEU has gotten to capturing the spirit of the character. But there's parts where it's clear Whedon was letting some of his worst excesses get the better of him, because he had studio approval and no one was reigning him in.

Some of the film's flaws I blame on the studio, since they were the ones who demanded the film be under two hours. Snyder's film was not something that would survive a two-hour cut intact and I don't envy anyone who had to take that task. But there are moments that make me tilt my head and wonder why Whedon went in certain directions. The constant cuts to the family in Russia that was not in the Snyder cut, that really only serves to set up a gag about Superman saving more people than the Flash. Those scenes alone probably have about five minutes of screentime combined... and yet you cut most of the backstory for Cyborg when this is his proper debut?

Snyder's film is the more complete film... to it's detriment really. At four hours, it's a lot and there's so many moments that could've been cut because they don't add anything that useful. Martian Manhunter doesn't really need to be in the film, the Knightmare sequences don't need to be in the film, the constant slow motion shots don't need to be in the film.

Despite this, I think the film is actually a lot better than Snyder's other DC films, and this is coming from someone who really didn't like Man of Steel or Batman v Superman. There's a sense of hope in the face of struggle that's a lot stronger than in the other films, the heroes act like heroes, it has a truly epic feel that the theatrical cut lacks. It really does feel like a completely different film and not like diet-Avengers. If the film had been just three hours instead of four, I'd probably say it was outright good.

It's just... man, that four-hour runtime is a commitment.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Apr 5th 2024 at 5:48:30 AM

In general terms, I liked the Snydercut more than the theatrical version, there are only a pair of things that I didn't like.

• That it was Darksied and not Steppenwolf who invaded Earth 5,000 years ago makes the guy who is supposedly the "Thanos" of this universe look weak, losing his first fight on screen.

• The epilogue felt unnecessarily long.

Yeah, I'm not line by line debating my opinion with you. You're free to disagree of course but I disagree with your disagreement.

That said, I don't see the similarities to Iron Man and Spidey. Other than the mentor is a rich dude. Pete never tried to chicken out of a fight for example. If anything it's reminiscent of Clint and Wanda in Age of Ultron but very different in that they are very different characters. I don't see the contradiction with Suicide Squad because we never saw that fight it could have been as Flash said he pushed him over and ran away.

I like the characters wholesome, they don't seem samey to me, and I don't care if it's inconsistent with previous movies because I dislike the previous films. And Cyborg was barely in them so 2017 didn't contradict anything.

Bruce trolling Arthur with the talk to fish thing was hilarious, even more the sheepish follow up when he ask to ask 'umm... can you?' when they need intel.

Oh, the boob plant was dumb yes but nothing will make me condemn Cyborg saying Cyborg's well known catch phrase.

Edited by dcutter2 on Apr 5th 2024 at 10:50:59 AM

Uh both films didn't do great so why are we debating this?

Like debating which is better from the box office bomb that killed the dceu or the streaming disappointment which set the dceu to reboot feels pointless to me?

These films are more interesting imo in the effect their failures had on the decline of the dceu.

I mean agree to disagree. It just felt like that to me, and I felt like it didn't make sense for Barry. The Fish jokes were not in character for that Bruce, who actually never made similar jokes, it felt like an Iron man joke. The catch phrase also just doesn't fit the tone of the DCEU.

I feel like talking about to different takes on the same story is interesting, even if I don't like either.

Edited by Bullman on Apr 5th 2024 at 5:00:33 AM

Well first whether they did great or not doesn't control whether people want to talk about them or not, clearly.

Secondly, 2017 killed the new DCEU? It itself didn't do well (because of the bloated reshoot budget, it's box office was decent) but it's bracketed by massive successes and then Shazam which also did well.

After that it's nothing but shit commercially but that's obviously not the be all end all because the director of one of those is now in charge of all DC's films.

eta2: I mean again, I don't care if it's consistent because I don't like the previous characterisation but even in-universe Bv S Bruce was a major raging asshole who'd fallen from who he was supposed to be realised it at the end. JL Bruce is actively trying to be different and better when building his team.

Edited by dcutter2 on Apr 5th 2024 at 11:05:42 AM

Also to be fair the Snyder cut did okay on Streaming but it just wasn't enough to justify its making but that is because similar to the theatrical cut it had a huge budget (due to the needless epilogue that was tacked on). What killed the DCEU is Black Adam, Shazam 2, the Flash, and the rest flopping.

Edited by Bullman on Apr 5th 2024 at 5:04:53 AM

Uh Yeah? It was a massive box office bomb that caused the shake ups that would result in the slow decline?

Like every film after it had a lower opening weekend than the last one after that. Some were able to be profitable like shaman and aquaman. But it was kinda the beginning of the end if we're being honest without aby structure to work to?

By the time they started releasing a new round of terrible disliked films like wonder woman 84. Or bombs like black Adam. Things were over.

Mind you it's clear even from Snyder's era these films weren't doing well so honestly they Should have cut their losses awihle ago? And just rebooted around justice league? The property would be in a way less of a mess if not for that.

Edited by miraculous on Apr 5th 2024 at 3:08:10 AM

I mean personally him needlessly antagonizing Wonder Women and mocking Arthur's powers doesn't make it seem like he is trying to be better and still makes him feel like a jerk but in a different way. He has a similar nicer personality in Snyder's version, but it is clearer that he is the same character but going through and without making him make unfunny jokes and bully his friends.

To give credit where it is do I feel Wheadon's take on Clark is much better and builds off his previous appearances in universe while making the character more like his comic book one.

Edited by Bullman on Apr 5th 2024 at 5:18:54 AM

It's a bit funny to say Justice League caused the series of box-office flops that led to the franchise getting rebooted... when the very next film was Aquaman, which is the highest-grossing DC film of all time and the only one in the DCEU to gross over a billion dollars.

The thing is Bruce doesn't even mock Arthur's powers, he just describes them. "I hear you can talk to fish". Simply knowing about his powers is enough to get a Neck Lift from Arthur for some reason. The film then tries to down play them which in retrospect is hilarious because despite JL trying to serious him his solo film goes full on with the camp and talks to fish thing and it made a billion dollars.

As to Diana he pushes her buttons and it unites the team in defense of her, and he apologies to her immediately because while he's trying to do better, he's still an asshole sometimes.

I like his Superman but I will fully admit the reverence and goodness it ascribes to him and not present or really focused on in Synder's previous films so it seems unearned but it sort of makes sense with Batman's guilt complex causes him to put supes on a pedestal a bit after he got him killed.

Edited by dcutter2 on Apr 5th 2024 at 11:32:07 AM

Sad thing is Justice League had the potential to do billions of dollars and before Marvel did it with Avengers.

On the other hand, they managed to beat Marvel to the punch with Wonder Woman even starting 5 years behind.

And they let Darkseid fight two gods and a Green Lantern instead of having him sit back for three whole movies.

The Snyder Cut actually has the characters be a lot more pleasant to each other, the Whedon version added a lot of quips, snippiness and manufactured drama more like the Avengers films. Despite the overall darker tone the character interactions and humor come across more visually and in quieter moments, such as when Flash accidentally runs into Aquaman.

somehow, the thing i remember most about the justice league movie was that when they got into the plane, cyborg was wearing a hoodie and sweatpants, but when they got out to fight, he wasnt wearing anything (just his normal metal body). I've always wondered how that went down— did he explain it or just start stripping?

sadly the Snyder cut did not expand on that aspect

Edited by Tremmor19 on Apr 5th 2024 at 7:47:49 AM