Rename: Thirty Xanatos Pileup

This is yet another article contributing to the misuse/decay of Xanatos Gambit - it even misuses Xanatos Gambit in its trope description to mean "complicated plan." This trope can occur with Xanatos Gambits, Batman Gambits, Kansas City Shuffles, or some combination of the three.

EDIT: Heck, even the page image isn't using a Xanatos Gambit.

Suggest renaming to Thirty Gambit Pileup instead.

edited 14th Feb '11 3:34:55 PM by ccoa

I'm all for this rename, though I get the feeling that it's not gonna be very easy to get the votes to do it when it comes to a vote since I get the feeling a lot of people really like the "Xanatos X" tropes.

The fact that it also covers things that are not Xanatos Gambits should be a pretty good reason on its own.

edited 14th Feb '11 3:35:07 PM by Balmung

But in this case, the change would be minimal, and would still keep part of the source name, just the more indicative one.

Of course, I'm just voicing my concerns as to the success of this. Lots of things I support wind up not happening the way I hoped.

The term "Tactical Cluster Fuck" comes to mind. If you want a name that's more SFW, I'd go with Tactic Train Wreck or Strategy Train Wreck. Or pileup still works. Thirty Tactic Pilup?

I support Thirty Gambit Pileup. It's defined as when a bunch of characters are all running gambits/schemes/plots/plans of some nature and the plans all collide. It's not tactics, really.

edited 14th Feb '11 4:09:54 PM by Madrugada

If the name is too obscure, add redirects for searchability.

The current name is performing exceedingly well with lots of wicks, lots of inbounds, and correct usage. Sometimes, for reasons we may not be able to explain, the unintuitive name works.

If there's a problem here, I'd like to see evidence of it.

edited 14th Feb '11 4:11:30 PM by troacctid

The name is factually wrong?

Anything other than Thirty Gambit Pile Up is pointless though. We have one, jut one, issue with the name and a single word swap out looks like a single word swap out. A full rename means people have to adjust to a new name and recognise it when used in the old names place.

I love the "pileup" name and imagery, so I'm all for a rename to Thirty Gambit Pileup. It's already a redirect, we just need to kill the Xanatos name.

Also, in response to Deboss' suggestions, IMO tactics are part of a gambit, not the gambit itself; thus, I don't think any name that uses "tactic" covers the trope well enough.

edited 14th Feb '11 8:24:24 PM by Willbyr

We can't "kill" the Xanatos name. There are nearly 10,000 links to it on other websites that would be broken if we kill that name. Wikis need inbound links to survive and thrive.

The best we can to is switch out the Thirty Gambit Pileup name for Thirty Xanatos Pileup as the main name and then do a massive, dedicated wick-changing effort across the wiki to get it off all of our pages. And then keep an eye out for new wicks to it and change them.

I didn't mean completely kill the Xanatos name, I just meant take it out of that particular trope...shoulda been a little more specific.

edited 14th Feb '11 8:42:31 PM by Willbyr

I'm not convinced this is where we ought to be directing that kind of concerted effort. There are more productive things we could be doing with a dedicated cleanup project than fixing a bajillion wicks to maybe help make the definition of Xanatos Gambit clearer.

For one thing, I bet we could probably just clean up the definition page for Xanatos Gambit to make it clearer and more concise.

edited 14th Feb '11 8:50:53 PM by troacctid

I agree with this... I mean flat out getting rid of them or redirecting them would cause some massive confusion I think. All for attempting to stop a trope from decaying but the snowclones are not the key to the decay.

edited 14th Feb '11 9:13:48 PM by Raso

It's not just to try to stop that trope's decay, or else we really would be focusing just on that.

So I guess the questions are: how much do Xanatos snowclones contribute to the Trope Decay of Xanatos Gambit, and how much do we mind that the trope name strongly implies that the Xanatos Gambit is the only gambit appropriate for the trope?

Either way, if someone hasn't done so already, someone should definitely fix the part of the description that uses Xanatos Gambit as "complicated evil plan." (I'd do it, but I'm tired and low-morale. :P)

I suggest associating the Thirty Xanatos Pileup with Xanatos Roulette and Xanatos Speed Chess as well (the latter at least, since the Xanatos Roulette title is also under attack), not just the Xanatos Gambit. It's possible because it's called Thirty Xanatos Pileup, not Thirty Xanatos Gambit Pileup. Just about any plan can end up as a Xanatos Roulette in such a situation, after all. And to counter others' plans, you'll need to tweak your plans here and there to have a chance of winning, no? Just like good ol' Xanatos Speed Chess.

edited 29th Mar '11 7:28:20 AM by AhBengI

I am also in favor of a rename to Thirty Gambit Pileup

I agree. It's a bad snowclone off Xanatos Gambit, and Thirty Gambit Pileup perfectly captures what the trope is.

edited 29th Mar '11 12:08:58 PM by Ironeye

I support this &

I like Thirty Gambit Pileup.

So do I.

I'll throw my support behind Thirty Gambit Pileup.

Thirty Gambit Pileup works, although Rogue might be a little sore by the next morning.

• groans* That's horrible Willbyr. You rock.

Thirty Gambit Pileup is a good change. Do we need a crowner?

We absolutely need a crowner.

edited 29th Mar '11 4:56:59 PM by troacctid