During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
I mean, Merra from Tokyo Tribes? Commits mass murder and serial rape because he's jealous his rival is better endowed than him. There's a bit of wiggle room there so long as the villain is treated seriously.
The short version is we got a kiler whose motive is that he hates cat. So he tries to frame a cat for murders he commits. Wanna link to the video ? I mean it's cheesy, and I think it was written to be cheesy on purpose.
edited 18th May '18 5:10:09 PM by Beast
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Gentle Laborer
Exploring video game C Ms, i noticed that SKX from the Condemned duology is included, and i really don't know if he is bad enough to qualify. So i guess it's my first time to make an anti-EP.
Who is Leland Vanhorn? Leland Vanhorn, Serial Killer X, is The Heavy for the first game. A Serial-Killer Killer, Vanhorn targets other criminals like himself. Like all the other enemies in the game, Leland is under the influence of the Oro, a cult implied to be responsible for world-wide crimes; one of their leaders, Oro Dark Primary, is slowly turning Metro City's people into killing machines via supernatural powers. Other Oro members include: The director of the FBI's Serial Crime Unit, the city's mayor, the president of the US and the second game's Big Bad, SCU Agent Dorland. As said by Vanhorn's uncle, Malcolm, Leland was a "good boy" prior to coming in contact with the Oro, showing how he is just one more of their victims. Unable to resist Oro Dark Primary's influence, Vanhorn began targeting serial killers, seeing this as the only positive way to indulge in bloodthristy violence.
With that being said, Vanhorn is not above eliminating police officers in his mission to hunt and kill all serial killers in the city. Malcolm refers to the Oro Dark Primary as "the one behind all this evil"; the reason why he knows so much about the Oro is because both his wife and child were killed by them; the Oro has also assassinated Ethan's parents when he was young. When we find and capture Vanhorn, he points a gun at Ethan and his uncle, but decides to shoot himself instead; the wound would later prove to be non-fatal. In the sequel, Vanhorn has totally succumbed to the Oro, murdering his uncle in the process, and he is now targeting Oro members to know more about them, managing to kill the aforementioned mayor. On one occasion, Vanhorn kills three SCU officers working for the Oro in order to save Ethan; because he wants to know about Ethan's own powers. At the very end of the game, Vanhorn succeeds in joining the Oro, but we don't see anything other than him receiveing metal implants.
Freudian Excuses? Vanhorn was a genuine good person before the events of the game. It is hinted that most of Oro's victims were naturally aggressive before having their minds altered, but none of them were killers; Oro's influence served to worsen their hostility Up To Eleven. In Vanhorn's case, he is a little bit different than other enemies in the fact that he was not a drug addict, his mind was stronger, he really tried to resist, and when he failed, his best option was to kill serial killers to avoid harming innocents. In the first game, Vanhorn affirms that he and Ethan are "on the same path of righteousness".
Heinous? This the most important part of this post. Vanhorn may be one of the most prominent figures in the duology with a large portion of on-screen crimes, but honestly, most of his victims are either serial killers or Oro members, the people responsible for turning him into a madman, along with the rest of the city, and possibly other parts of the world. When he decides to kill those that are not criminals or affiliated with the Oro, it is simply because they were in his way; he kills serial killers with their own methods, some of which are incredibly brutal, and if his victims are not killers or associates of Oro, he gives them a quick death, mostly by fatally shooting them; the only exception is Ethan himself, he cut off his finger and contemplated killing him in a gruesome way, this can be explained by the fact that this happened near the end of the first game, Vanhorn had been influnced by the Oro for a long time, and Ethan's presence only served to stress him even further. Vanhorn's worst act was to experiment on homeless people in the second game with metal implants, but at this point, the man known as Leland Vanhorn was killed when he shot himself in the head, and what remains is another one of Oro's subjects. In other words, Vanhorn may very well be the true victim here.
Conclusion? What you think?
edited 19th May '18 1:46:07 PM by TheMadCr0w
Leaning ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
on Vanhorn.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Yeah, Vanhorn. Good post.
High elves suck.
Vanhorn.
No to Vanhorn unfortunately. But as for hottest villains who count either male or female? I don't show an attraction to evil people who commit atrocities and deserve to brutally die. Either way, why was this a topic that anybody thought was appropriate? It is sort of hilarious but just wondering. Oh, and good job on the EP Cr0w. 
edited 18th May '18 6:38:45 PM by Knack
Even without the heinousness issues, Vanhorn sounds like he lacks agency. Cut.
Good Anti-EP Crow cut Vanhorn
edited 18th May '18 7:35:21 PM by G-Editor
Cut Vanhorn indeed. I'd say Nya is high up on the most...attractive female CM, but given she's Nyarlathotep...
Shin Megami Tensei IV
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
An avatar is still a body. So no issues with that
That is still pretty fucking gross.![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
Rose Armitage is damn cute. I dig her haircut and her sweater. She ditches both when she fully goes into Super-evil Mode, though.
I like Freeza. I may have weird tastes.
Cut Serial Killer X, he ultimately doesn't stand out in the world he's in.
And axe Vanhorn.
Most attractive CM? Come on, you guys. The Bishop
◊ is clearly the sexiest beast to have ever passed this thread.
Naw, b. Incognito
the one who really thuggin'.
edited 18th May '18 7:56:23 PM by 43110
The Unknown Unknown
Ya'll funny.
Vahorn.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
I actually like the abs.
And yeah, Rose is cute but then she does lose it when she starts acting openly evil (which is sad, I love cute female evil villains)
Watch me destroying my country
Must be the lips.
Also, as Ravok reminded me...Chantique from the Knights of the Old Republic comic, multiple Cutie Honey villains, Elimona from Defense Devil, Isuzu and Isabela from Freezing, Arba from Magi, Selene form X-men, Salome from Conan...
I don't mind that people have (sometimes weird) tastes but how did this actually become a topic.
As a note, found a bit of a bad typo in an entry....
- God Is Dead: Satan himself kicks off the plot by murdering God, and settles back to enjoy the resulting chaos as pagan gods swoop in and turn Earth into a battlefield that kill billions of humans. Enslaving Hades as a lackey while regularly sleeping with his wife Persephone, Hades engineers far more death and destruction while also awakening the immortal dragon that finally resets reality, killing everything that lives in retribution for Satan's misdeeds but not before eating Satan to share its belly with Jesus for thousands of years. Satan tricks Jesus into recreating the Gods, and later shoves him into a volcano to burn forever upon their escape. Satan then engineers a new conflict so he can attack God and kill him again, content to die having achieved everything he ever wanted.
Shin Megami Tensei IV
Dear God (see what I did there) , that typo was bad
edited 18th May '18 8:20:02 PM by KazuyaProta
Watch me destroying my country
And as I try to pass the next two weeks, I'm also wondering just how far stupidity can go as a motive that we can take it seriously.
I only ask because I've been binge watching shorts from Crypt TV (which I recomend checking out). The only problem is that so far the only possible potential candidate I can find has an incredibly stupid motive and is featured in one of theiir shorts that has a deliberately cheesy premise (although there's another that's part of an ongoing series). Another problem is the world this channel seems to be setting up in some of its shorts...is a little crapsack.
Another bump in my road is a villain from an ongoing fanfic I'm reading. But despite already the Moral Event Horizon, the stories still ongoing and right out of the blue breaks the rules of fanfic discussions on this thread. But I'll give it points for being one of the few I've seen handle its subject matter maturally.
edited 18th May '18 4:38:10 PM by Beast
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."