Race- Privilege, Relations, Racism, etc.

Not every crime perpetuated across racial lines is a hate crime. If it is, then the word hate crime becomes much less powerful.

Its possible. I have seen some Mexican/Latino folks that are racist. I don't think they have enough evidence though.

Against others or against ourselves?

Now, as a Latino, excuse me but I should continue my search for Where da White Women At? in order to purify my own race.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Nov 28th 2018 at 11:12:46 AM

Both

I'm thinking about how White Villains tend to.get Draco in Leather Pants more than non white ones. Or worse, Non white heroes that got the Ron the Death Eater.

Stuff as Kylo Ren getting more focus than Finn and Poe cited as a example of what I mean.

I ask because today I had a weird dream of how a Blog from a black woman was tearing down a post from tumblr written for.a White Feminist, a post that basically was demonizing my Hispanic/Amerindian Latino MC by saying that he was a "closeted sexist" for daring to feel protective of his Love Interest. It was basically a shitshow of a woman trying to put Latino stereotypes into him while excusing herself with "feminism".

I wonder how and how many that had happened in real fandoms. Non white heroes that got the Ron the Death Eater due to race. Finn from the new SW trilogy is the easy one (sometimes Simplified as a cowardly black man for the fandom).

Dunno.

Kylo would have got pantsed anyways, seeing as how Evil Is Cool and they're going out of their way to try to make him look sympathetic and are probably going to go for the Redemption Arc with him.

I want to say people were just underwhelmed by Poe and Finn's story in TLJ, but there probably is some truth in that racist people are going to feel justified by a "cowardly black man" narrative.

Edited by PhiSat on Nov 29th 2018 at 6:05:01 AM

Charlottesville Jury Convicts 'Unite The Right' Protester Who Killed Woman

https://www.npr.org/2018/12/07/674672922/james-alex-fields-unite-the-right-protester-who-killed-heather-heyer-found-guilt

Sentencing is set to begin Monday. There's also the possibility of Federal hate crime charges, which could bring the Death Penalty into play.

Good

• Pewdiepie just promoted an anti-Semitic channel.
• Thousands of conservative Malays in Malaysia held a rally to protest the government's (now-cancelled) decision to ratify the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination, which would've obligated it to eliminate its decades-old "affirmative action" programs for the ethnic Malay majority.

I’m not surprised at the particular channel that was mentioned with Pewdie Pie - I first saw that channel under related videos when The Last Jedi came out and quickly figured out what it was about. Glad to see he both Felix and that channel are getting exposed for what they are.

Also, where’s a briefer I can find on race in Malaysia? It seems like it pops up frequently regarding race problems.

PDP being anti-semitic (and flirting with the far-right) is nothing new. This is about what I expect from him.

That PewDiePie was nearly universally agreed upon as a joke until 2017 when idiot centrists and obviously conservatives (and worse!) decided he had to be rallied with for his stupidly provocative stunt will never stop amazing me.

Oversimplified summary by an Asian-Australian who's been working in Singapore for a few years and travels across the Causeway on a regular basis:

• Malaysia's population is divided into several ethnic categories:
  • Malays make up ~54% of the population, comprising groups native to the Malayan Peninsula, Sabah and Sarawak (with the state lines drawn across sultanate borders) and immigrants from various Muslim Indonesian ethnic groups. They speak the country's official Malay language^note Plus various regional dialects, and some descendants of Indonesian immigrants still keep their mother tongues. and are constitutionally defined as Muslims. Most states subject the Malay population to the local iteration of sharia jurisprudence, which typically bars apostasy (except in the state of Negeri Sembilan).
  • Orang Asli ("Original People") make up ~14% of the population, and comprises various indigenous and minority ethnicities across the country, with the Dayak/Iban people of Borneo being the largest group. They're legally grouped alongside Malays as part of the "Bumiputra" ("Sons of the Land"), though they speak their own languages and mainly practice Christianity or animism.
  • Chinese people make up ~23% of the population and entered the country in several waves. The pre-colonial communities came as merchants and formed the hybrid Chinese-Malay Peranakan culture, which included a fair few conversions into Islam. The 19th-20th century waves were mainly sent in by the British^note Who, like many colonial powers, preferred to avoid the flow of colonial capital and power into a large indigenous middle class. as miners and plantation workers. The Chinese traditionally speak southern Chinese languages like Hokkien, Hakka, Teochew and Cantonese, and most are educated in Mandarin-speaking "vernacular schools" funded by Chinese foundations. Ronny Chieng from The Daily Show is a Malaysian Chinese.
  • Indians make up most of the rest, mainly consisting of Tamil people from southern India who were brought in by the British both as administrators and indentured workers. The majority follow Hinduism, though Tamil Muslims are a significant minority. Tony Fernandes, the CEO of AirAsia and frenemy to Richard Branson, is a Malaysian Indian with ancestry from Portuguese Goa.
• When the constituent states of British Malaya were in the process of gaining independence in the '50s, there was a widespread perception that the Chinese and Indians were unfairly advantaged due to their urbanised populace and proximity to British rule. This, of course, neglected the fact that most Chinese and Indians were working-class and rural,^note Though their merchant class did control a disproportionate amount of business enterprises. but the people of Peninsular Malaya and British Borneo became divided across ethnic lines and formed race-based parties. The United Malays National Organisation (UMNO) became the country's dominant party, and the British courted its support to defeat the ongoing communist insurgency, which mainly consisted of rural Chinese cadres.
• Race became a wedge issue in the nascent Federation of Malaya when it incorporated the Chinese-majority Singapore.^note Singapore historically belonged to various Malay kingdoms but was ruined and depopulated by multiple colonial conflicts. In 1819, it hosted just over 1,000 people in all, including Malay-speaking indigenous tribes and a small Malay settlement at the mouth of the Singapore River headed by some nobles from the Sultanate of Johor. Raffles got the settlement in exchange for helping out with some succession drama, made it a Crown Colony, and Chinese and Indian settlers poured in afterwards, alongside Malays from the mainland. The UMNO traded blows with the island's multiethnic People's Action Party (PAP), particularly targeting its ethnic Malay members as "race traitors", leading to riots on the island and its eventual expulsion from the federation.
• In 1969, Kuala Lumpur had its own taste of race riots when two Chinese-majority parties won some seats in the country's first post-independence elections. Violence broke out in the capital, killing over a hundred people. The UMNO government identified the root cause as economic anxiety among the Malays and worked on an "affirmative action" program called the New Economic Policy (NEP). The NEP was based on the ideals of "Ketuanan Melayu" ("Malay Eminence") and nominally aimed to eradicate poverty, as well as bring ethnic Malays^note Plus indigenous Bumiputra ethnicities, though they often get dicked over in practice. up to an equal level of economic development. This took the form of preferential quotas in public office, education and finances, as well as government subsidy for various industries to increase the overall size of the pie.
• It... probably worked, I guess? Malaysia now has a decent-sized middle class and practically none of the extreme poverty found in some of its neighbouring countries, and the country is in a much better economic shape (with a lower Gini coefficient) than it was at independence, though it's very debatable just how much of that had to do with the NEP/NDP. Ethnic minorities accept the policy as a necessary evil, albeit at a cost - Chinese and Indian labour became concentrated in the private sector and especially within ethnic in-groups, furthering the country's ethnic divide. Many Chinese communities became isolated enclaves whose residents barely interact with ethnic Malays and only learn the bare minimum amount of the language required to pass standardised exams. And the government (being run by an ethnonationalist party and all) hasn't been great at keeping the forces of Malay chauvinism in check, which is often compounded by fundamentalist Muslim forces in state governments and endemic casual racism across the population.
• All of these resulted in a huge brain drain among the Chinese and Indian communities; IIRC a recent survey of Malaysian Chinese respondents had over half of them expressing the desire to peace out ASAP. Many of them have left for Singapore or the rest of the Anglosphere, though they'll be quick to catch you outside if you ever imply that laksa is Singaporean.

This year, a multiethnic coalition called Pakatan Harapan (Alliance of Hope) toppled the UMNO-led coalition for the first time in history and elected the old authoritarian PM Mahathir Mohammad, who joined the movement as an interim leader to pave the way for the accession of the jailed opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim. One of Mahathir's campaign promises was to ratify the ICERD and work for a more racially equal Malaysia, which unfortunately saw enough opposition from the conservative UMNO base to be cancelled.

Edited by eagleoftheninth on Dec 11th 2018 at 4:51:25 AM

As a Malaysian, thank you for the summary.

And yes, the whole anti-ICERD furor recently and the government caving in to their protests has been disappointing. On the other hand, I suppose ratifying ICERD in practice wouldn't really lead to real changes at the ground level when it comes to race here.

I'm also kinda guilty as charged on the whole "isolated enclave" thing, as I live in an overwhelmingly Chinese area. I still tend to feel uncertain when filling out Malay language government forms. The equivalent situation in America would probably be people living in Spanish-speaking neighborhoods that don't speak much English. At least I've never been accused of being "not a real Malaysian" or something.

All this sounds complicated, but that's the reality of living in a multicultural, multilingual country.

Edited by Alycus on Dec 11th 2018 at 2:12:33 AM

Yeah it's not the first time it's happened in the region .____.

Thanks for the summary, as I probably would have had some difficulty getting a summary on my own.

What I find particularly annoying is the misguided sense of solidarity among YT'ers that I saw when the first PDP controversy hit and life got harder for YT'ers as a result. People were quick to stand up for him, blame the "clickbait media", etc completely ignoring any responsibility PDP himself had in making life shittier for everyone on YT.

He did have a couple people call him out. Jack Septic Eye was one.

But Pewdiepie's shitty ass fanbase harassed Jack until he retracted his statement.

Edited by Wispy on Dec 11th 2018 at 7:21:15 AM

I believe Totalbiscuit also condemned him although I'm not sure what the response to that was.

Likely that he deserved the cancer or something equally horrible. TB was kind of used to that kind of treatment though so I don't think he would of retracted it. Honestly don't remember.

In his case he also never liked Pew Die Pie. I remember that. Jack calling him out was more poignant as they actually were friends. This got Jack a lot of traitor accusations. Because god forbid a friend tell another friend that they are wrong.

Edited by Wispy on Dec 11th 2018 at 7:25:36 AM

The situation about races in Malaysia and by extension because of similarities and distance, Indonesia, is always complicated. This is because culture play a part in it, not just race. It's much more accurate to divide its people as ethnic groups instead of mere races. And even then those ethnic groups can even be divided again by culture and location.

Unlike in the west where most of the times despite all the fighting about cultures, it's always pretty much about races. Of course, that could also be because they see people with physical differences. America is especially bad with this as the fact a lot of them see all the South American people as just Latino or Hispanic.

I must have missed Jack's statement about PDP, but I've honestly felt uncomfortable with the amount of shilling Markiplier's done for him as of late. I like Mark and he seems like a decent guy, but it feels like he's either ignorant of PDP's comments or doesn't care, both of which are bad. I'd consider asking, but I like my Youtube profile to be not flooded with hate mail.

I'm wondering. There any case like Alberto Fujimori in Peru? Where "positive racism" and "model minority" myths ends up harming...the very people that did start and believe them in first place.

Fujimori reach power by marketing himself as a Noble Hard Worker Asian© that was going to lead Peru to Industrialization just like Asia had done. He used almost every single Model Minority Trope to get sympathy, especially by comparing himself againt his rival candidate Mario Vargas Llosa, who was uber stereotypically White.

Fujimori used the "Honest Hard Working Smart Asians" trope to get into power...and we got a corrupt ineffective goverment that got turned into a dictatorship, with death squads killing poor andeans and hospitals forcefully sterilizing woman.

Those andeans were a fairly part of his voting block. They wanted something different to the typically white rulers that we had.

The apathy of the central goverment got turned into downright agression. Hundreds got killed and maimed.

Said this. I still don't deny Fujimori Peruvian Heritage. And I absolutely loathe the "Why Fujimori didn't just open his Chifa restaurant?" discussions. Fujimori was a product of Peruvian culture, and nothing would change it.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Dec 12th 2018 at 9:22:13 AM

To be fair, Fujimori's ancestry being cast into doubt is something of a legitimate issue since the date of his birthday is the same as the day of our independence, something that happens when an inmigrant becomes nationalized, and by law only a natural born Peruvian could hold office.

I mean the stuff as "Fujimori wasn't a product of Peruvian culture, he was a "bad" Asian unlike the "good" asians.