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Discussion of religion in the context of LGBTQ+ rights is only allowed in the LGBTQ+ Rights and Religion Thread.

Discussion of religion in any other context is off topic in all of the "LGBTQ+ rights..." threads.

Attempting to bait others into bringing up religion is also not allowed.

Edited by Mrph1 on Dec 1st 2023 at 6:51:29 PM

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#2776: Jul 28th 2020 at 1:50:04 PM

Hence why I refered to it as "clever".

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
dragonfire5000 from Where gods fear to tread Since: Jan, 2001
#2778: Sep 3rd 2020 at 1:58:12 PM

[up]Ugh. Things like that make me glad that my family's home country of Taiwan is more progressive when it comes to LGBT rights.

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#2779: Sep 14th 2020 at 12:34:49 PM

JK Rowling’s latest book is about a murderous cis man who dresses as a woman to kill his victims

A new book penned by JK Rowling finds her private detective protagonist, Cormoran Strike, investigating a cis male serial killer who dresses as a woman to kill his cis female victims, according to an early write-up.

The first review for Troubled Blood describes it as a “book whose moral seems to be: never trust a man in a dress”.

According to The Telegraph, the “meat” of the 900-page novel is an investigation into a cold case: the disappearance of a woman in 1974, believed to be a victim of a cis male serial killer whose modus operandi is dressing as a woman.

“One wonders what critics of Rowling’s stance on trans issues will make of [the] book,” writes reviewer Jake Kerridge.

Quickly, Troubled Blood was criticised on social media.

Troubled Blood is the fifth entry in Rowling’s Cormoran Strike series, penned under the pseudonym Robert Galbraith.

The second in the series, The Silkworm, has previously been criticised over its depiction of a trans character described as “unstable and aggressive”.

In the book, the woman, Pippa, stalks Strike before attempting to stab him.

After the attack the titular detective manages to trap Pippa in his office, where her trans identity and deadname are revealed. At this point, JK Rowling describes the character’s Adam’s apple and hands, with the Strike character warning her that prison “won’t be fun for you… Not pre-op”.

Trans journalist Katelyn Burns reviewed the passage for them in 2018, writing: “It’s an entirely common though insulting trope about trans women – that they are aggressive and unable to overcome their masculine nature, not to mention villainous – that has become all too common from cisgender authors with only a passing knowledge of trans people.”

Pink News has contacted JK Rowling’s representatives for comment.

Welcome to Estalia, gentlemen.
Zarastro Since: Sep, 2010
#2780: Sep 14th 2020 at 12:44:19 PM

Wow, she is really going off the deep end... .

This answers the question (at least in her case) whether or not someone can seperate the author from his/her books.

Silasw Since: Mar, 2011
#2781: Sep 14th 2020 at 1:07:48 PM

Hopefully this finally pushes the Labour Party to expel her.

XMenMutant22 The Feline Follies of Felix the Cat Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
#2782: Sep 14th 2020 at 1:12:11 PM

To rub further salt to the wound, Rowling has the murderer specifically disguise themself as a Muslim woman.

     Excerpt 
A young woman wearing a hijab was watching them talk from the opposite seat. She had large, sweet, liquid-brown eyes.

"Assuming someone really did enter the house on the fourth, I've got to say a burqa's a bloody good way of getting in and out without being recognized. Can you think of another way of totally concealing your face and body that wouldn't make people challenge you?"

"And they were carrying a halal takeaway?"

"Allegedly. Was their last meal halal? Is that why the killer removed the guts?"

"And this woman -"

"Could have been a man..."

On a related note, Cynthia Nixon's (Sex and the City) latest interview with the Independent notes how "her 23-year-old transgender son Samuel was devastated after hearing Rowling’s views. 'It was really painful for him because so much of his childhood was tied up with Harry Potter.'"

Edited by XMenMutant22 on Sep 14th 2020 at 8:14:35 AM

Kaiseror Since: Jul, 2016
#2783: Sep 14th 2020 at 2:33:25 PM

Was she always like this and we just didn't notice till now?

ShinyCottonCandy Industrious Incisors from Sinnoh (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Industrious Incisors
#2784: Sep 14th 2020 at 2:35:33 PM

[up]There were signs, but the worst of her behavior wasn’t apparent until recently, possibly due to transgender issues not being so visible in the past.

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DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#2785: Sep 14th 2020 at 2:50:12 PM

[up][up] How long has she been writing under a pen name based on a conversion therapist, would be the question, I guess.

Welcome to Estalia, gentlemen.
Silasw Since: Mar, 2011
#2786: Sep 14th 2020 at 3:20:58 PM

I wouldn’t be surprised if she always had some level of bigoted beliefs then got further radicalised online, Twitter is not a healthy place.

Bisected8 Tief girl with eartude from Her Hackette Cave (Primordial Chaos) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
Tief girl with eartude
#2787: Sep 14th 2020 at 4:02:07 PM

[up]This to be honest.

It's tempting to look back on her work and find the transphobia, but she was clearly no more transphobic than any other GenX middle class cishet white person in the 90's (which, to be fair, is still quite transphobic).

But the fact of the matter is, there came a point where she had to decide between being better, and being validated by the hardcore little cult of transphobes.

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smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#2788: Sep 14th 2020 at 4:31:25 PM

Yeah. That reporter lady in Harry Potter was a transphobic caricature, but the openly radical transphobia is only a few years old.

Silasw Since: Mar, 2011
#2789: Sep 14th 2020 at 4:35:31 PM

She was? She always seemed like a caricature of the British press in general, what went over my head?

Honestly Rowling seems like a pretty prime target for online radicalisation, older, has existing trust issues, rather isolated (due to her fame) and with a tendency to spend a lot of time on the internet. But that must be wishful thinking on my part.

Bisected8 Tief girl with eartude from Her Hackette Cave (Primordial Chaos) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
Tief girl with eartude
#2790: Sep 14th 2020 at 4:39:29 PM

Her behaviour as a paparazzi is, but other stuff is rather transphobic. She dresses like a straight person's idea of a drag queen, her hands are described as "mannish", one of the characters discovers she's been disguising herself and blackmails her. Said disguise is a government regulated transformation which she's done off the record.

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AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#2791: Sep 14th 2020 at 5:21:05 PM

[up]x3: Holy crap, I think I missed that. It rings familiar, but I don't quite remember...

[up] Huh. Rita Skeeter as a transphobic caricature. Makes an unfortunate amount of sense.

Edited by AzurePaladin on Sep 14th 2020 at 8:21:53 AM

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#2792: Sep 14th 2020 at 5:38:07 PM

Yeah, as well as comments about a “strong jaw” and shit.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#2793: Sep 14th 2020 at 6:16:26 PM

That's interesting and disturbing/suspicious. To the extent, I had a mental image of Skeeter it was the attractive-looking version from the movies. I'd like to think that the book description is just a general "unpleasant characters are ugly" thing (itself troubling), but given Rowling's currently expressed opinions...

I would also like to think that her pen name is not deliberately taken from the "gay conversion therapy guy". On one hand, she is supportive of gay rights (although as with other terfs, I wouldn't be surprised if that changed). On the other hand, it's kind of suspicious that she says she got the Galbraith name from a supposed childhood imagined identity rather than say John Kenneth Galbraith.

My general sense (hope?) is that Rowling started out as basically well-intentioned and thought of herself as progressive, but had a decent amount of unexamined shitty opinions. Unfortunately, when she was called on them, she started doubling down and since bigots were receptive and welcoming towards her, her views got worse and continued to do so. The same thing happened with Graham Lineham.

I really am curious though why there is such a prevalence of terfs in the U.K.

DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#2794: Sep 14th 2020 at 6:20:02 PM

[up] Honestly, I think at some point we should stop giving a person the benefit of the doubt.

Welcome to Estalia, gentlemen.
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#2795: Sep 14th 2020 at 6:37:48 PM

My general sense (hope?) is that Rowling started out as basically well-intentioned and thought of herself as progressive, but had a decent amount of unexamined shitty opinions. Unfortunately, when she was called on them, she started doubling down and since bigots were receptive and welcoming towards her, her views got worse and continued to do so. The same thing happened with Graham Lineham.

That's the impression I get as well. Perhaps progressive relative to the 90s she got her start in, and the Second Wave Feminism she grew up in, but well, Society Marches On, and rather than update her views to match in a reasoned way she preferred to just opportunistically coast off of the most superficial and haphazard understanding of them. That characters like Hermione and Mc Gonagall incorporated a lot of "girl power" tropes typical to post-Second Wave feminist media makes it a lot less surprising. Lesbianism

My opinion on the Rita Skeeter issue is that it was originally more of a case of casual transphobia (in the sense that trans women are Acceptable Targets seen as ugly and shady, rather than an existential threat) that has since crystallized into a more radical and virulently toxic form.

I would also like to think that her pen name is not deliberately taken from the "gay conversion therapy guy". On one hand, she is supportive of gay rights (although as with other terfs, I wouldn't be surprised if that changed). On the other hand, it's kind of suspicious that she says she got the Galbraith name from a supposed childhood imagined identity rather than say John Kenneth Galbraith.

In my experience progressive-TER Fsnote  tend to be very pro the LG part of LGBT. And many TER Fs are themselves lesbians, especially political lesbians. It's possible Rowling is being radicalized into fullblown rightism, but I'd be more concerned about her understanding of homosexuality being surface-deep and trapped in the 80s than her opposing it outright.

Edited by AlleyOop on Sep 14th 2020 at 9:45:56 AM

AzurePaladin She/Her Pronouns from Forest of Magic Since: Apr, 2018 Relationship Status: Mu
She/Her Pronouns
#2796: Sep 14th 2020 at 6:58:03 PM

British Feminism specifically was largely dominated by the Second Wave, and still is to this day. Rowling picked up a lot of that, including its opinions on femininity and gender identity (ie toxic to some degree with both).

For all her talk on liberation, Rowling's writing has been hostile to women being perceived as too masculine (Pipa and Rita) or too feminine (Dolores). IE Dictating how feminine a woman must be and how she must act to count, ironically what feminism was supposed to fight against.

The awful things he says and does are burned into our cultural consciousness like a CRT display left on the same picture too long. -Fighteer
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#2797: Sep 14th 2020 at 7:46:11 PM

Prescriptive standards of women's behavior (which was responsible for the now-defunct Girls Need Role Models) were indeed one of the major criticisms towards Second Wave activism and later feminist media heavily influenced by Second Wave values, relative to the cultural libertarianism of the Third Wave. Namely the concept that women should have the freedom to be as feminine or masculine as they want; the goal of feminism should be about having the option. I remember countless flamewars over whether fictional women were appropriately Strong Female Characters or not in my LJ days, or real-life women criticizing each other and female celebrities for being bad role models, only dying down as the latter view became more commonplace in the 2010's.

Although, the impression I got from Umbridge's depiction was more about Tastes Like Diabetes and Bitch in Sheep's Clothing than a critique of hyperfemininity itself. Femininity is good but a candy shell can't hide a rotten center. Something Rowling herself should listen to.

Edited by AlleyOop on Sep 14th 2020 at 10:48:32 AM

Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#2799: Sep 20th 2020 at 3:51:12 PM

Not unexpected. The Gender Critical crew keeps trying to frame their bullshit as defending women even as they get into bed with the Heritage Foundation who very much do want to take away women's rights.

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Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#2800: Sep 20th 2020 at 4:30:14 PM

[up][up]Considering the UK Guardian's history of transphobia I am entirely unsurprised. It's sickening to see bigots hiding behind accusations of bigotry.

"Sandwiches are probably easier to fix than the actual problems" -Hylarn

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