DC Comics General

We can be sure Alan Moore hates it...

...So I’m glad it’s doing well.

Agreed. Alan Moore bitches about his work being disrespected while turning Dorothy Alice and Wendy into porn characters and having Harry potter piss lightning. As far as I see it he's an utter hypocrite who has NO right to complain.

Issue 12 is the last and 11 is coming out on September 4th.

With all the delays, who knows.

Hey guys, do you know when and why did the writers of Etrigan Retcon the thing so that Jason Blood was a guy bonded to Etrigan instead of being only a human disguise?

I don’t know about that, there’s still the shady business regarding Watchmen’s copyright. Also Alice, Dorthy, and Wendy at least got the right to go into public domain after there creators died and the Harry in League was an expy. I suppose it’s a lukewarm defense but the fact is DC has done Moore dirty in the past and not just Watchmen also his work from ABC comics.

Edited by Bec66 on Aug 15th 2019 at 5:04:40 AM

I mean, I'm well aware he's been done dirty by DC (though the story is somewhat confusing as I don't believe that was their original intention but the runaway success of Watchmen gave birth to greed on their side).

The issue though, is he's been somewhat disrespectful of other creators with some of his statement, to say nothing of his blanket dismissal of any adaptation of his work (including good ones) with the apparent exception of the Justice League version of For The Man Who Has Everything.

I believe some other creators have called him out on it.

Exactly. Moore may have been screwed but he's still a hypocritical piece of shit and for him to complain about his work being disrespected when he cheerfully does the same himself does not make me inclined to sympathize with him.

On it's own merits Doomsday Clock is a fairly good sequel so people rejected it just because of what happened between moore and dc are in my opinion not being fair.

Considering Moore’s beef is the DC execs who made the deal, he really shouldn’t be disparaging creators just because they felt inspired by his works.

I think the issue of him insulting creators was blown out of proportion. Yes he was very dismissive and mean to the creators who profited off his work. I know DC was probably going to do Before Watchmen regardless of who agreed or disagreed but the way DC treats him I can’t say I really blame him for getting so upset.

Maybe I am being unfair to the creators of Doomsday Clock by not really giving the story a proper chance. But my opinion on the matter is I’m not comfortable with it because of the rights issue and I don’t want Watchmen to mix with the DC Universe, I think they’re better off separate.

Edited by Bec66 on Aug 15th 2019 at 5:22:02 AM

Doomsday Book did introduce two new characters that I love: Marionette and the Mime.

I was leary to at first but Johns managed to make a good story and showed real understanding of the source material. That Alan Moore is a colossal piece of shit also helps.

Another problem is that while good Watchmen has problems so hearing its drooling idiot fanboys put it on a pedestal to bash Doomsday Clock just for that is annoying. It's not some untouchable jewel that making a sequel too will besmirch.

Edited by LordYAM on Aug 15th 2019 at 2:34:30 AM

I don’t want to be nosy but has anyone read my previous post?

Maybe I should have used a Joking Mode pothole.

I don't want to turn this into a Moore bashing thing.

I want him to get his fair due for the deal DC made with him, and I also want him to be a bit more respectful to other artists who actual show him respect as well by trying to be faithful to his work when they adapt it.

Basically, keep his beef with DC and don't take it out on others...

...and you know, no more Alice Dorothy Wendy porn...

I mean, you can do one, maybe two, but all three? That's just too much.

Edit: My guess, Justice League had something to do with it.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Aug 15th 2019 at 4:39:19 AM

I prefer Reggie Long aka Rorschach II. Also I really don’t mind Superman killing if it’s in self defense or if there are truly no other options. The idea that all it takes for him to go evil is killing once is cretinous.

A while back I learned about a DC/KFC comic book that put Colonel Sanders into the DC multiverse, "The Colonel of Two Worlds". It also got a sequel.

That’s interesting. Wierd but interesting.

But honestly no I do NOT have sympathy with anyone who bleats about how a sequel tarnishes watchmen. Those people are at best misguided and at worst drooling idiots. As far as I see it Alan Moore is a talented writer but an arrogant piece of shit who lost any claim to the high ground when he made downright insulting reimaginings of certain characters (and no the fact that they were public domain means fuck all). At least when Geoff Johns is writing Doomsday Clock he takes the time to honor Moore’s characters and make the worlds feel the same. Certainly more respectful than putting Dorothy Wendy and Alice in underage porn

I wasn't interested on Watchmen in the first place, so the idea of a sequel is whatever.

So, which characters do you feel are long overdue their own title?

Edited by Blueace on Aug 15th 2019 at 10:49:13 AM

I'd say the current YJ line-up, but that is still a recent thing and some had already historically had their own titles.

Would like to see a series centered on Mime and Marionette post-doomsday, Alan Moore's opinions be damned And I think a miniseries following the World Forger might be interesting.

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Aug 15th 2019 at 7:41:34 AM

I’m not saying people can’t enjoy Before Watchmen or Doomsday Clock based on the history of the comics. But in Moore’s case I feel like he’s been misrepresented. His insults towards creators felt like more at annoyance that they’ using his decades old work to make a profit rather than a new idea. And yes he was rude and his anger probably misplaced but I don’t think that makes his bitterness any less justified since it’s also aimed at the companies that screwed him over in the past.

Here’s an article about the issue so draw your own conclusions:

https://ifanboy.com/articles/jason-aaron-vs-alan-moore/

Alan Moore is the very picture of a Jerkass Woobie. He is a complete ass, but he's also a victim of legal chicanery on a scale rivaling even Bill Finger.

Johns showed far more respect to Moore’s characters than moore ever showed to others and he’s actually trying to honor the spirit (and succeeding) of watchmen. The fact that he made porn starring Wendy Dorothy and Alice (underage porn no less) dampens my sympathy for him. On one hand he isnt hurting anyone but he’s still being incredibly offensive and a tad hypocritical. DC might have screwed him but they are treating his materials with respect and they DID offer the rights back in 2012 which he rejected.

The copyright of characters he used in lost girls is also murky so there is an element of hypocrisy. I’m also annoyed by people acting like watchmen was oh so perfect and didn’t need a sequel (there were flaws in the original and Moore left it open ended). I called watchmen fanboys drooling idiot fanboys for a reason.

Edited by LordYAM on Aug 15th 2019 at 10:09:33 AM

Just finished Abnett's Aquaman run, which was awesome. Is the current run any good?

Shadowpact

Nightshade

Enchantress

Tigress and Cheshire (Based on the YJ versions)

The Milestone characters

Vixen

Black Canary Zatanna Dr. Fate Bart Allen (I know he’s in YJ but a new Impulse series would be cool) Jessie Quick (When is she coming back?)

Most of those already had their own title at some point. Or at least played prominent roles in books like Birds of Prey.